Socceroos sink to Bahrain & does Juan Mata outshine Douglas Costa?

[Music] sit back hold your shape be disciplined roll around on the floor a little bit get in their heads play on the counter cause a little bit of chaos and reduce their set pieces in dangerous areas the blueprint to stifle the socaro is as plain as it is widely available to all of their opponents and frustratingly we don't seem to be that close to any solutions bahrain's first goal against Australia in 18 years the deflected cross with the last touch to Harry sua sinks the socaro to a loss in the opening game of the third phase of World Cup qualifiers whilst the path is easier this time around in a group with Japan and Saudi Arabia the socceroos are already on the back foot in the a league and in true Derby fashion the wers say anything you can do I can do better to Sydney FC as Western Sydney announced the signing of Spanish World Cup winner Juan Mata is he the best a-league Marquee since del Piero or perhaps Douglas Costa the caceras Clause is officially being revoked the Kiwi Classico sounds very similar to our homework and the raw complete a rare International tour for an a league club on this episode of the round ball Australia podcast supported by manscaped use code round ball for 20% off and free shipping at checkout my name is Lan AAL and joining me tonight is Will Booth will hello to you kiwi Classico kiwi Clash I don't know there's only a few letters difference between there I feel like we were on to something even after all the objections that we got online yeah we were on the right right path for sure and I reckon we should be looking at some sort of royalty Arrangement now for that one for sure Jacob Stevens hello to you they didn't go with the extra K though they didn't and I think that there was some pretty good reasons raised as to why you should avoid having multiple KS next to each other um which I think is fairly reasonable yes looking back uh reasonable indeed we will get on to that but of course the big stories today is that the socceroos have fallen at their first fixture on the Gold Coast one goal to nil against the traveling Bahrain outfit Jacob it felt like bahin knew exactly what they needed uh to do to beat the so well perhaps not even beat the socceroo but at least earn a result in the goal the deflection of Harry suo was definitely a bonus but it's a famous victory for them they carried out their game plan it looks like as well as they could have and the sakuro is again left feeling frustrated and wild I think it's fair to be frustrated at it because it's pretty anti- football the way that they played right I don't think it's that's a harsh statement to make but it's also a case of the soero just didn't do enough to be able to deal with it they they kept getting drawn into these challenges that Bahrain were then Milking for fouls they couldn't keep the ball on the floor which meant that there were lots of these high boots and challenges up in the air and things like that which again B were lookking for fouls it was this very sto start and the socer are playing into their hands so it was perfectly done by barin to be able to to go about their business in the manner that they did and a lot of the complaints that are sort of coming from what we've seen from this match are very similar they remind me a lot of of you know uh the early days of the Asian Champions League when a leue clubs were were competing in it and how you know a lot of the Asian clubs the way that they like to play was to you know draw a lot of fouls slow the game down you know have have their players on the floor almost as much as possible and Bin have done that and and shown why it can still be so effective because teams that are used to you know an open flowing game of football when all of a sudden it's not like that and they don't have the space or the time on the ball or they're constantly being drawn into challenges that they shouldn't be you know they're unable to actually do anything with it and I think that there's Fair criticism to be made of of the soccer and the way that they set up and I'm sure we'll get on to that but I think in terms of the way that Baron went about it it was a case if they knew what they were here here to do they weren't going to walk away with a loss um I don't think you know even if they'd have gone a goal down I think that it would have just they'd have just turned it up at another level and and gone even further into it and look it was a a fortunate deflection for Bahrain that got them their goal but that sort of stuff happens in football and you know it was the fact that they were able to stay so Resolute for for the 90 minutes to keep it at nil nil to you know for that to be the winning goal you know without the way that they had played that might not have been the case for him yeah I do Wonder well perhaps if they spent a couple of days at Wet n Wild during their time on the go Coast because there was plenty of splashing around uh which made the game very hard to watch it some sometimes it is worth classifying that uh you know Cassini yangi made contact to the throat I think that red card is by the book but the rest of it extremely hard to watch particularly down that right hand side where alisandra chath it was asked to play tonight just constant rolling around and fouls it's it just it makes it tough yeah like I the soccers just look like they never built momentum and and that's what the point of kind of rolling around the floor like they did is they just stifled Australia in yeah in especially in attack like they couldn't get two phases of play back to back it seemed like they couldn't hold on to the ball for extended periods cuz it was it was just so stop start stop start and and they're they're the games that you don't really want to play and it definitely didn't help any of our creative problems I think that just yeah stifles the momentum and and and we we usually you know keep the ball buil up enough to to kind of yeah just dominate games like that but it it couldn't dominate this game it was kind of they made it really hard to so so credit to them as much as it as it pains people to kind of watch watch those type of games but yeah I think the balance in Midfield was was kind of the biggest issue for me today it was just crying out for for one a more creative player and I think we miss rusage a lot because he he is often the player that's done that in um in these sorts of games he's he's able to step up and and kind of just add another element to it so I don't know when when the Midfield three with they're they're all fantastic players in their own right right Irvine Matt car and and O'Neal but they all just offer the same thing really so I don't really see the point of starting just all three of them there and the the shape looks tired I think think grah Arnold's always been a few Cycles behind in in tactical Innovation right he's always just a little slow to get there and it's surprising because we did look so good recently um in the previous couple of games but this game is just just evidence that yeah it's it's just stale in the middle and I think the buildup all three of those midfielders just were kind of in the like looking for that ball off the center backs just in the same space kind of moving around slow like it just did not look like anything that is like like better teams play and it's not that hard to to make slight adjustments to um to get it working but I think we need to play at maximum like one of those one defensive pivot that and maybe the the fullback kind of inverts next to them and then get more advanced you'd say like the eights the attacking eights in there uh they just weren't high up enough the field to be effective um so even if they were receiving the ball from from the straight from the center backs it was just in Weak areas of the field and then they just had a a barin block in front of them so yeah very frustrating and and I think a whole balance and shift of of the setup uh needs to be needs to be looked at and one of the things I noticed as well which really frustrated me even though I didn't really have a dog in the fight right but like you know I'm I'm English and the the reason I don't completely despise Zar is because of the amount of Adel United former players in the squad but um even when the ball was worked out wide and you're sort of then looking to bring it back into the to the middle tighten up the shape um at the barin backline and then flick it back out wide again it was the likes of O'Neal were receiving the ball in the middle and then just turning straight back towards the Defenders you've got to turn up field and look to progress the ball and it just looked like there was absolutely none of that no no intent in the Midfield to to do that they were happy to just keep possession and recycle it rather than actually turn up field and look to progress the ball which you know is something that that's okay if it's one of your players is doing that because you do want somebody who's there to keep possession in those tight areas but when it's every single one of your central midfielders you're just not going to be able to generate anything and you could tell that the Wingers and the fullbacks had absolutely no support going forwards because the ball would go into the Midfield and it was like a black hole because it would just disappear again and go right back to the the back line so you know it just felt like even when Australia were trying to do something different and they were trying to get the ball out wide they just didn't have the assistance through the center anyway to to to be able to make it an effective move about 3 4 months ago when we finished off the second round of qualifiers we had this one game I forget who our opponent was but where we had Aiden husti and Ry mcgree both starting in more advanced roles in that Midfield and it hurts even more because those players mcgree is injured rusage was sorting up his Club future he hadn't had he hadn't played football so they were unavailable for this window but just the fact that we've seen a little bit of glimpse of it and it just hasn't been able to be maintained the cries for Alex Robinson and why he wasn't in the squad will only intensify after this game I think the only player that's in this current Squad that really offers that kind of Midfield creativity is Josh Nisbet um perhaps we see him a little more next game I'm not sure but I do I agree with your point will that the three midfielders we have kind of offer similar options and profiles and I kind of we mentioned briefly last week I'm not actually really sure about the future of Jackson Irvine in this team I think if you had those two creative midfields probably leaning towards either Kieran beus or sorry Keanu bakus or um Aiden O'Neal in that role and then you got the advanced midfielders as well so it's been a constant criticism of grem marnold sakuro team for probably at least 18 months as those kind of creative Midfield roles I don't think it's going away uh anytime soon we also had a bit of an experiment though in this game Jacob at right back we know we were short on left backs the right back has always been a very rotated place as well yeah but what's happened tonight is actually a bit of a trend of what we've seen in European football and World football is that if you don't have any good fullbacks just Chuck another good Center back in Al Alexandro jaati asked to play at right back with sutar Ral in the middle and then AIS bayit on the left he pushed up the field Al alesandro sometimes went up the right as well sometimes in this kind of three at the back uh how do you adjudge that experiment after 90 minutes it was interesting like you said it's sort of the trend at the moment to do that and um usually it happens though with a center back who has experience in that sort of a position but um as Alexandro said after the game it's a role he's never been asked to play in his career before so it's something completely new and foreign to him and U it was quite interesting actually when we had him on the podcast he was talking about how the the times he's played for the socceroo gr arold has told him just do what you do for your club and it's this is asking to do something completely different than that and look I don't think it was a an abject failure and I think that had the soero one we' have looked at it and gone H you know it kind of worked out there was there was a a good idea there but I think because of the result and the way that there was just no creativity in the side it perhaps didn't look like it was as good a move as as you know you could probably theorize it was going to be um look you've just got to you've just got to do what you can and when you've got got such a lack of quality in those fullback positions you've got to do something but I think that there's maybe other ways to go about it right you know you could play a back three um you know with three really solid center backs and then have the the fullbacks as you know these Advanced Wing backs which is basically what bayit was doing all game anyway um and then you don't need a proper you know right back because you can play you know sort of a slightly deeper Winger on the on the right and and that sort of works out that way and you know you you could be looking at completely different sort of structure there but um it didn't seem like it doesn't seem like that's the way that that Arie wants to go he wants to have that back four uh because there's just a lot more that you can do with a back four um in terms of both in and out of possession shapes and structures than you can when you've got the back three with the two Wing backs you sort of set in stone there you have to have a back three almost at all times um unless you're crazy enough to have one of those center backs step up into the Midfield so um you know it it does sort of limit the options there but the options are limited already anyway um I look I think he he he showed a little bit of intent going forwards which I liked but you know wasn't particularly effective and he was one of the players you mentioned before Loy you know Bahrain were really focusing their efforts on him to you know try and draw him into challenges and get him to to foul them and you know it happened a couple of times he obviously got that yellow card which we could debate whether or not that's a yellow for for days very very harsh very harsh cool but you know again it's what Bahrain wanted to do they they set out to do it and they they did it perfectly and I think it's perhaps you know the combination of never having played in that role before so just getting drawn into these situations where he just shouldn't be because he's not used to it but also a case of yeah again it feels like Arie has reached a point where when he can't field the exact 11 that he wants and that he envisions as being sort of his um project going forwards then it's these same old problems that we're talking about happening so look it was an experiment didn't work out particularly well but it also wasn't the worst of things um but I do think that going forwards right back's going to be a big question um as is obviously those Advanced midfielder roles we've had strain play there in the past but he's almost always injured um you know um gin Jones became the the scapegoat of that Asian cup campaign you know chati isn't a right back we've got balina in the wings but he's four years down the line before he becomes Lewis Miller yeah it just seems like there's not really an eyon on option there at the moment and it might be a case of we're going to see sort of similar experiments moving forwards for the foreseeable future what we did today is is probably what we have to keep on trying but I just think you can get that balance a lot better across the across the three that stay and and and who that man is that that that goes down the right I think it probably even like something as simple as swapping rolls and um and chard today might have been more effective I don't know I it's I think with boss at left back I see this working a lot a lot better um so yeah I think it it is it is a symptom of of kind of having other positions out as well which highlights the the the lack of um of quality and you know tactical fit that we have here so no and it's um another thing is that it's interesting um with yangi on a red to see who like you know obvously it's going to be Juke tagget there as well um I don't know if you want to play Juke on his own um it was best juke looked at his best when he was next to yangi so yeah it remains to be seen kind of kind of what we do in that game yeah I agree it will be interesting like I really hope that chardia right back is just a kind of break glass in case of emergency because obviously leis Miller picked up a knock to his knee I think it was in this camp and was unable to start so I'm sure that would have been the preference going into it obviously Thomas ding's there as well so maybe you know kyr's home is on the Gold Coast and he wanted to give minutes there as well maybe that's just kind of how it shook shook out for this game uh but we'll have to wait and see but in terms of chati himself I really want to see him playing at left Center back for an extended period of time and this leads me on to my next point about the fact that Nester irin kunda has to be starting games for me now for the socceroos Arnold has talked consistently about always looking forwards towards the 26 World Cup in North America he used that line even when he was selecting his Asian Cup squad if you're serious about this we need to be picking out players that we think are going to be there in their preferred positions playing game for the socceroo that applies to jakati that applies to Nester you're looking at him and Martin Bole you know pick a 20-year-old irin kunda who's had two years of buying or a 33-year-old Martin Bo has been playing in Scotland and no disrespect to Bo he's been a great servant for the nation but I think it's quite a Clear Choice who you're going to be going with uh and Jacob I just think he needs to be starting games now just all the excuses are out the window now he just needs to be starting games it's um Bo is I I don't quite know how to describe the style of player that he is and the way that he plays he he kind of looks when you watch him especially for the soccer he looks like a 10 that's being told to play on the wing he likes to play in that half space a lot and just causes congestion because when you've got um you know two eights in the team as well and you've got a a striker and Anie likes to play with two Strikers at times as well so you know that's just adding more congestion into those areas so he just doesn't get free enough he doesn't provide enough of a threat and he's much more of a support player what I think actually might work well dropped back into the Midfield but that's a point for another day but you're completely right in the iringa not only just a case of getting him minutes in his preferred position but he's easily the better player uh and much more of a an attacking and goal scoring threat than Martin Bole and like I said ly there's no disrespect to Bole but that's just not the style of player that he is and it's especially in these games where you need somebody to just be able to be a bit bullish and take the initiative and and try and do something and irin kinda came on and by the time he came on you could tell the soccerus were already getting frustrated and it was playing into Baran hands more and more and more and that just didn't give him the opportunity to get into the game that we would have liked to see but you can imagine what it would be like to have iron kund out there to have Goodwin on the left um and then whoever it is is that's going to be up front that's a dynamic that is just going to work so well it worked so well for adate United obviously as well which you know I made a joke in the group chat that uh they should just fill the Australian starting 11 with ad United players and see how that goes but um but no like it it worked at the club level because iron KRA offers that goal scoring threat and Goodwin has just got such a good delivery and we saw it in this game as well right like he was consistently generating the best chances um for the soccer and when he was taken off all of a sudden th those deliveries from outwire completely died and and there wasn't that threat there you know having the pair of them on the wings would be just it would be such a danger because it it doesn't allow the defense to focus their attentions on one part of the pitch because when you've got those threats on either side it means that they're going to be stretched thin because they're going to have to try and cover the whole length of the pitch and the whole width of the pitch to contain them both you know and you don't get that with Bo because like I said he plays in that half space he plays a little bit more narrow um and he does seem when he's playing for Australia to look much more like a midfielder that's trying to play out wide than a Winger um which is something that I think you know will was touching on that there was a lack of threat from out wide in this game um and that's perhaps in part because of the fact that we only really had one wing in the side um and so that threat wasn't going to be able to to to come naturally so yeah no yeah on on a bunch of fronts there it just makes so much more sense to get eron ker into the into the team you know the the the couple of reasons why you wouldn't is you know not playing at the highest level right he's playing in the fourth division in Germany which looks worse than the a league um you know uh and um he's also obviously still very young and inexperienced at this level but he's going to remain in experienced if you don't get him those minutes so you know that's kind of an argument that works against itself I suppose but no I'm I'm completely with you lucky that IR should be getting minutes here I don't think I've said this on the Pod yet but I had made a prediction in our group chat or maybe it was on Twitter one of the two uh I re and you'll get three goals for the senior buern team this year he's going to come off the bench he going to get a few opportunities it it hurts that Kingsley Coman didn't go away on transfer deadline there we thought that might happen uh but there you go n to three goals interesting stat for you will uh approximately maybe 50 minutes into the game something like that uh the socceroo set a new national team record for minutes without conceding in World Cup qualifiers uh the record broken was 749 uh ended quite soon afterwards but uh it's interesting because we've had you know the world record for the longest consecutive win streak in World Cup qualifiers as well but as soon as we get to the third phase it's like what are we doing here these records seem to fall down almost instantly yeah it's a it's a mental block and I I don't know you just get tested a little bit in one that that's all it takes but no it's it's very impressive to to kind of be setting these records for short so I mean you know you want to you want to test yourself against against the better teams and as soon as we do it maybe opens up a lot of defensive issues that we just aren't able to see in in games against you know lesser opposition they don't test Us in the ways where we can aren gr marold has to work out what's wrong at the back and kind of make adjustments so no it it it's kind of good to that this record's done and and we can you know address maybe some issues rather than just going with what's worked because maybe we just haven't been tested enough I actually disagree slightly there that there's defensive issues I thought the defense was actually really good today like I thought that they looked really really strong and solid and it was just an unfortunate deflection you know that happens in these games it was actually a case of the rest of the team not being up to stand that meant that that was the goal that decided it you know in an ideal circumstance that would have made it you know 231 oh well you know it would have been tough last five six minutes but it's not the end of the world whereas it here because there was absolutely nothing going forwards that's the the goal that decided it and I thought that sutar um had a solid game um playing a lot of long balls forward wasn't particularly accurate at all the time with it but it you know showed a good initiative to try and get the ball forward I thought jakati looked really good on the ball as well he was getting a lot of those out towards Goodwin which worked really well KY rolls was solid barely put her foot wrong you know I thought the defense actually was really strong um you know it remains to be seen how strong they will be because we do have a couple of obviously pretty solid teams in this uh in this qualifying um group um you know and how they perform against them you know that remains to be seen but I thought that actually they were all right tonight um and it is a bit of a shame for them that that this record doesn't go on because you know that was from their hard work and it was you know a lack of hard work from the rest of the team perhaps that that caused it to fall apart but you're also right within that they could sort of put it behind themselves now and and just sort of start with a clean slate and and go again yeah it was more like in general I think we get found out at this stage because yeah we just aren't we don't have that game that or the games that that kind of let us work out what works best because it just it's just never able to be to be seen and definitely um these upcoming qualifiers will I mean hopefully let us yeah answer some more questions that we haven't had to address yet yeah so the other result tonight is that Japan have beaten China 70 so an ominous start for them uh and in this group with Japan and Saudi Arabia where we have to finish top two to get automatic qualification to the World Cup we've already slipped up on a banana peel against BR and we're going to have to earn results against at least one of those two teams now if we want to get automatic qualification which remember is supposed to be a fair bit easier than the previous cycles and somehow it seems like we're going down the similar story again but we'll leave that there until Indonesia on Tuesday uh for the the second game of this window of course the beauty of this time of year is that we have a window pretty much every month as the season just gets rolling before we get to Christmas so there'll be plenty of opportunity to talk sakuro but let's head back to the a league because the Western Sydney Wanderers have responded to D Douglas Costa's arrival in Sky Blue by now ing the signing of Spanish Maestro Juan Mata we talked about Costa CV a little while ago you have to say that matters is probably gets the edge a World Cup win and a European championships with Spain two UEFA Champions League sorry one UEFA Champions League with Chelsea Two Europa leagues Turkish Champion Japanese Champion English FA Cup Spanish cup feels a bit like deja vu but is one matter the best a league import since Pier Jacob I mean on paper yes um but is the quality still there as a thing because that's the thing Del Pier came here and showed that he hadn't lost a step and was still one of the you know preeminent players in the world and was easily the best player in the league That season you know we had uh Nani at mbour Victory and that you know again a player with a good CV and a uh you know a strong case for being one of the biggest Imports and he did absolutely nothing you know it's there's no guarantees here and um it does though I will say feel a bit like the A- League of old here where these big teams are starting to get these Imports in I saw somebody say right so uh which washed up English player of the Jets going to sign to make it feel like 2012 again but no it's it's good to see but it's also a bit strange right because we've been hearing for months and months and months now since the end of last season about how you know Financial austerity and it's going to be tough for teams to be able to to make these sort of signings we've now got two this season um from the two Sydney clubs we did haven't seen that in you know the last few years where the League's been in a financially similar position so it's like they've just decided oh we're just going to go for it now which I kind of like it's kind of a bit fun um it is worth noting that the The two clubs though Sydney FC and and the Wonders they are well taken care of financially so between themselves and probably Victory and obviously Melbourne City as well they're the four clubs that are probably pretty stable no matter what um and the the rumor is what the salary of about 350,000 which honestly isn't even that bad for not just an import player but you know a designated SL marar type player in the a league um you know I think the what we were hearing a few years ago was ionomes was on probably about the same or even more he was one of the highest paid putting wheel on war so you know that's a a pretty solid deal from the wanders so you know perhaps a shrewd bit of business to be able to get a player of his quality on a relatively decent deal but again it's remains to be seen if he's actually going to be any good because you can have the best CV in the world Adel United signed for Mario back in the day so you know and and that was completely forgettable spell so you know yeah you can have these great players but whether or not they perform whether or not they turn up is going to be something different but I think perhaps with it being you know the case of the wanders have their Visa massive import uh Sydney FC have theirs with the Derby as well perhaps that's going to that'll bring a bit to it and hopefully lift the the level of performance from the two players um especially if they sort of misfire to start with if they can you know that game in particular should be a good point for them to be able to to actually fire up and get into the swing of things all of a sudden they actually have to earn their status as the the big Marquee in the league um I do want to clarify as well when when we're talking about Douglas Costa and Juan mat and comparing them to Del Pierro we ar talking about their reputation when they come into the league like obviously we we've said this as well they have to perform on the pitch if they want to meet that Delp expectation uh but he is exciting will you know Spanish Legend played for Chelsea Manchester United all these big clubs and won this world cup and the European championships that's that's a big name yeah I probably think that this is the bigger name just in in regards to his Premier League playing I think that's relevant to more of the Euros snobs uh here so no even tonight at training um I had a bunch of a bunch of guys there saying that they were going to definitely get down to a game and they they just sit there blankly when I talk about the a league with him so it's it's already working but no it it is massive I think that's the that yeah a a better track record um not convinced about the recent Seasons I think there was only a handful of appearances um maybe even one in Japan you know half the games in Turkey so it's just I think we're filled with OP uh pessimism at the moment because of the the the track record and we said this when Costa was joining but yeah like starage Nani they have not done a service to everyone's kind of hopes so it it feel I I feel like we're instantly kind of yeah pessimistic for sure and it just they they need to both of these players need to prove it on the field um but I I said the same thing with the with the Douglas Costa move definitely these more financially stable clubs it's definitely their chance to kind of get a leg up and and really take advantage of of the lack of funds and and yeah 350 Grand is is pretty shrewd business I agree Jacob so no I'll definitely be at all of the games uh the Derby will be will be massive and I think specifically for the Derby for these uh two sides it's I think that's a game that where these Imports kind of realize oh there's you know actually is football culture here I think there's always clips of them talking about it afterwards um how how surprised they are with the with the culture and especially with those games I think they're the the best we have on offer um in terms of replicating kind of European experiences for sure um so no we're interesting to see how they go and I think it will it'll be a fiery Derby for sure I think the other thing as well with like sort of the comparisons to doer is the cultural impact that Delp had as assigning you know around the league and in football in Australia because there is such a huge Italian Community here is absolute he's a God to them almost you know that was huge it would have been like you know getting maridon in his day sort of thing right like because of just the status that he had as a player um and you know having such a big Italian Community was a big boost whereas you know while there's strong Brazilian and Spanish communities here I don't think they're necessarily as big but I do think that they both have the opportunity to become that sort of cultural icon that Del Pier did in his time at the league especially if like he is saying well if they can perform because you know you've got the chance to have two of them in here at the same time that would be just huge yeah and I know petti doesn't love the idea of putting these Derbies right in round one but they have clear air to Market this Derby up Douglas Costa against one Mata these two European Legends whilst the optimism is still at its peak for their performance levels maybe we'll get a rude awakening who knows but while while the hype is is still there you have weeks on weeks to plug this Derby uh that's going to be a very exciting game another thing that Western Sydney wanders fans would like to hear is that he has a track record for beating Melbourne Victory as well uh when he was playing for V El Kobe beat victory in an Asian Champions League qualifier I think it finished 43 in extra time off memory was a bit of a crazy game uh but yeah has a has a w over meln Victory uh so the wonderous supporters will enjoy that let's get to a bit of uh other transfer news and this is departure from Western Sydney uh because Marcus Unice has been loaned out to PSV einthoven's Reserve team this is a full season with an option to buy and as part of this agreement uh will we understand that West and Sydney agreed to this move because Unis also uh signed a two-year extension with the club yeah so in in that sense it definitely makes sense it did seem like a bit of a a kind of a weird transaction at first but I mean you're getting a fee for the loan um I'm pretty sure as well there was it was about 80 grand um for that which is which is you know a quarter of one Matter's wages so um but yeah so it's there not much risk and then the the transfer fee that they uh you know with the option for is um obviously be substantial enough to to to you know uh make an impact for them so it it all obviously made sense to them and yeah even though the Optics were a bit confusing at first I think this is a a kind of a a kind of good good good view for the for the league so I think you know you you'd want to keep him here looked like one more season and then maybe he could make that permanent move somewhere else but it's a good opportunity to try and break his way into even potentially the the the PSV first team um but would be a good experience in in in the in the youth team there as well yeah with rumor swirling as well um towards the back end of last year where he were having those fallouts with um Marco rudan that he might be headed to Adelaide and he's signed for the partner team of AD United in PSV which I I kind of find quite amusing um but no it's uh it's it's an interesting bit of business like you said will because it does seem confusing uh you know but then you look at look at it from the wand's point of view and they've still got him on their books for two years so if he goes over there and it doesn't really work out for him they still get Marcus unes back right and we've seen the quality that he does have so even if it's sort of it's not enough at this stage to break in over there in Europe they get to keep him still for another year and if it is enough then they've got that as we've been talking about for so many episodes now that leverage to be able to negotiate a good fee for it so um no definitely from the club's perspective it makes a lot of sense so so there's an option to buy in this deal so I'm assuming that a price will be set after 12 months um but yeah no that's psv's option so uh interesting deal there not a transfer as such uh will but the news down out of Melbourne City broken by Nicholas lenon is that Max Caputo has suffered a major leg injury we know that Melbourne City were going to give Caputo the pre-season uh to try and earn the starting spot in belum city in the number nine position uh obviously he won't be able to do that anymore but City do have Visa spots yet to be filled and I'm assuming they will have had a plan in place anyway it seems that that will definitely be activated now yeah it's a shame as he was um built up his minutes towards the end of last season and and yeah you just want to see these these young especially Strikers where there's not too many options coming through um it looked really good in stretches um when he when he had the consistency in minutes so no was looking forward to a to a big season but definitely some scrambling for City to to kind of work out uh what they're going to do instead because yeah as as we said and and last season even they were they were very short on on Striker options so yeah you never want to see this happen especially just out of the season and and not even getting a chance chance to kind of make a stamp early on or anything so no tough but yeah some replacement a replacement will have to be have to be sorted out you know that was a place they could read about some of the local options that might be Jacob did do a wonderful piece on the website ramble australia.com to you're talking about the need for Strikers in the a league and some of the the npl options that um have been coming through during the winter season and some International rumors as well well worth the read uh it is very good let's go to the dub now because the big news out of here is that Michelle Haymon has resigned for camber United the rumors were really going wild on this one she's reportedly received offers from almost every a league women side we know about West Ham as well many many International clubs but in the end camber United somehow uh will have managed to keep her it's you know in kind of a football sense you don't really see these kind of loyalty plays happen very often but she is towards the Twilight of her career it's clear that she has a very big motivation to inspire the next generation of not only young kids but specifically CRA people as well it seems and she had a hell of a season last year she's broken back into the Matilda Squad and CRA United with this big big ownership Cloud that's coupled with the men's attempted expansion a lot of players have left this dubside but they have Michelle Heyman yeah it can't be understanding how how important that is to to kind of just keep a positive positive attitude around the club as well she's such a big draw card to the league um especially with the with the recent Matilda's uh call up as uh recall up as well I think there's a lot more people uh that are you know that are even more knowledgeable of her and it's in a really critical time to to keep her in the league and keep banging in the goal so no so so good to see and yeah as you said I think it just didn't make sense I think West Ham were offering a a shorter deal only to the end of the year and it didn't really make sense I think it was a bit of risk on her part if it kind of didn't didn't work out and then uh she would have struggled to to kind of come back into the league um you know halfway through the season uh so no so good to see her stay and um yeah just a good sign for the club do you reckon Jacob like we saw after the end of the Women's World Cup Courtney Vine was kind of the one big Matilda that stayed behind I think that status has now been handed over to Michelle Heyman yeah I think quite possibly like a passing of the torch but in the other way right cuz it's the younger player passing it to the older player but no it's got a very similar feeling and it I think it's good for the league to be able to keep these sort of players although that sounds quite selfish um you know CU when we're talking about the men's side of things we're always talking about wanting these players to go onto Europe to bigger things whereas with the women's game it's oh no we want to keep them for ourselves um can't really have it both ways but no it's it's great to see and um like will said she's such a big draw card because you're pretty well guaranteed to see her score most games um you know which is one thing um but you know the fact that she's coming off of the back of a really really good season um you know even at the age that she is like you were saying ly sort of in the Twilight years of her career she's still able to put you know a bunch of goals in the back of the net it's a a really really awesome thing to see um I think it's good signs as well for Camry United because they bble to keep arguably their biggest player um and you know it's sort of a case of it's not necessarily uh now it's all going to be fine and everything's going to be perfect and you know but this is sort of the big First Step because I think losing Haymon there would have been a lot of questions asked about what future does this club have but at least being able to keep her for at least you know this short period of time of over this season you can sort of put that back to on the back burner because hey we've got Heyman again so you know I think the unfortunate situation in is and py will be out of touch on this better than I uh when they get back to the board because they're in the goal Coast at the moment um but cber have lost a lot of players already before this hmon situation was dealt with so I think those questions are still there unfortunately um so it remains to be see how they go this season I'm not too optimistic to be perfectly honest uh but the hman news in isolation of course absolutely brilliant one last transfer we've mentioned his name before but Aiden frage has signed with Siri bside salentina oh no Christi salana salana okay Aiden frusti has signed with Siri bide Salona Tana this is a permanent deal we thought it was alone initially but this is permanent Away From Hell Verona so the shackles are freed on him and hopefully he gets back to form and we see him in a soccer shirt soon uh whilst we were busy last week talking to Alexandro chatti the APL fa and PFA jointly committed to phasing out the ceras clause in Australian transfer regulations these organizations concluded that the rule was no longer fit for purpose uh for these reasons the evolution of Australian football brought a go brought a globalization of the football economy increased investment in a-league clubs by International Football Club ownership groups increase in value of A- league players increased interest in players moving between a-league clubs and longer a league player contracts uh of course this all started when we saw that the Alex pson loan move from Bournemouth back to well I shouldn't say back back to New Zealand but to Auckland um obviously just being bought by Willington Phoenix that kind of contradicted the rules uh but we do know what is happening now so this phase out will take out will take place over the next 12 months ahead of the 25 26 Season the first phase a maximum of two players from any multic club network can be loaned back into the a league at any one time uh those are the players that wouldn't have been allowed under the previous Arrangement so there's a small opportunity for a league players purchased more than two registration periods ago but I'm not sure if we'll actually get any real word scenarios with that taking place but the key one is that the APL May apply the salary of a player from either their current parent Club or their previous a league club towards their new club's salary cap so for example Alex pson he earned X salary at Wellington last year he earns y salary with Bournemouth now in this scenario of course you would assume naturally that the Bournemouth salary is higher but that doesn't always have to be the case uh the APL May and the keyword is may take the higher salary and then apply that bmer salary to auckland's salary cap but they are reserving the right to do whatever they want which seems like a bit of common sense because you can never be too certain applying these kind of blanket rules uh but it seems like a good compromise Jacob until we get to a full evaluation of the domestic transfer rules yeah um and look I've spoken out about my dislike of multic Club ownership in football in the past but I think that this is um it's not a symptom of that but I think it's a way of trying to in a way regulate it um because while the Cera clause had that intention it was also very restrictive um and um actually I don't think it was necessarily as well as the the organization should have said fit for purpose um and you know bringing in this thing where you do have those options and that little bit of leeway and the ability to use your you know the judgment to determine what the best way about it is you know on a Case by casee basis I think makes a lot of sense because there will be times where it's clear that teams are gaining a competitive Advantage by having a a you know an extremely rich parent club right and and they're able to to buy up a lot of talent for this other club and then loan them back or or sign them back on to the the the smaller Club in the a league and that sort of stuff but um you know as you said until there's a domestic transfer system where play where players can move between the clubs you know with the clubs paying a fee and you know opening that up this is the only way for clubs realistically to be able to get players that are on contract at another club on their books um and you know it sucks that that's the only way to go about it at the moment but that is the case so know it does make a lot of sense for them to have looked at this and to have determined that completely like having the the ceris Clause where it's uh you know that it's a zero Sun game there's absolutely no way around it to now being right okay you can do it but we reserve the right to be able to punish you in some way whether that be you know Financial with the salary cap or whatever it might be um I think it just makes a lot of sense um you know as I said I'm not a fan of the fact that it has to be in place because of the way that football is headed um commercially but you know desperate times call for desperate measures sort of things it's not desperate but you know the fact that this is the what football has become in terms of having multic Club ownership combined with the fact that there's no domestic transfer system means that having something like this in place you know it's a good and it's a smart move and um like said Loy I think it's actually worded really well to to give the right to be able to do something to you know not just give a competitive advantage to to these clubs that are part of bigger networks so this really does feel well like a precursor to a proper domestic transfer system we know that James Johnson CEO of football Australia has publicly been pushing it for a couple of years now the PFA representing the players uh there'd be no reason for them not to be incentivized to do it uh you know to provide better outcomes for players the APL seem like they're on board now as well part two of this announcement is that a broader investigation into the algs economic uh model will take place review the DTs review salary caps uh which is not to suggest the salary caps will go away in in any sense but potentially manage them a little bit differently all these different kind of economic statutes which govern player contracts and transfers in Australia so it feels like we're heading in a good direction towards this domestic transfer system yeah a review is is definitely well needed I think the landscape in in football in general has just Chang so much and a lot of these rules that might be looked at so such yeah the transfer system um allowing clubs to to pay fees to each other I think a lot of people's Panic about it is oh the clubs don't have enough money but it won't necessarily you know it just stops clubs from from being hindered with weird releases and and and all of this I think it just makes everything smoother and in a way like the clubs can obviously then earn money easy easier as well I think just the the turnover you know might might increase and we see a bit a lot of sideways movement things like that but no this is definitely needed to be looked at for a while and I I'm glad that it looks like it's a priority for for uh them to get it right I think the only you know downside to this whole Alex Paulson rule uh exception to the ceris rule we calling it it was just the it was just the announcement of it it was the timing with the the announcement at the club at Oakland and oh quickly oh we got to kind of you know fix up the the rule to let him in as well so it was just a a bit of clarity and and the Optics of the announcement and timings uh didn't you know do do themselves any favors but overall you can't really argue with the with the benefits that this will have on the league so no excited to see it and maybe yeah things like the salary cap are looked at and the minimums are brought down of of required spending and and and things like like that so this all looks like it's going to be made to to benefit the club so yeah exciting yeah so we do know that multiple clubs approached the APL in May to get rid of the ceras clause which potentially predates Paulson's activity I I don't know uh it'd be very interesting to know that the order of events behind closed doors uh as you say it would be very interesting but the other news out of New Zealand is of that the a leagues come out with a post uh on Thursday formally announcing the new Derby between Wellington and Auckland as the Kiwi Classico uh it is worth noting that Joseph espaco at the a leagues came out and confirmed that wasn't an a leagues decision so I'm assuming it's the clubs football New Zealand whatever those kind of uh bodies uh decided on the Kiwi class go there were a couple options floating about Jacob that the Kiwi Clash got turned down unfortunately uh I don't think people are particularly pleased at least the initial reaction that I've seen online I know there were a couple of names um maybe a little bit closer to home that new zealanders were calling for yeah um well I like that you say that the Kiwi Clash was rejected because I didn't realize that we'd formally submitted a bid for the name but there you go we learn something new every day but know you're right that social media in you know top uh mid-season form already absolutely ripping into everything that's announced um and and this is no exception to that um a lot of the the suggestions that I'm seeing it they just convert it to or translate it into Mari um and having it as the the local native language um you know and it sounds awesome you know it's it's really cool I can't remember off the top of my head what it is um uh but you know it then has that connection of it being inherently you know kiwi or or from New Zealand you know it brings in that that element to it that something like kiwi Classico it does sound a little bit corporate and a bit Bland um but you know it's it's one of those things where more casual friendly it's quite yeah it is a bit but it's also it's like why are we using Classico like you know that has these connotations to World football of you know like the super Classico in Argentina or El Classico in in Spain yeah they've never played each other before I don't know how it's there's none of that history yet to just you know not justify but but you know vindicate such a a Grand name as Classico can something be a classic if it's never happened before you know um but it's also a case of people calling for let names happen originally which I think is is you know it makes sense um it's fair enough because there does seem to be a push and it makes sense from a marketing perspective to be able to have a name that you can you know um attach to a certain fixture because then you can do your marketing around that but you know in Melbourne for instance with you know the the three teams there and there's always seemed like there's felt a need to push certain names for things when perhaps there's a bit of push back from the fans and I think this is kind of in a similar one um but I guess we'll just see I think it might be one of those ones that kind of cheesy to start with but then the the fans love um as it goes on because it just has that sort of a league just quality to it in a in a way um but yeah like you said espito they saying it wasn't an A- League's decision um which is I think quite an interesting um point there that perhaps a lot of these people that are outraged on social media are missing is that it's not you know the the people in The Boardroom at the league that that came up with this it seems to be some other Arrangement instead so I love that you you've attempted to quantify that kind of a leagy kind of traits uh that seems to just Fester around a little bit I think you're on to something there uh the Brisbane raw uh have fallen 2-1 in the semi-finals of the band doka trophy over in India uh they lost to adisha who are a decent Indian Super League team I don't think there's any shame in losing to them while still in preseason uh but an inter international travel which is rare for an Al team I'm looking forward to hearing how it went from players and coaches uh when they get back to Australia also on tour at the moment uh the Australian under 23s they're touring the Pacific Islands at the moment they beat Fatu uh 3-0 I believe the score was on Thursday afternoon that's the Senior Team by the the way and this squad is mostly full of 20 and 21 year olds at the beginning of their new cycle so uh well it's really hard to gauge probably what the results in these kind of Pacific island matches obviously there is a massive golf in resources and quality there uh but you know 3il win can't have too many complaints yeah no it's just it's a lose lose these games isn't it it's the um you lose them you you're terrible and and you win them and oh you should have so this is yeah just about blooding in the kind of the kind of next uh next phase of players and and as you said they're they're you know 20s and 21s so early 20s there so definitely a new phase and no just exciting there's some um some names in there that we've seen before I think all or most of them were were a league y yeah a league players so and the the minutes that they have um you know in their legs already is uh is very promising I think the the average uh professional appearances for for each of them was about 50 per player um as a squad uh so yeah no exciting stuff and just these important matches in the legs um no matter the opposition and and on tour is kind of yeah a perfect way to prepare them for environment so exciting to see and we definitely have a talented crop coming through seem to be having a good time on the beaches over there as well in the Pacific the worst away trip not the there having a good time uh we do have to finish on a rather serious topic uh we heard a little over a week ago I think it was Patrick yck was suspended by the MLS for two games uh the rumors circulating wildly on social media that he was allegedly telling a player that he would see him next Tuesday uh we know that that is not the case uh the in actuality he used the anti-gay F-word in a game in the MLS and was therefore suspended for for two matches under their policy obviously disappointing Jacob on an indidual on an individual sense for yasek uh he will have to learn from this experience uh but also just demonstrating and I saw Vince rugari tweet about this as well lots of people kind of running on this information with nothing really based in fact just a little reminder that it's uh worth not believing everything you see on social media yeah I think it's kind of the mls's policiy has come to bite them here because um while the idea is to sort of stop this Court of public opinion from happening all it's actually done is stoked the fires of it by not revealing what was actually said and letting this misinformation run rampant um and yeah obviously an extremely um just just awful situation really because this is not something that you want to hear you know anybody be saying that alone professional athletes in you know this sort of um a public setting during a match like it's it's really really poor and petti pointed out they tweeted that seems to be a thing for Australian athletes at the moment which is um you know a worrying sign as well that perhaps these issues with homophobia and things just still sort of have their their grip on on Sports um not just here of course it happens around the world and um that that's a really disappointing thing because it does feel like at least on the surface we're making these great strides towards it towards you know acceptance and and you know an equal playing field and and these sort of incidents might suggest that perhaps it's not all as as great as it as it can be and should be um but like you said Loy this is something he has to learn from um and I'm actually surprised it's only a two game suspension considering um that this is what um has been reported to have been said because it's it's a very strong strong word to use and two games does seem like perhaps it's it's not quite a harsh enough penalty but yeah you're going to hope that from here on um Patty asbeck can sort of reflect on this moment and go yeah that that's really not a good move for me to have made and that's not a good thing and I don't want to be that sort of person um because if if it's something that he doesn't reflect on you know how's that going to impact the rest of his career um and obviously from that perspective you don't want that to happen um but also you just don't want it to happen for you know um athletes who are are representing this country really um to to be you know embroiled in this sort of stuff is is not a good look so no it's a really somber note to be ending the podcast on but it's something that obviously we have to talk about um um it's something we unfortunately have to talk about and yeah hopefully um we can move on um ypc Can can learn from this and and understand why it's such a serious thing and and why you know we're trying to make these steps towards eradicating that sort of language from from Sports because it's just not on yeah great strides taken but still a way to go and if you're on Twitter and you see news coming do a little bit of research just a little reminder for that but that will do for this episode of the roundball Australia podcast thanks again to manscaped for supporting our show use code round ball for 20% off and free shipping at checkout will Booth thank you for your company mate thank you uh glad I made it in the end nearly turned off that socceru game so um did make my appearance in the end but yeah good to be you glad you could sit through it jackob Stevens thank you you uh it's been a pleasure as always lucky all right we'll be back on Tuesday uh just before uh that next Saro game against Indonesia thank you all very much for listening at home goodbye