Rock ‘n Roll Ghost S16 E01 - actor Penelope Ann Miller (Reagan, Carlito's Way, The Freshman)

[Music] all right welcome back to the rock and roll ghost podcast this week we have actor Penelope Anne Miller who is starring as Nancy Reagan in the feature film Reagan uh du out August 30th with uh Dennis Quaid set the Stars uh our President Reagan uh Penelope it's a real pleasure having you today I'm I'm hoping you're doing well thank you I am doing well um and it's nice to be here and nice to meet you and thanks for having me yeah um I have to admit this is this is a kind of a big one me a friend when I told a friend of mine that I had booked you he was like you know he was very happy because we're both such good you know huge fans of yours a I really appreciate that so thank you all right well let let let me I'll get into some other things but I'd like to talk about uh Reagan first yeah um how did you first get involved and what were your initial thoughts on playing someone that everyone knows yeah well my initial thought was fear um I I I actually it was combination I think it was it was exciting and scary um obviously she's Nancy Reagan is Iconic and when you're playing somebody that's historical and iconic and most people know uh at least unless you're really young I guess but um but you she's famous and she's well known and she's part of our history and people obviously um are going to make the comparisons and then can't am I up for the task can I embody her Essence and her Persona and somewhat look like her and all this stuff so um but I was excited for the challenge and as an as an artist that to me excites me I love to challenge myself and I love to to show diversity in my work and show that I'm able to transform and that's part of the fun part about being an actress um or an actor is is to be able to embody all these different characters and that people may not see you that way and then suddenly they're like oh she can do that yeah so I I just embarked on an enormous amount of research um but I knew the director Sean mcamera I had done a movie with him that nobody saw called Robo Sapien about a little robot we filmed it in New Orleans and uh years ago uh my second daughter wasn't even born but anyway we had a great relationship and and had a lot of fun on the film um and I heard about this movie through some mutual people I knew and uh heard they were making it and then I heard Sean was attached to direct it and so I mentioned it to my my manager who then reached out to Sha's agents to say you know would you consider Penelope for the and I heard Dennis was attached so that's sort of how it sort of started so I kind of put The Feelers out and then Sean thought it was a great idea and then I met with Sean and the producer um and then uh and then they ranted by Dennis and Dennis had been a fan and and so the rest is history so I got the role but I I embarked on enormous amount of research I had to um I read about six books possibly um her own biograph autobiography called it's my turn which was my Bible and um and then of course a lot of interviews and then talking to people that knew her and worked with her so that was kind of the the history about how it how it all began um three week three wigs later and getting the outfits right and the look right and um just really capturing your essence I didn't want to do an imitation kind of where I was like playing a characterization I just wanted to capture her her Essence essentially so I think if people sense that they almost can buy maybe I don't look exactly like her etc etc but I hope I did her justice I figure H I owe it to her Legacy uh no matter what you know political aisle you're on I don't think it matters it's like that's what we do as artists we play all different characters and um and that's and that I I feel like I I owe it to her to to do her justice she was the person who existed in this world and is well known so I hope I hope I did a good job did you meet with anybody that was close to her uh to to talk about her or was the there's basically a treasure Trove of information and out there and video and everything so it's not not she wasn't she was definitely in the spot like more than a lot of first ladies at at that time were yeah well and because of her special relationship with Ronnie or Ronald Reagan uh she called Ronnie um they were so tight um I mean even her daughter said they were two hals of a circle and the hard part is not a lot of people could penetrate that Circle um but I think he so trusted her and it wasn't like she was you know there was rumors she was running the show which she absolutely wasn't but they had this Bond and this trust and he would talk to her about stuff and she she kind of had to be I mean look they both were actors so they weren't in the political like world so they kind of had to like learn while doing it and um and she just I think she was just incredibly devoted and protective and wanting him to do well and believed in him and he just imp trusted her implicitly so uh she was just a there was just really no Ron Ronnie without Nancy and everybody says he probably wouldn't have been Governor he wouldn't have been president if it wasn't for her and she was there to support him and um and I think that's why she was so much more in the Forefront is because he also really loved her and appreciated her and so he really he also wanted her to to be seen and be there and be part of his world um so I think that's why yeah she's probably one of the better known first lest she wasn't she wasn't as much in the background as some of them yeah um which which which can work for you or against you I mean she was kind of vilified as a first lady at the time and you know people said she was manipulative or a dragon lady and and you know it's interesting when a man's behind a woman she's considered manipulative and devious or uh you know the puppet master or whatever and with a man behind a man it's a strategist so it's just interesting the way it's viewed um and I think because she was strong and powerful and had opinions and very protective she may have been misperceived and misunderstood yeah I feel from what I read no that I mean that that could very well be I I personally my I mean I I don't really have a whole lot past uh the just say no uh Campaign which there was that I I have to admit I mean I just you know as somebody that didn't really ever do anything I still thought well this is never gonna work I just it was a nice it was a nice effort but oh did just say no yeah I just like I just you know I I think the cat was out of the bag by that point and it also and and being somebody that does know you know knows about history and politics it what we ended up finding out about the administration with you know drugs in in Colombia and then the just say no it just seemed like it was you know kind of hypocritical in my opinion but you know that's politics I guess yeah well look she tried and she did the best she could in terms of that and whether it worked or not um you know at least she was she was making the attempt to get kids no I know I'm just thinking of the smartass you know 15 well there always cynical ones so you know we're prepared for that yeah but I I think there's still room to get to know somebody in in this Cas absolutely look I didn't know I didn't know a lot about her either and and you know I the way I grew up too was a very different background than than what their politics were and um and I didn't think it was as divided then people could actually talk to each other um as it is now but um I think there was a lot I did end up really admiring about her and what she went through and um and knowing that because being in the public eye like that she was going to get you know the magnifying glass and be attacked and and I think she suffered quietly I mean when you read her book um you see that that she said she cried a lot of the eight years that she was there because she didn't she was she you know she was attacked a lot um and criticized and that's part of the job I guess um but I I I I have to say the people that I did speak to and I know that was one of your questions Sheila Tate was her press secretary and um she really admired her and respected her and they had a wonderful relationship and then she wrote a book called lady in red which is great I spoke to her quite a bit um you know so the a lot of people that I spoke to in in her Circle nobody really did say negative things about her so that's to me a testament to who she was as either a boss or uh somebody that was working under her um I I feel like they really admired and respect her and that to me says a lot yeah yeah know I get that and I I think your your point about uh her being more of a presence in uh the ad not so much the administration but as his confidence all that I think that you know let's be honest sexism isn't anything new and it certainly wasn't like that then so yeah no exactly and um I mean it's still you know the misogyny still exists and being marginalized because you're a woman and um she had all that she had to Grapple with all of that um but like you said it's nothing new right what um what was the most surprising thing that you found either about her or about your performance in the film um I didn't you know you kind of when you my image of her and I'm sure a lot of people are is that she was kind of cold aloof maybe not that friendly and when I did speak to people when I read about her and when I found out more about her she actually had a great sense of humor I mean Ron Reagan was pretty dang funny and he was always making jokes and telling jokes and so he was very charming and they called him the great communicator and all of that but she had that side too I think she just didn't show it and I think that was more of a protective uh mechanism for her um of of not showing that side of her maybe she was afraid that it would make her not appear um as important or as strong or um maybe too vulnerable um but there there was that s and then their love story I didn't realize how great their love story was I I when I found out about um how that happened and how it grew and how he wrote her love notes almost every day and she wrote a published a book called I love you Ronnie of all of his love notes from when their from their courtship throughout their marriage um I was really Blown Away by that by their love story it's pretty incredible um you don't see a lot of marriages or Partnerships like that to be honest um from what I've gathered in my my years but uh he was very romantic and very sentimental and um you know they had a really cute relationship so I appreciated that so that was kind of I guess one of the the surprises um and that she was a very compassionate woman and would stayed very loyal to the people that she had worked with who were no longer working with her she stayed really close with them and another person who worked the administration Mark Weinberg he stayed close to her also their humble beginnings that they never had money they were around a lot of wealthy people but they were I mean even in the White House like you you're getting you get a stien like you have to pay for your food and St like that other than when you're hosting like a big you know event but um I didn't realize all of that and they lived in kind of modest homes and then he worked for GE before you know as you know before he became governor um because as the SAG he was the SAG president but he was um and he was de you know as you know he started out as a Democrat as well yeah um so I think um he you know they really had to work a bit to because even his acting career was kind of he was struggling after his marriage with Jane Wyman fell apart and he was getting more politically involved with the union and and then it kept going from there but I didn't realize that they live so sort of humbly I kind of even their Ranch have you been to their Ranch the Reagan Ranch no in Santa Barbara I mean it's teeny yeah te it's so modest like you cannot believe these weren't they weren't really extravagant people I mean she wore designer clothes she was a fashion icon but she uh so they presented themselves like that but they weren't like that I mean he worked he built all the fencing on that ranch I mean it was kind of impressive yeah yeah now it's there's there's a lot there's a lot about the you know about them I didn't know about at the time that you know I I found out over the years um before I forget what was uh working with Dennis like uh as your main co-star uh it was it was great I mean it was lucky that we got along so well and um had a great Rapport because being the couple that Ronnie and Nancy were we had to have chemistry and you can't you can't fake chemistry it has to just be there or not there and luckily Dennis and I uh got on extremely well I think we really understood that this relationship was was so important uh to the movie and to the story and to their lives and um and we had a real playful banter I mean he called her Nancy pants we found all these Nicks names that he called her and we incorporated things like that in the movie and um and and you know to the St he still calls me Nancy pants so we had a very playful fun um mutual respect uh when we work together and I think similar quality in how we worked and um so I was I was very grateful that that that I I think the chemistry really works in this um and that relationship really works in the film and I think it's thanks to probably the relationship that Dennis and I would had or have yeah well that's great oh excellent um you know one of because I I my first time seeing you anything was adventurers and babysitting I'm pretty sure that was like my first movie yeah you me from way back when yeah yeah so and that used to play when it was on cable it used to play on a loop in my house because my brother and sister Absolut I mean I liked it too uh I I had a extreme crush on Elizabeth Shoe at the time um okay sure why not yeah I had one on you later um I played the nerdy best Brenda so I really wasn't the looker in that movie no but you you could not be attractive well it's okay I don't mind it was fine um I auditioned for the Elizabeth Shoe role first and they already had her in mind she'd already auditioned for Chris Columbus so I think they were thinking of her for the lead and so I knew there was the best friend role which was the same age and I thought well can I audition for her too and so I basically had to um when I went back in to prove that I could play the character actors I put glasses on I made my hair all sort of stringy and and greasy and then I wore an Overman siiz uh man's shirt and sweatpants I mean I just looked I made myself look you know not as much of the the Anu let's put it that way so I wanted to be the character best friend and I won the rle so that was that was lucky for me yeah because that movie did really well nobody expected it to but it became a Runway hit yeah that was the Box yeah 87 yeah yeah yeah way back when I know still people still talk about it I think it has a real cup following yeah well it probably helps I I think uh even though Columbus had a few more bigger movies after that um that was his first so it was yeah but it helps that I think it that helps you know the fact that he made these huge movies that you know that it kind of keeps getting because people watch well if you watch this you like this or something maybe it gets thrown in and then people it just kind of gets picked up for a new generation yeah yeah it's um it's funny how people still talk about it today how much they love that movie um and I was saying it got the box office like just kept building it kept getting higher like every weekend it kept going up which is Al really unusual because I think the word of mouth um because nobody knew we were all newcomers including Chris Columbus so it's kind of cool yeah yeah I mean Elizabeth was in Karate Kid but I mean uh that's she ended up making it into the second one so well none of us did did we I don't think was who was the oh I was thinking of Kindergarten Cop they did no no no no I meant yeah correct no I know you meant I was about to say somebody else but I think it wasn't even anybody from the original cast right yeah there was at one yeah there was like the third or fourth or fifth I don't know okay there was some one that didn't make any you know didn't have anything uh it's kind of like Leonard skinnard now but uh one of my favorite movies yours uh well I have two in particular but was the Freshman oh wow yeah and that was that was at that point I kind of a a different character for you cuz you were kind of like the nice girl you know not that she wasn't the nice girl but you know but she was sassy she had a little bit of an edge yeah yeah and also I mean you look at me I'm pretty waspy um and I was doing our toown on Broadway which is a very waspy role um and the fact that they cast me as Marlon Brando's daughter who is an Italian mafia princess from Long Island yeah nobody would look at me and think that I could do that once again hence now the Nancy Reagan of it all but that was what was really exciting and challenging for me and I when I went in luckily I was wearing a wig in the play I dyed my hair I well I put a rinse in my hair made it dark I wore this sort of leather kind of outfit I talk with the you know Long Island accent and kind of like showed them that I could do it and uh you know subtle but enough um and and luckily I'd also worked with Matthew bradick in bxy blues which I'd also did in the play right right the movie that Mike Nichol directed um so he and I had a good rapport and we obviously had chemistry so that helped um but yeah I was so grateful to get that role and that's one of my favorite movies of course working with Marlon Brando was just like a dream come true yeah and then getting to work again with Matthew and then Bruno Kirby and then the the character was so much fun I love doing comedy I wish I did more to be honest because you're mentioning two comedies that I did yeah yeah yeah no that's uh that's ABS I remember I I hadn't seen it in a long time and I ended up watching it like two times in in two days it's fun movie sear it out that's another cult classic that people continue to watch yeah yeah yeah Andrew uh Bergman right yeah yeah he made some really good comedies uh they weren't they weren't like huge you know gafas all the time but they were really smart and character-driven which I always liked yeah um what what was it like working with uh Brando uh it was it was incredible he was so fun and funny and warm and lovely to me and um had a great sense of humor as well which I didn't expect I mean you sort of think of him as this brooding reclusive um which is's eccentric um but he he loved it he had a great time he was spoofing himself from The Godfather as you know yeah and I think he just got such a kick out of it and um really I think enjoyed doing a comedy as well and he wasn't acting that much in his career at that time so there was always this fear he wasn't going to show up but yes I thought you know I'm gonna take my chances um and when he showed up on the we were on we filmed some they filmed some of it in New York and then the rest of it in Toronto and uh when he showed up for rehearsals um he was like an hour late and we were all just going stir crazy we were at Andrew bugman's um apartment or condo that that he staying in at the time and he walked in the door and he was wearing a powder blue velour jumpsuit and I was just like oh my gosh this is not theage I this guy so I was like H okay this is no street car you know the yeah you know biker jacket or the rolled up t-shirt or whatever but um he was he just gave me a big bear hug and he's like you're my daughter you know but he was like that the rest of the movie and he loved hanging he loved artists he loved actors he'd invite us into his trailer he talked to us about acting he one night I was at dinner with Matthew and Bruno at a at a restaurant called oros which was kind of a fancy restaurant and we feel these pellets getting thrown at our table it was Matthew Bruno and I and we were sitting at this table and we feel these pellets on the back of our head and we turn around and it's Marlon Brando throwing bread balls at us and he's sitting with the grips and the electricians I mean he really loved the crew and yeah appreciated them and would take them out to dinners and then he ended up throwing our wrap party because at the time TriStar said we'd run out of money and they couldn't afford the rap party and he said well the party is not for us the actors it's for the crew who don't get to celebrate their hard work and so he threw the rap party and paid for it and it was black tii it was at the Gourmet Club um we had fire eaters magicians belly dancers I mean he went all out wow yeah so he was a pretty amazing guy yeah I don't know if I've spoken to someone that's worked with Brando before so this could be a very well could be a first um but there were two actually two other movies um and uh I wanted to talk to because I know I'm running out of time but uh you filmed well you filmed adventures and babysitting I think somewhat in Chicago um it was set in Chicago also in Toronto yeah that Toronto was substitute some everything was in Toronto for a while yeah um some of it was filmed in Chicago some of the main exteriors but primarily we were in we were in Toronto yeah it's from Chicago I believe so I think that was why it yeah that's not surprising either yeah uh but you made uh about a decade later you made The Relic here uh in Chicago with Tom cisor and you know it's kind of a it's a I enjoyed the movie but and I haven't seen it since but it's it's you know it does its job well it's a it's kind of a yeah I'm was scary yeah it did well too it I remember it debuted number one yeah yeah it did really well um Gail an herd was our producer okay um Peter heims was the director Gail's grg worked Gail a few times um but it was um yeah it was you know to do a I don't think I've ever done like a sci-fi horror movie before so that was the first for me playing a scientist was the first but we did film a lot of it in Chicago and I really enjoyed that City and we got to film in the museum and then right tours the back of the museum um the place where most of it all the research is done and that was quite uh fascinating and interesting um and we did have sets that we we filmed out in LA but um a Paramount so um yeah that was a big deal that was a big role for me and the movie did well so that was good well I want the reason why I brought it up is I wanted to I I um got to know Tom seore pretty well uh and I was pretty upset when he he passed um but what was your experience like working with him I know that that might have been a difficult time for him so I'm just interested yeah I think he was going through a lot then um I mean we luckily got along really well and nothing affected me but I think he was going through stuff then and yeah um and I think he was up and down and but but by and large as far as like the work environment and us working and doing our job I mean that and getting along we you know we we got along but I think you know he had obviously a lot of drug problems um which is sad and um I know um he's he had a lot of struggles but he did you know he did well in the film and um and his his now ex-wife is one of my best friends really yeah Ma quinland she's an actress okay which which I I know he's married more than once uh which which marriage was that it was her name's mave um it was then he met her he was that was his girlfriend at the time oh okay so it was probably the first and they married right after the movie yeah gotcha yeah yeah they were that that did not end well no U well you probably know more than I do then yeah I do I'm going divulge everything I know no no no I'm not asking you to I'm just saying I now that I'm catching up to speed here I realizing you do know more about it than than I do um well the last one I want to ask about and it's it I still remember going to the theater to see this um and because the theater is amazing uh it was this big old you know Palace kind of thing with a curved screen and red red reclining chairs which was years before anything but uh Caro's way oh wow what theater was that uh it was out in uh out in the suburbs of of Chicago amazing yeah the place is no long I live out this way now and the place they raised the whole thing it was one of the most beautiful Cinemas I'd ever been but it also makes me always remember Caro's way and that had to be a big moment for you too to work work with Al oh my gosh yeah um you know and Sean Penn both of them um I admired so much as actors and and then Brian deama um the whole package was incredible um you know even vgo Morton said had a smaller role in it there were so many great actors in that movie yeah um but that role was something once again that I don't think people would initially think of me for and originally when I actually read for it I read for uh the producer Marty bregman I gotta get them because there's Andrew Bergman and Marty bregman Marty bregman and Brian deama and when I first audition they thought you know I did a really great job but that I was maybe to too nice or too much of a good girl to play this woman who was a dancer slash stripper and um you know had a little bit of an edge too and luckily alpacino had seen me in a movie called other people's money and really loved me from that and because the callbacks were read auditions with him and I think when he saw my name or had seen that my name had been there he requested and asked that I be able to read with him which yeah I was over the moon because first I got sort of rejected and then I was brought back suddenly so that was a lucky break for me and thanks to Al I owe a lot to him to have me back because I think once we read together it just everything changed and that happens a lot when you get to read with an actor opposite them you know they're they're going to raise the level of your game and um and then we had chemistry and all that which was very important but I had to go through a whole riom roll I mean I had like screen tests they flew me to New York I mean it was like oh my gosh I had to dance to do a lot but I got the role and it was to me one of my favorite roles I've played and freshman's another one and um I just I was nominated for a Golden Glow I mean it it really put me on a map in a certain way of people considering me in in a different way and and it was a great role I mean um it just had a lot of depth and and it was emotional and it was um um you know the relationship between between Alan and I was that whole storyline was great and yeah I was thrilled absolutely thrilled to be a part of it um and to this day I think it's another one that I think is a kind of a cult has a cult following for sure yeah it it got a uh I guess I think Arrow put out a uh collector's edition that I really want to get uh of it I've got it on probably DVD and I've probably got it on video on me too you like you know it's one of those movies I just really loved that I thought it didn't get the fair shape because it was such an amazing movie and I agree and you you were really good in it too I mean thank you I really en you you were somebody that if I saw you were in a movie I I knew I was going to at least enjoy something about the movie so oh that's so lovely of you to say that means a great deal really it does yeah I that's why you want to go see Reagan right right Reagan coming out August 30th uh thank you very much for taking the time I probably could have asked you another you know half hour's worth we'll have another one we'll do this again okay all right great all right well you have a good rest of your day thank you for having me appreciate I appreciate it so much and um yeah go see I'm very now curious what you're gonna think of the the movie yeah I'll have to check it out August 30th August 30th Day weekend all right and you can buy tickets real quickly on Reagan mov.com or reagan. mov and you can I'll include it yeah I'll incl that the link maybe my publicist can send that to you too yeah okay or the trailer whatever okay all right love thank you so much thank you all right bye