An hour with John Waters

you can see the career of John Waters is kind of like a train I'm sure he would make something delightfully obscene out of that idea but what I mean is you get on it at certain points right and maybe you got on it right at the beginning with pink flamingos maybe you joined a little bit later with something as borderline innocuous as hairspray or maybe you got on someplace else the point is he is not only gifted and funny and shocking but also a very thoughtful person his writing is Maybe But ultimately does distinguish all of his work except for the visual art part of that he's got a new novel out it's called liar mouth a Feel Bad Romance his first novel ever that was an occasion to get him to have a fulllength conversation with me on this show so that's what you're about to hear you're about to hear John Waters I'm sure he's been asked every question before but he's still pretty delightful about answering them [Music] hi one of the things I've always believed about this show is that it works best when I can get people to talk their natural way of talking now with John Waters there's certain risks to that strategy and in fact he did use some colorful language if you're listening on the radio it's going to be bleeped we're not going to let you hear it if you're listening on the podcast then it's unbleeped and you will hear it and the good news is that everybody radio audience and podcasts gets to hear about anal bleaching you're welcome [Music] pack it up pack it in let me begin I came to win battle me that's a sin I won't ever slack up Punky better back up try and play the role and you're the whole crew will act up Get Up Stand Up come up throw your hands up if you got the Feeling jump up touch the ceiling Ms a f someone's [ __ ] junk I'll bust them in the eye and then I'll take the punks out feeling funing amp in the chunk and got more RS than this cops got a donkey donut shop show up I got Ro from the kids on the H with my mom and my Pops I came to get down I came to get down so get seat around that is the only reason I can imagine to play Jump Around by house of paint that being the fact that we have John Waters on the show today and you have to read his book liar mouth to understand liar mouth sub peddled a Feel Bad Romance to understand why we might be playing such a song on this particular show but John Waters welcome to the show thank you thanks for having me and it was great you played that song because that's in the book definitely yes yes absolutely but they have to they have to buy the book and read the book yes understand well there is a there is a radical trampoline movement in the book that is must be motion addicts at all times so that is a song that they play a lot so um there's so much to talk about but we're excited I I I hope if I have to explain to this audience who John Waters is that I feel that something's very wrong so I'm going to assume that everybody knows exactly who you are the book by the way I don't believe in trying to fool anybody we're actually recording this interview a little bit of time before the book comes out so when you hear it though you now have the opportunity to go and buy liar mouth so I want to start by saying that you you had a birthday about a week ago I think from when we're talking right now I think that makes you 76 you could be coasting right now you seem like you're working really really hard is that just something that you can't help doing yeah it kind of is and I enjoy my work you're right I'm 76 that's going on 80 I mean 76 I'm not going to be middleaged I'm not gonna live to be 152 no matter how much of an optimist I am so I just think old chickens make good soup and I don't know I just keep I just keep going I love to go to work I love to tell stories and I think you only get one life so I'm here to to meet as many people tell as many stories as I can on the very limited time I have on this Earth given your uh rigorous program of diet and exercise and your strict avoid avoidance of tobacco products I think you should be fine you're probably good for another 50 years I know I I did a spoken word show the other night and one of the questions I misheard and I thought they asked me I thought I have never been asked that question someone said how did you avoid cancer and I thought that I quit smoking that's the only thing I could think of to say but what they said was how did you avoid being cancelled so that was a normal question although though I do remember correct me if I'm wrong I have this I I looked for this clip today and I couldn't find it but I have this dim memory of you in one of your many appearances on late night television and you were talking about visiting a friend in prison I assume that was Lesly van hton but you didn't say in this particular thing and you talked about the fact that you got there this is when you were still smoking and I think you said that you weren't just a smoker you said I am a cigarette and then you talked about how how disappointed you were that you couldn't smoke in prison cuz that's kind of a thing right well cigarettes used to be money in prison but you can't smoke in prisons anywhere and I don't remember which prison that was I have many friends in prison that I visited over the years but I taught in prison for a long time too so um I think I might have said I am a cigarette on the David Letterman show because I did smoke five packs a day the only thing I regret in life it's really the only thing I regret and if you still smoke you're really stupid and um I write down every single day I have not had a cigarette in 7,054 days anybody get a match thanks there's uh no smoking in this building Mr TRL what are you going to do charge me with smoking got a life yes Mrs mson it is so crowded and yet so lonely isn't it how did you know you smoke too much I've noticed only frustrated people smoke too much and only lonely people are frustrated so you know I have never smoked a cigarette in my life but I have this odd thing where I like watching people smoke in movies and on television like in in House of Gucci Lady Gaga Lady Gaga smoking was very entertaining to me but you can always tell actresses and actors that don't really smoke in real life totally because I just saw Patty Leone in company on Broadway and she smokes and you could tell she said later I still smoke you can tell fake even if you're the best actress in the world I don't believe it when Merl Street smokes because I don't think she ever did and so I know it's really hard and as an ex-smoker and I hate to hear people talk about their addictions I think it's better than you get rid of all of them but I was I smoke five packs of King cools at the end I think menthal aren't they trying to make him illegal they should make illegal but uh it was the only thing ever when I was young they used to have ads that said doctors recommend cools what doctor recommended cools so I guess it is something that I regret but in movies it's crazy the Motion Picture Association for a while wanted to give all movies that had cigarettes and our rating and I thought well so they're gonna wipe it out like movies about the second world war every single person smoke they're gonna take that out that's crazy for for historical uh movies H have cigarettes on but they kind of do that now I every once in a while I'll be watching a movie set in the 40s or the 50s I'm about eight years younger than you are eight and a half years younger so I grew up in the same era and I'm thinking well nobody's smoking in this this is really weird yeah I hated I never put people smoking in my movies because of the continuity nightmare you cut back and if you want to cut two lines of dialogue their cigarette is 10 pffs shorter than it was in the shot right before that's the reason I never had any character smoke in my movie because of continuity hello I'm John Waters and I'm supposed to announce there is no smoking in this theater which I think is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard of in my life how can anyone sit through a length of a film especially a European film and not have a cigarette but don't you wish you had one right now and I'm telling you that smoke anyway it gives ushers jobs and if people didn't smoke there would be no employment for the Youth of today so once again no smoking in this theater so let's talk about writing a novel because this is the first time you've done that you've written other books and I know that you've said in the past that in a way everything you do is about writing or starts with writing this must be like writing a movie and then not having to worry about cigarette continuity well it's two different things it's something you don't have to worry about special effects you don't have to worry well you used to not have to worry about sensors but these days there're sensitivity editors but the difference is budget-wise you don't have to say oh that would cost like $50 million in special effects to do this or anything but then there is continuity because you have to go through the whole book and copy it editors are the continuity people in uh in a novel because she has on clothes she has to have on the same clothes when she takes this off she and she steals so many different outfits in the book that it's hard to keep up with it and and it has to be believable it has to be even in this world that I've set up that is completely insane there are still rules of what people will believe if they accept that Universe you have to make it realistic in that Universe no matter how crazy it is John Waters you are not telling me that a sensitivity reader or sensitivity editor went through this book are you because there's no sign that that Happ here's what happened here's what happened they do have this thing and it is the most appalling thing I've ever heard of sensitivity imagine them looking at pink flamingos or any of my other films even hairspray so we did send it to one I had to and they R and return the Publishers calls afterwards so I guess that was a bad review although I did go through it with my editor my agent and the four women that work for me of all different ages and we did go through it as our own version of a sensitivity editor of what is funny and what you can get away with and since this book does make fun of political correctness in a way even though I think I am politically correct in a Twisted way we did change things by making it more politically correct so it would be ludicrous and funny this novel involves a protagonist name Marsha sprinkle no relation to Annie that we know and she she's a scam artist she has a partner Daryl they are scam artists and a lot of this starts with the whole idea of stealing Luggage in airports knowing that for a previous book you dropped LSD and hitchhiked a long distance I found myself wondering did you do any of the things that you write or you must have had to logistically at at least figure out how some of these these griffs would actually work yes definitely did I do any of them no I yes I did in the beginning Daryl goes into a department store with a ripped tennis shoe and says he rips it on the escalator and demands money I did that in the 60s yes sometimes two a day and it it works it probably still works but the worse is when they try to get you a new pair of tennis shoes yeah darl darl gets $200 that's pretty good yeah well now are you kidding tennis shoes are a thousand and then while I was traveling all the time because I'm always in airports I did watch and figure out how to do certain scams I guess the idea came from I have had I was with Pat Moran my dearest friend and one she did pick up the wrong suitcase because they all look alike and we're going up the escalator and the man's running after us and it does happen and it would be easy to do and I'm just am mad that they don't have a security person there anymore like they did for 40 years everything else got stricter and security after 9911 but after 9911 for some reason they don't have anybody check your luggage tag when you leave the carousel like they used to why I don't know perfect time to steal luggage yeah I no I had my luggage walked away with in that way too and I just was yeah the I was imagining the extreme disappointment I got it back but uh I mean they didn't want but it happened accidentally no actually it yeah it was accidentally Mara goes in with a fake chaffeur which would really work yes you clearly thought through a lot of this stuff uh and and how to pick off somebody in a TSA line so that you can get their purse and all this stuff no one's ever going to trust you again around any form of transportation no I'll probably be on a hot list next time I when the book out every time I step in an airport the security will come out so we're back in Baltimore too and it would be disappointing if this weren't in Baltimore but I want to talk a little bit about what the city means to you it's your home obviously I feel like it's also a place there's so many things now like you go to New York and you go to Chelsea and it's all trust fund kids and OPEC trillionaires and and there's no club called fist anymore or anything like that and I feel like Baltimore is still the place that you feel is a little bit closer to a real America well it is Baltimore is my home it's a character in my movies the odd things now since Co has happened San Francisco is exactly like Baltimore now and New York's a little bit like it Baltimore was always kind of [ __ ] up so basically Baltimore is the same after Co but all the other cities are way more like Baltimore now especially the fancy ones yeah I feel like also there's that whole question of bohemianism and where it can happen and it seemed as though San Francisco LA New York kind of priced bohemianism out of their environments yeah but in San Francisco they live in Oakland and and uh in New York they live in Queens Queens is the New Bohemia probably and Baltimore has always been inexpensive to live it still is but all the bars that I wrote about the extreme redneck bars and crazy bars that I wrote about in role mods are all gone there's not one gone even in uh pecker the movie I filmed in hampon which is now hipster Heaven here all the locations are gone Friends of the Whitney this is Baltimore all right listen up there's no teabag in here and there's no straight people allowed either come on now all of you I need to see some gay ID oh you're out of here take the money she's all lesbian all the time that's why we're here what are you looking at [ __ ] the nastiest girl in Baltimore that's vanished even in Baltimore there's still the club Charles which is the granddaddy of them all that's still the best bar where people go gay straight any age everything that is Bohemia that will always be the center of social life for me in Baltimore so growing up uh obviously you had some very strong Ambitions was writing a novel one of them did you see yourself being part of of Bellas at some point well I didn't I didn't not think I would do that I Grove press educated me not school and I remember reading Jan and Margarita durra and Alan Rob Grier and all these all these European writers and everything so I loved them I mean I I love to read novels and I still do so I didn't not think I would do it I just I told stories mostly by writing movies which are of course fiction too on the day that we're recorded this there's a piece in the times about how increasingly in the world of fashion books are being used as kind of signifiers of taste Dior featured models walking down a Runway printed with Jack carox on the road Valentino has tapped authors like David sideras to contribute to ad campaigns and increasingly now that we've kind of moved to a zoom culture too you see a lot of people sitting in front of bookcases that you kind of know were purchased right but the thing is everyone looks ugly on Zoom I don't that's why you don't see my picture I don't do hair and makeup for radio and also everybody looks ugly and how people have sex on Zoom I don't know because people it's really kind of scary so books the thing is if they're sets if they're just behind you per set I don't know you're right it's become such a cliche background to think I'm smart so I have in my Zoom Studio where if I have to be on television or something like go that's not in my house I have three I have a green screen but I have three backgrounds one's is a sort of vintage Baltimore Skyline the other one is all the fan art that people have sent me and the third one what is the third one I'm trying to remember I'm just going blank to what it is but oh it's red velvet curtains looks very David Lynch so those are my backgrounds but I I think I think today that that is how people know each other what they look like is on Zoom which is creepy in a way well I mean I've had this odd experience of I teach occasionally so last year I taught exclusively on zoom and I at least kind of knew what everybody looked like this year this is a college class I'm back in the classroom and everybody's masked so I now have all these people whose faces I would not I could run into them on the street I would have no idea who they were and it's I guess that's a good way of asking you what is what has Co been like for you you're a people person in a lot of ways I think you Vibe being on movie sets and having people around you and stuff like that well I know what you mean I have someone that's only worked for me for about two years and she was hired during Co and she wore a mask all the time I don't know who she is I mean she works for me I see her every day but the few times I've seen her without her mask I'm always startled like who is that but clette it was like everybody else you know it was scary and terrifying and boring at the same time as my friend said and I did travel some I went to the Rome Film Festival I have an apartment in New York so I went there I went to San Francisco some I love traveling then the airplanes were four people on them the airports were empty it was like the Twilight Zone I haven't been duct taped to the seat yet but who knows I'm going on a book tour that could happen because now with the no MK thing there's fights both ways I was in the train yesterday and the woman told me there was a huge battle a blowout of somebody that had on a mask and didn't and both sides of the extremes are getting in fights now so it's going to be more duct taping to the seats you were in provinc toown when the the famous outbreak happened right oh my God I knew it was gonna happen more gay people came than the bees in the Swarm I never saw so many in my whole life and and it was crazy it was thousands of twinks I thought it was a boy bang convention it was pretty crazy and I knew something was wrong because every bar was packed and oh my God it's gonna be that again I don't know what's gonna happen there's so many things you fear like I don't know herpy nucleosis or hepatitis Z coads I don't know what's next oh God herpy nucleosis seems like a that that could be a winner um just branding wise it has kind of a nice mouth feel yeah it does it does and it doesn't sound fatal right we're talking to John Waters right now his new novel is out it's liar mouth a Feel Bad Romance we're going to grab a quick break here we're going to come back with more John [Music] Waters next door there's the on his stool they wish me luck on my way to school [Music] I know you belong to somebody new but tonight you belong to me I was I was singing along with that John Waters is here with us writer director actor best known for Classics such as 1972's Pink Flamingos he's just published his first novel liar mouth there I broke my rule I told you who John Waters is although that's barely scratching the surface so John Waters are you surprised did you ever think you'd be mainstream I mean you know Pink Flamingos has been added to the National film registry by the Library of Congress I could go on and on but it seemed like the original plan was I John Waters am never going to be mainstream and then they kind of moved the goalpost a little bit well they read because I changed everybody when I was young not one person wanted to be called an outsider now every person was so I decided maybe I'd be better to be an Insider in the room where it happens you can cause more trouble so I'm a little old 76 to be an outsider I don't know nothing worked after 76 years so um I think it's just more irony in a life I'm an irony dealer that's what I do for a living so I think it goes right along with it I'm flattered by all the attention but you're right the fact that the government acknowledged pinking is a historic film when it's worse than it ever was not better it's more hideous than it ever was I know because criterion's putting it out now and I just we filmed extras I had to watch it again and it was like to see it again was I thought oh my God can you imagine today the sensitivity editor does blood turn you on it does more than turn me on Mr Vader it makes me Cal and more than the site of it I love the taste of it the taste of hot freshly killed blood could you give us some of your political beliefs kill everyone now condone first deegree murder Advocate cannibalism eat [ __ ] filth are my politics filth is my life take whatever you like how's this for a center spread Christ almighty and but I did the same things then I was making fun of hippie values in the hippie world I was making fun of the politically correct values in the politically correct world it's the same I making the films of the society that I live in that sometimes has more rules than my parents did when you look back the decision of new line Cinema to throw in there a lot with you does that strike you now in Retros probably at the time it just felt like oh good finally I got something I I've got somebody who's willing to to help and distribute and get my work out there when you look back from the vantage point of now and thinking about then does it seem like just an incredible miracle that that happened well I tell you I read variety when I was 14 years old so I knew that that was the right company to go to because they were the first time Distributing art movies like gard and at the same time Reaper Madness and Bob Shay ran the company and he went on to R it he later produced Lord of the Rings and I owe him great great respect because uh he said yes to me always and uh without him he wouldn't have and uh I wrote about that in my book Mr knowt all how much I don't have any complaints about Hollywood they treated me fairly but I was always commercial Pink Flamingos was a commercial Underground movie so I was always knowing about the business I read variety I knew which theaters it should play in I went out and promoted them I knew I wanted to team up with him too and he was the first one that really did exploitation films for art theaters and that's what I did I mean I preparing for this conversation I thought about the fact that turer Carlson has been pumping up the idea of testicle tanning and I was thinking wow that doesn't leave a lot of room for John Waters to operate and Tucker Carlson is going to going to be Hawking the idea of Tes tanning testicle what tanning that's this thing where you tanan yeah well that's that's just a cousin to anal bleach isn't it I that was exactly my thought uh you you just stole it right out of my head well speaking of that though so Obama at one point referred to the tea party as teabaggers and I was wondering if you felt you felt you deserved any credit for that I think it's in pecker that you introduced to many people that particular term teabagging is when male go go dancers are dancing in the bar and they hit you in the forehead with your testicles no teabagging you know the rules no balls on foreheads teabagging is forbidden here at the fudge Palace it is a fleeting moment but it is legal it's safe no one gets pregnant or gets AIDS if it wasn't for you pecker man I'd never know this [ __ ] existed teabagging Jesus I thought I had heard of everything dude have you ever heard of giving someone a dutch oven no what's that it's when you fart in bed and you quickly pull the covers over your partner's head oh man I got to try that sometime the Republicans used to talk about being teabaggers without any irony not knowing and I saw Rachel Mata burst right out laughing on the screen and she did know what it meant so did Obama know what teabagging meant maybe if there was ever a president I always try to think what presidents did any of them see pink flamingos I bet Bill Clinton did and I don't know maybe maybe Obama maybe well when I think of you and presidents I also think of Harry as Truman first of all both of you have large porn collections but also uh harus Truman that whole give him a hell Harry thing somebody yelled at at him one time and he said oh no I just tell them the truth and they think it's hell and I think that's a little bit what you have done with a lot of your work right it's kind of you and I both grew up in a kind of that Eisenhower era time of ill-advised cheeriness where the whole idea of having a messy life seemed more like a bug than a feature uh people talk about the 50s it was this fun time it was a horrible time and you know everyone I knew I like Ike if I was smart enough I wouldn't have liked Ike I didn't know I was 10 years old I would have liked adelay Stevenson but I didn't know one person that voted for him in the school I went to it was a private school so was everybody liked Ike and I probably wouldn't have liked Ike at the end but that was the first time I I I started to realize that well who's the other one that nobody seems to like here this talking about and I'm sure I would have voted for adiz stavon if I was alive then or voting age but I think when your work started to come out because it pushed back against those kinds of conventions and against the idea that normaly was an unspotted excussion right that normaly was no social deformities whatsoever it it I mean to this day it must be the case that people come up to you and say well you kind of showed me I was okay yeah they do yeah they treat me like Mother Teresa they start crying sometimes which even shocks me but the big difference is today people said oh my parents showed me your films I thought they did when I was young my parents called the police you know and they just released cookie MERS a lot of her writing and it got the greatest review in the LA time so it was wonderful but her mother used to call me be elub and chase me across the line because she found the script for Pink Flamingos and uh she was horrified but you know my parents never saw pinking they would have been horrified too they paid for it and I paid them back but at the same time What parent would be proud their son made Pink Flamingos even today maybe it would be weird we did a whole show years ago about the nature of shock particularly shock in art and I'd be interested in hearing kind of your theory about like what happens when you shock people if Pink Flamingos is as shocking as you suggest maybe more shocking today than it was what's happening when the person gets shocked by it well it's easy to shock people the people are shocked at their own ability to be surprised by anything to be startled they think they've seen everything but they laugh when they're shocked they're not repulsed they don't run out of the theater I think there's things in L mouth that will startle you and try to think maybe I haven't thought of that before but at the same time I'm hoping you're laughing I'm trying to use shock as wit not just to disgust you or ever since pinkl Mingos when I did that ending which was really a a Hy to Anarchy really certainly not anything sexual and it was a reaction to porn becoming illegal the filthiest people alive well you think you know somebody filthier watch as Divine proves that not only is she the filthiest person in the world she is also the filthiest actress in the world what you are about to see is the real thing how much is that doy in the window so today I don't know I'm not usually there's a lot of critics say it's a very John Mor sque movie and I usually hate those movies because they're trying too hard I'm trying to make you laugh first way before being repulsed or anything I don't want you to be repulsed for real I want you to open up your mind to think of things you've never thought of and not judge others when you don't know the whole story and that's kind of some of the laughter too is right I'm seeing this thing I didn't expect to see and wouldn't have thought I could possibly be okay with seeing and it is shocking me but I'm also not being you know raptured either to heaven or hell maybe we're laughing kind of almost out of a relief that we can handle this yeah and if you came along with me if you bought a John waters's book or go to see a John Waters movie you're expecting a little that you want to be taken into a world that you're a little uncomfortable in but I'm your guide you'll be all right I'm never mean-spirited in the long run you'll get out wiser I hope and hopefully with a better sense of humor about yourself the most important thing to ever have a sense of humor about So speaking of people who are mean-spirited I have to bring this up you did so much to exalt the notion of bad taste and then finally we got a president with bad taste I mean descending from Mount Olympus on a gold escalator is so John Waters and yet I don't know no I disagree okay I think I think I completely disagree he ruined bad taste it's not even funny anymore bad taste I I don't think there's anything in in lyou that's actually bad taste I think it's a strange story about extremes but Marsha doesn't have bad taste no one in it actually has bad taste Trump had no well Trump is the Ultimate Hair Hopper and a hair Hopper is the biggest insult I can ever give it's someone that always acts Rich doesn't really have money and spends way too much time on their hair I I never mentioned Trump in any of my movies or anything because or anything because it it dates it it dates it a political humor gets old really quickly if it's about one particular person it dates the film like pink flamingos is you know 50 years later people are seeing it so you don't want to date it I think even when the first lady did those hideous Christmas trees that look like go Las Vegas and everything but it wasn't really funny it wasn't as bad as as to start something new it was just hair Hopper taste which is never funny and it makes rich people look bad it's hard to talk friend Lio WS is ly that Trump is a poor person's idea of a rich person well that's true well that's what a hair Hopper is basically or or somebody like I think the reason Trump doesn't want you to see his taxes is because he's broke oh yes it's absolutely a matter of Pride so I'm assuming that you don't have what we might call Von meter issues that when you've made fun of somebody and and then they die for example I'm looking right now on my little like who I'm trying to think well I'm take your pict who have I made fun of recently that just died you mean well I look I'm looking at the thing you did it was sort of a fake National Inquirer cover it says Joan didan hits 250 pounds and there's this kind of that was done before she died I know I I know that I'm quite aware of that but I'm wondering I don't know do you like when she died did you feel oh geez maybe no no I didn't think I didn't I make fun of uh I I talk about it my show I do now I make fun of someone's dead I said that I was nominated for the Grammy for Best spoken word for my book but Joan Rivers that [ __ ] beat me because she died uh she would say something like that oh she she would be all right to say that yes yeah well Joan no I didn't feel bad about that because basically all those people on the cover were people I liked it was me Imagining the national inquire if it was run for intellectuals if it was all dirt on novelist and Poets and stuff what it would be like if the paparazzi chased them every day or you know I do still read the inquire and the tablets because I get I get material from them but yes I think um that was an intellectual I still think it would work as a magazine it would be Beyond Spy magazine or one of those magazines it would be where outside of you know some intell ual that just got a great review for their poetry stepped outside and Paparazzi were trying to get a shot said they gained 40 pounds this week or that one didn't have to die you know all the regular Inquirer headlines right actually there's one that says help I've got writers block and there's a picture of Joyce carolot so right right I think she could laugh at that she actually I've actually worked with Joyce carolot a few times and she's funnier than people actually think she is she actually oh I always thought she'd be funny yeah she has a real sense of humor CU she told Playboy once the thing I can never get that she even writes [Laughter] I respect it speaking of you and John Rivers you you're a voter in like all kinds of awards you might be the only person who votes in the Oscars and the razis yeah I know I do vote for both I vote let me see I vote for the Oscars the writer Guild director Guild SAG Awards the Ries the spirit Awards I the only one I don't vote is the emys I guess I'm not on TV enough well I was gonna ask you it's it's a real job because I do watch all the movies and every year I put my 10 best lists in art for him every year and it's never the ones that get nominated to the AOS everything I nominated never get nominated but I'm still a proud member of all those organizations and so you get all the screeners and and don't you have to like you have to destroy the screeners after the season is over yeah I did an art piece that was a picture of me burning them all and as I'm in a tuxedo and I'm burning all the screeners it's called destroy all screeners that's what I'm saying how of people destroyed them they're hard to destroy you have to go to a shredder and you know it's a quite a job to destroy all those greeners and remember one year they busted people for it for they would sell them at flea markets and then they I guess they had to go to the academy award jail and stuff no I think they had Will Smith slap those people um I don't know they may you you mentioned you're not an Emy voter you memorably did appear I believe as yourself on The Simpsons hi I'm John can I help you with anything 50 bucks for a toy no kid is that oh but this is the Rex Mars Atomic discombobulator don't you just love the graphics on this box no how can you love a box or a toy or Graphics you're a grown man it's Camp The Tragically ludicrous the ludicrously tragic oh yeah like when a clown dies well sort of but you also you know one of the things people say now is well real narrative is moving over to eight epod epod you know streaming TV things it's moving away from movies I I've never gotten the sense that you were attracted to that form well I like it but I mean I think all movies are too long now why do they need to be eight episodes now every Academy movie is too long they don't need to be two and a half hours long all these movies uh there's no such thing especially if they're supposed to be funny there's no such thing as a good long joke I hate jokes anyway I like wiet when someone says can I tell you a joke I would say please don't please don't tell me a joke I I know I watch television I do I watch some of them more documentary types I think yes I still watch them I go to both I go to both I actually think when I was growing up yes film people looked down on TV now TV is sometimes better so I I go to both this may be the one semi-serious thing that we talk about or maybe we've talked about many serious things already but you know one thing that you did do was repeatedly visit Leslie van hton who was one of the Charles Manson followers in prison she's been fighting for parole you've endorsed that parole I think Gavin news just again rejected the state's parole board recommendation to release her could you just say a little bit about her and that and why it's important yeah for the fifth time she the parole board that is par that is appointed by both the governors that have turned her down Governor Brown and Governor New even though the parole board each time goes through the reasons he told her down because it's a terrible crime and everything well yes it is and she agrees and she looks back on it with horror she's been in jail 50 years she was 19 when she met the biggest Madman of crime history and um she's had a perfect time in jail for 50 years I do visit her I I can't so much now with covid because that made visiting terrible in jail I think that she everybody knows she is rehabilitated she does not blame Manson she blames herself for making him a cult leader and I think the law is she should get out and uh there's only three states in America where they allow the governor to turn it down it's California Oklahoma and Maryland where I live and they almost got rid of it here this year but then it was put back in the governor appoints the parole board so give your Paro board that you appointed the freedom to do it everybody knows you should get out it's just who wants to be the one to do it and I would never say that to the victims relatives they can't be wrong they're not ever wrong what they say but I'm talking about it from a legal Viewpoint that she got seven years to life was her sentence than her trial the last one that was the only one that counts and uh nobody that's been in jail for 50 years that got seven to life that has a perfect prison record I just think In fairness that she will disappear you'll never hear from her again she has a large support group that she has job offers she will vanish which is what she should do yeah she's 72 years old right now there's a little bit of spoiler thing that's about to happen if listening and you worry about that kind of thing watching the Tarantino movie Once Upon a Time in Hollywood that must have been a very odd experience because it was I think it's a great movie I I think it's a great movie and when he was making it I called Quenton and before he picked up the phone I know him he said I know I know don't don't put my name is Lulu this is Tex we're going to be leading you on a great trail ride through the beautiful Santa Susanna Cy but if that was true what happened at the end of this movie and I think it's a brilliant movie Leslie's crime would have never happened because it was the second night she wouldn't have gone yeah these [ __ ] hippie weirdos they they they they broke into my house they tried to kill my wife and my buddy Jesus Christ are you serious yeah I'm [ __ ] serious now my buddy and his dog killed two of them and then uh well [ __ ] I I torch the last one torched yeah I burnt her ass to a crisp so I wish it had been true in a way that way it never would have happened the second night would have never happened right so we're going to take a little break here we have a little bit of time left after that with John Waters the novel liar mouth a Feel Bad Romance is out you may own it in return for a certain amount of money outlaid and we will come back and talk a little bit more with John Waters [Music] we're back it's time to say some thank yous a special one goes to Jennifer larouge she is the person who is producing this segment and she's one of our freelance producers and this is exciting also exciting to have Dylan Rays on the the board as our technical producer and way back behind the scenes Jonathan mcant is doing all kinds of technical Wizardry and post- production stuff like that and Lily Tyson our senior producer is also hovering over all all of this in a more or less Angelic way so thanks to all of them we're with John Waters a writer director and actor best known for Classics like 1972's pink flamingos and of course hairspray and Serial Mom and crybaby I could go on and on so there's so many things I want to ask you about but since I am sitting here in Hartford Connecticut which is where people will move when Baltimore gets too expensive they'll come to Hartford um but I know that there is something that you do in Connecticut called Camp John Waters tell us about that a it's in a it's in K Connecticut and it's a beautifully restored summer camp that began as a nudus camp people come they live there for four days living the life of my character sometimes it's all a tribute to my movies it's the most amazing PR of people people come from all over the world people have gotten married at it they bring them on buses with free liquor oh it's great we had t-shirts it's a uh Jonestown with a happy ending and uh it it it it kind of is and we have guest counselors we've had Patricia Hurst Kathleen Turner mink sto's there every year Ricky Lakes been Tracy Lords this coming year it's Debbie Harry and Colleen Fitzpatrick who played who became vitamin C the pop star but she played Debbie Harry's da daughter in Hairspray so mother daughter day is our theme maybe this year I mean it must be this must be a special opportunity to meet even beyond the rank and file type fan right the kind of person who's there is somebody who has related to your work maybe in a way that you couldn't have anticipated I don't know if you can sort of talk about what that's like or who who that tends to be and they they stick together the campers all year because whenever I do my show anywhere in the world if I say are there any campers in the audience somebody always yells out yes I test my material on them I judge a contest where they come as the most obscure details from my movie that's really really hilarious but they have like arts and crafts where they make hate bracelets and they do all sorts of sweet things like slip under the door at night before you go to sleep The Ransom note from Serial Mom which is I'll get you [ __ ] face um they they really go into it with a great spirit and people are intense together gay straight every ages you don't know and everybody gets along it's it's really really a great camp and we had a terrible thing when I went to summer camp what I hated was we had a bowel movement chart where they put it up in the middle of the camp and every Camp so we had that one year even and they got into it well yes and I I think I either read or heard somewhere that at least one camper has taken it upon herself to to eat some dog poop as a tri yes one person she was waiting in line and then she said can I do one thing that I've always wanted to do and I said sure she said Can i e dog do in front of you and I said F Gess you know and she took a little scientific lab thing and ate it and everybody cheered it was it was lovely and she had a good time I don't know I'm I'm open-minded absolutely so one thing would be enough for most people one thing of this type in magnitude would be enough for most people probably not for John Waters so is Burger bugaloo out in Oakland is that still happening it's still happening but it's called mosswood madness now because there was some problem with a record company that had nothing in LA had nothing to do with the people that run it in Oakland yes the fifth year it is great it's a two-day punk rock festival and there are punks there from ages two years old to 70 some punks are 70 years old now and it's great to see them stage time and uh it's it's really great because they hate everybody in the world except themselves so I I really like crowds like that so who's headlining this year do you know yet bikini beach one and Kim Gordon we've had we've had Iggy Pop we've had Diva it's really good really really good I saw somebody compare it to Coachella and you said I call it Cella go to hel well maybe I played Coachella myself though I did my comedy show they're a music version I played Coachella I played bonaroo I played fun fun fun but most of them they got so big they don't have comedy anymore you know I want to talk about the comedy the spoken word comedy stuff too because once again you know you have reached a point in your career in your life where you could just cruise around accepting honorary degrees from universities that you would have been kicked out of or never admitted to back in the day I do that too I do that too I know I know you do that but you do this spoken word stuff and you really work it I mean you if you're going to Birmingham England you write a couple of Birmingham jokes or find out what the local porn theater is and work that in and practice it on the airplane on the way over that's a level I do I just it's a 70-minute monologue I rewrite it once a year and then the Christmas one once a year too so uh yeah and it's a 70 minute monologue that's completely memorized I don't use any notes I come out yeah it's a big part of how I make my life I do it maybe 40 50 times a year but that's a level of dedication and particularly you know kind of tailoring it or localizing it a little bit so there'll be a joke that the people in Athens get or something yeah I always work in I always work in a local joke yeah I think it's good it makes people know that you're not coasting you're not walking through it and and yes I think it's very important to do that with the limited amount of time that we have left you know I feel like on the one hand we've made some pretty amazing strides in this Society in this culture in terms of lgbtq acceptance you know growing up I remember being a kid growing up and I would see like I don't know Paul Lind or Charles Nelson Riley on television I it didn't even occur to me that they were kind of supposed to be crypto gay or something as a kid that didn't really mean anything to me this is so much more part of were you blind as a child I just didn't know anything I didn't know I was an idiot I didn't know anything my parents eventually did you know explain this whole thing to me but it took a while so yeah no I didn't get that but now obviously you know we made all kinds of progress but I feel like also there's a do you feel like there's a little bit bit of boomeranging going on right now we've got this Florida law there's yeah I have a whole thing about the don't say straight law that I want to pass in my show but um I I think you know no I think gay people should scare straight people again you know I I know how to do it and the main thing I've been recommending for a long time is if gay men and gay women started having sex that would freak out the whole world but but does it concern you I mean you know there's there's more book Banning and stuff like that a new wave of that kind of stuff a way in which the Republican Party seems to want to reignite the cultural Wars I assume it's because they have so little else in their quiver that they want to get into all this culture stuff I don't know is it just sort of more of the same or does it feel like a scarier moment well book Banning is the stupidest thing ever that's the best press agent you ever had I wish somebody would ban liy mouth oh somebody will absolutely I promise you that well I don't think they're gonna be teaching it in kindergarten I I don't really think that's gonna happen but at the same time book Banning the whole thing of uh you know you look back on it even Anita Bryant's career was totally ruined when she came out against gay marriage and everything so it doesn't work if you don't want something don't go radically against it then it just brings more attention to it now the fight with Disneyland and Florida at the same time it's you know both of them at one point in their careers were on the same page and then when Disney had to stick up for gay people and I know why they want to keep all their animators they're all gay so as we're starting to wrap up here in 2009 you're talking to Modern painters magazine and you say I want to do two more movies that's enough I hope I can make two more how how are you feeling about that right now you don't sound like anybody who wants to retire or anything like that no well you don't know I've got some ideas in the works with Studios now I'm just not allowed to talk about it so I'm not saying I'm finished making movies at all there there was at one point some kind of wasn't there like a Christmas project that was being kicked around yeah that's still possible yeah there was a Christmas project plus I've been paid a couple times to write sequels to hairspray which I did so my movie career is not dead I still deal with Hollywood all the time and God bless Criterion they put out you know this beautiful packages of multiple Maniacs polyester female trouble and now Pink Flamingos so they're really keeping my career alive in a very classy way so I think we have to salute the people that are still going back and doing extremes of movies they have Brasa and Bergman but at the same times they have me so they like extremes and I think that's the most important thing is there going to be a movie of liar mouth if they do they have to buy the rights don't they to make it would would you want to director would you dream of turning it over anybody else yeah sure I would it would be nc7 and it would have a lot of special effects so uh but yes I think maybe it's time to have an nc7 hit movie again works for me John Waters it has been a privilege and a pleasure to talk to you today and congratulations on the novel coming up thank you thank you so much for having [Music] me deep B I'm a bad girl