well it's such a legacy and such a marvelous history of a show so that is a big attraction and um the idea of doing that kind of elevated design was certainly um The Lure and another chance to work with Amy what 12 Years a little more than that we started to work together on Two Broke Girls back in 2011 or yeah that's when I interviewed with her and Michael pck King one day I got the job the next day and we've been together ever since I can't quit her yeah I can't quit her either it's vastly different I mean Glenda is the head of the department and she creates the look of of the series she works initially works with the showrunners and determines the look and Designs the sets and then um I'll go out and furnish it but I will get in you know inspired from her research and I'll take pictures and look for furniture and then we collaborate on a lot of the pieces that I get and it's a big collaboration we have a great working relationship um and she inspires me all the time and um you know I've feel so comfortable with her and I think we just work together really well and i' like to say that there's something that Amy does that it just brings like a sense of magic and joy you know at least in my um in how I perceive working um because there's so much character that that um is involved with her choices and you know it's a complete Delight it's fun you know I mean character sets are the most fun I think because you really you you create their background their history where they're from and and you know Glendon and I talk about that and what was where did they come from what did they like and often we get that from the showrunners and the creators but it's fun just shopping for things and finding things that no one else has found before um and and Glenda does that as well well you know her inspiration she inspires me all the time so and we learn a lot it's a learning process you know as we develop the sets it's layer upon layer that you know I think goes to character well the original show uh Frasier has beautiful tastes he has um his aesthetic is uh classic and uh it has a lot of like weight whether it's personal choices about like historical pieces or modern pieces everything is very considered and that was our approach he's in a different city the the building is very different he is more successful now and so you know he didn't and he was on his way to live you to on his on a move to Europe so it's not like he was hauling a u U-Haul from you know for Seattle to Chicago and now his new home in Boston so there are echoes of his past because I think what he liked in you know 30 years ago he may you know he probably still admires so we have some of the pre-colombian uh collection yeah yeah so that we seen in in the first series you know so his his taste follows through a little bit but it's more um 2024 you know it's been developed yes that's the right word and evolved yeah I um got a job working for production designer Bruce Ryan about 18 months after I finished my uh M my graduate degree in architecture and so um I am pretty much doing the same things I would have been doing for architecture because I think what I do is still architecture and so my start was with him I worked with him for many years and then finally on Will and Grace um that kind of launched me as a production designer um well I I studied broadcasting film in school and back in New York and well in Boston and moved out here and just didn't actually know which department I wanted to be in and I just got a job as an arts department PA and bounced around but just kept going back to the art department and work my way up and realized that I kind of had a knack for it and I was a PA and an art Department assistant and a buyer and and just just kept doing it and I was assistant buyer for many years and then made the jump eventually and very happy I did a long time ago so the most memorable projects will always be the ones where um I had to think about something I've never done before like on Two Broke Girls we had to do a bridge set um and we used the Mandalorian stage so it was all um computer generated or at least the big background was computer generated and it's not a mat it was something I've never done before I had to work with the second unit who gave me the actual dimensions of the boards you know the the ground of the boards on the Brooklyn Bridge and we were that specific to the quarter inch and the color of the metal and so what the actors touched I think we built maybe 20 ft 20 linear feet and then everything else was created in a computer it was phenomenal and so I really love that um on Will and Grace we had to do the Statue of Liberty and um we uh sculpted the flame and our actors came up a little stair and then they uh you know went on the I think it's called a Widow's walk or whatever that little balcony is and uh you know and that was incredible to work with sculptors and so well I mean in general there was a big shift in my career before tuber girls and after cuz it's when I met Glenda and Michael Patrick King um both of them forced pushed me out of my comfort zone just it was a different level of design for me Michael Patrick King who is a brilliant man and he has levels you know certain um aesthetic aesthetic that he wants which is's amazing and Glenda does too you know I knew of Glenda because she did Will and Grace I didn't do it and it was such a beautiful show so I was forced out of my comfort zone and just just kept trying to meet up with that every week and it's just um just it just set a new bar for me so she's a total thorough bread she you know she took to the track and she ran