The Billy Bob Thornton Interview

good morning good afternoon good evening wherever you are it's breakfast somewhere so eat up welcome to breakfast with Vinnie Food For [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music] Thought Billy how you doing I'm good how about yourself um I'm better now you know trying to get over this sinus thing but it's better than it was but thank you for coming on man this is a real honor for me I can't tell you it's like I'm a huge fan like millions of other people so you know yeah right back at you oh man thank you man but I'm you know you know I don't I don't really it's like music man you and I came to La about the same time I'm pretty sure I I came out there in 78 when did you go out there 80 yeah okay yeah so really close together so yeah and we we both came out I came out with my drums you you went out and we just we looked for the music and the music found us and and here we are but but you know you you you brushed out into some other things too so uh but but you you started when did you start music you started at a young age right yeah I got my first drum kit I think uh I started playing guitar I was about eight or nine and I had a little nylon string guitar and uh you know I just played you know rudimentary cords and stuff like that and then when I saw the Beatles on Ed Sullivan in 64 when I was eight almost nine uh well I was nine later in that year in August and they were here on February 9th uh I I watched The Beatles and instantly like everybody else thought that's what I wanted do and uh so uh there was something about watching the joy that Ringo had when he played there I mean I loved John and Paul and George and the songs and everything else but watching Ringo when they would cut to him and he would be doing that side swipe thing I was like wow that's what I want to do and here's a funny one for you Vinnie uh before I knew much about the Beatles because it was just sneaking over here in magazine articles and things like that you know and uh when I saw them the first picture I saw of them I thought his name was lwig because it was because it was on his base drum head said the Beatles it said lwi well the drummer's name is Ludwick at that time I I didn't know what a Ludwick drum kit was you know like of that one and um so uh then you know very quickly I learned you know who they all were and we all went nuts and we all started bands so by the time I was nine and 10 I was playing in bands and the first band I was in we didn't have any instruments uh I think well we had the one guitar and so we played with brooms and pots and pans and things like that and then when we finally got drums and and amplifiers and things like that I was probably 11 maybe 12 and uh everybody wanted to be the beetles or the stones so we decided to be the Dave Clark 5 which thrilled me because Dave Clark his name was in the name of the band but he was the drummer you know and he that's right and he played standing up right well yeah well he had a he wasn't standing up he had a high stool oh he looked like he was standing up and he looked like he was standing up but he had a high still he played a red sparkle Rogers kit and uh fortunately by that time I wasn't so dumb to think his name was Rogers but uh uh you know we played catch us if you can and glad all over and uh I like it like that and you know those kind of songs and uh because we wanted to be different it's like everybody's wanting to be the Beatles of the stones so we were them well then the the British Invasion really hit you know in Earnest and we started listening to The Kinks and the animals and Freddy and the dreamers basically whoever was on Ed Sullivan we loved them and at that time you know when you're a kid you don't have this weird jealousy or bias or Prejudice or anything like that we liked all those groups I mean I'm not you know what I mean it's like it's not like Freddy and the dreamers were like you know uh the height of you know uh poetry and rock and roll or anything like that but we didn't care there were guys in suits from England playing music that we related to and that's the fact of the matter you know exactly same same thing happened with me I saw the Beatles on the Ed solvent show and that was it you know Ringo with you know with the wings on the high hat and yeah the Beatles Tunes the whole thing you know was everybody's went nuts and um and so you know I I wanted to get Ringo's drums and nobody had them in stock you know I don't think lwe could make them quick enough they they were they were making them I mean you know like they were going out of style and and so so I ended up my first kid was actually a Rogers kid and um it was one of those like psychedelic red colors you know like a tiger stripe but they were great drums and um I think that they were also using Jasper shells this a little Tech talk here which is what the gret drums were were made uh from you know for for a long long long time but they were great drums you know and and yeah it's the same thing the British Invasion came and we just wanted to play music and the songs were great and it was it was none of that kind of attitude and and you know it's probably easy for people to say oh well that's just pop for you you know people people don't care about really the pedagogy and learning and learning how to be good and that's not true I think that's short short Change you get man because there's there's a lot to be said for the craft of that stuff and writing great songs and and playing them well and you know getting your concept out it's like I I you know that stuff laid the foundation for for all of us I think you know oh it absolutely did and we we didn't uh um you know none of us at least in my little circle there of guys you know nobody was really trained or anything I mean we were just kids who wanted to play you know and uh so we kind of learned it on the Fly you know we're just by the seat of our pants and uh we only had records to listen to our parents would have a record player and you'd listen to these records so you had to figure out the words from the record you had to figure out how they played it from the record everything else you know and uh it's not like we can afford sheet music because we couldn't even afford the records really really most of them our parents got us or we swiped from somebody and uh so yeah it was it was an amazing time and my first actual drum kit because I begged my parents and my dad didn't like music I mean when I say didn't like music I mean there are some people like your dad only liked country or your dad only liked you know being Crosby or whatever yeah D didn't like music period at all at all and he thought it was all stupid and all this kind of thing and my mom loved music thank God but uh anyway so they finally at Christmas one year we had a certain amount we could have spend for for Christmas and we you know we were not rich people a matter of fact pretty poor and uh I finally got a out of Sears catalog or Montgomery word I can't remember which one but I got a little four kit with a you know a symbol that was probably made out of 10 or what yeah you know yeah but I remember seeing this in the ad it said with myar heads that sounded fancy to me yeah and the and the kids that were that were modeling the drums they were like standing behind the drums with their hands all the way out and you know the drums really far apart look like an action figure they they were like on a sitcom when the actors stand there all in a row and talk to each other the drums roll yeah exactly like that and um I don't I I don't think I can play them in that configuration but but one way or the other I got those little drums and they had like a foil wrap on them which of course started disintegrating instantly and I broke the bass drum head pretty quickly and So eventually uh when I was in junior high school I was 13 or 14 there was a kid named Don Clemens who was uh a pitcher and I was a pitcher we played Little League against each other and then Babe Ruth league and into high school and everything and because I was a baseball player also and uh all I ever wanted to do is pitch for the St Louis Cardinals or be a rock and roll star that's all I had interest in so um anyway we used to have these U all these bands around around town uh and in my little town in Arkansas there were a lot of bands for a town of 9 or 10,000 people and everybody was in music and so uh we used to go by a guys houses when we were little kids and watched the guys in Senior High School rehearsing you know and we wanted to be them we thought they were like the Beatles and Don same with me yeah oh yeah I mean the local guys who are older were like Heroes right oh yeah big time and uh don Clemens was selling his drum kit and it was a red sparkle lwig kit it was a four-piece kit but it only had a ride symbol so I really learned to play without a high hat I only had a ride symbol okay and a high hat was like a some kind of sort of uh you know outer space [ __ ] to me I you know wow I've seen those things they go up and down you know and uh so I begged my parents for it and I think they paid $100 which time was a lot of money but you know to their credit they they let me have those drums and that was my first actual drum kit and uh I I learned you know most of what I learned to really play and this was in the days and you know now we got I mean I've got this lwig kit here now I'm you know I'm a lwig guy and they made this kit for me uh which is essentially a Ringo Kit only it's a a different it's Olive and blue rather than the black and silver oyster shell and but I also have two floor toms I've got an 18inch floor also so it's actually a five piece kit but um you know I've I've got a a a LW super phonic which is on there now which is what I use in the studio as well as a black beauty but in those days remember the kits the snare drum had the same Sparkle wrap that the rest of the kit had sure the wood ones yeah right and absolutely that first kit I had was all everything including snare was all red red sparkle yeah that's amazing and and some of those wood snares were amazing too I was uh just talking to a friend of mine just the other day about uh this engineer buddy of mine he he uh I was at his studio and he said look at this drum and he held it up and he had this Rogers uh sparkled old Rogers drum from the 60s and uh snare drum and he said I found this in a garbage can I said you gotta be kidding me and and and it and I played it and it sounded amazing but the thing the thing is that I picked it up and it it was so light I could hold on to it with one finger oh yeah yeah and and I'm thinking man it was like felt like balsawood or something but the drum must have vibrated really and it sounded amazing I'm like you found that out of garbage can dang man get out of here you know but but yeah the super phonic I mean we we always called that the swis army knife of snare drums you know so yeah oh yeah I mean and and the black beauties they're they're they're legendary in that regard so yeah yeah you got some good stuff there you know but but it's interesting that you said you didn't have haats the thing things that look like UFOs you know and and because you know that that's actually probably a really amazing thing because I think at the end of the day sometimes if you take a limb away you know and you try to play a groove it tells a lot like I would like I remember when I was going to to Berkeley in Boston the practice rooms were so small that they were they were literally like closets and you know there would be Tanner players in there playing and and would' be in our dorm room uh you know at night and falling asleep and all of a sudden as soon as we heard silence would scramble to grab our stuff and and grab one of the rooms so we can go in there and practice and so they were really small so so I had to decide I was either gonna play a a kick drum snare drum and a high hat or uh ride symbol high hat and a snare drum that's if I was going to practice bbop if it was either going to be a ride symbol or the bass drum I couldn't fit them both in there so so it taught me a lot and and um but by the same token you know I would always say to people listen you know if you could sit there and and play a Groove and let's say playing at a really slow tempo one of those in between the cracks ones that you're really uncomfortable at right and um you know and then stop playing the high hat justop stop playing it and then let me know what happens you know give me give me a buzz let me know how that goes do it with a metronome too I'll wait but don't don't beat on your leg don't beat on your leg sit on your hand sit on it right don't don't beat in the air don't beat on your leg just get rid of it and and that really I mean I tried doing that I thought wow you know you rely on that to to help you keep time but if you can internalize it without having that that crutch then you could use it more freely know I mean that's what happened to me so so I think it was probably happy accident that you you ended up having a ride symbol and you didn't have the the flying saucers well also the songs that we were playing at that time I mean when we were little kids you know we were playing Hanky Panky by Tommy James and Shawn Dells we were playing uh House of the Rising Sun you really didn't need the high hat you know right right right so those kind of songs that we're play or Ventures songs you know oh yeah Ron and all the you know all those kind of things and then of course you know the solo that everybody had to know was wipe out you oh yeah oh yeah everybody had to know that for sure you had to know that and then later on later on you had to learn the Solo in inagata Dita I was gonna say that then then it was inag deita you know what uh this this buddy of mine told me a story about how that song came about and and how the title and you know I guess somebody went over to um to one of the band members house and you know this is all folklore but who knows it's a good story and and you know I guess one of them was pretty plastered and I said hey come play this song and it meant in the Garden of Eden that's right and I know exactly I read that I've read a lot of Stories on that that's supposedly a true story the Oregon player and singer in Iron Butterfly was a guy named Doug Engel they were out of San Diego these guys and you know you hear you back in those days you heard of the LA bands and the and the San Francisco bands but San Diego they were out of San Diego yeah no kidding so Ron bushy was the drummer and Doug Engel and um uh Eric Brawn was a the guitar player who was a kid he was like 16 or something like like that when he got in the band and then Lee Dorman was the bass player and I believe I can't remember like you said which guy he went over to their house but he actually said I got this song in a god of deita of and he meant in the Garden of Eden misunderstood and then they ended up liking that and they kind of just did it is awesome you know I mean is who I mean I don't think anybody would have set out to write a song called in AATA Devita but it sounds I mean I'm sure like dozens and dozens of people wanted to write a song called In the Garden of Eden yeah exactly that's another happy accident I mean it was great and and you know it's I'm not sure if that was one of those things that was it might have been on the ground floor of when these long jams were happening I mean some of these things would take up a whole side of a record and none of us got tired of it we loved it you know it was just just Jam you know just even just jam on one cord and whatever happens you know and it it was just a part of the whole exploratory thing of it I think is just um I don't know it's just kind of gone away which is kind of sad you know but um very sad you know how we in in our generation uh we kind of followed the music but you know people nowadays they say you know it's like well you're just a dinosaur and you don't care about you you know you know progressing or anything like that but the thing is is from 1955 to 75 all the good [ __ ] was done I mean it's like Zappa said he said all the good music's been written by guys in powdered wigs and stuff so yeah I mean there's there's a certain truth to that but also in rock and roll it's already been done so you have two choices you can either start making up [ __ ] that people like to dance to or get you know hire drunk to or mourn to or whatever it is or you can keep paying tribute to rock and roll because you're not going to get better than that all you can do is pay tribute to it so uh that's what and by the way there are no radio stations for it there's you know when we were kids the uh the radio stations uh um we had k y Little Rock Arkansas and uh you had your morning DJ guy Doc Holiday who was the guy who had had way too much coffee you hey everybody it's Doc Holiday on Ki you know that guy and then you had the late night guy who had a show called Beaker Street which was the Underground Music where I first heard you know all the cool [ __ ] I heard uh and his name was Clyde Clifford and Clyde Clifford's Vibe was hey it's speaker street with Clyde Clifford and they get spooky noises behind him and you knowm FM right because it was real high five for sure so you know we had that but James Taylor and Black Sabbath were on the same radio station and now they have 75,000 stations and so now James Taylor is on the old guy soft romantic song Channel and and Black Sabbath is on the heavy metal old school Channel or whatever it is you know what I mean and what we had was all rock and roll I don't give a [ __ ] if it was like bread or Ted nent it was on the same radio station you know it was all and roll yeah and people got everything they got they got everything they didn't compartmentalize it you know and and have to think that just one thing or the other and and in the concert promoters I mean it was even before my time but I heard about this um you know from people firsthand that they were just you know like um you know the birds and and Buffy St Marie and then Miles Davis you know and the Mavish Orchestra and and and um uh I don't know you know cred Clear Water we're all in the same bill you know and they would just throw stuff and let it stick and people just sat there and went yeah cool you know they just took it in they didn't already have a bias they didn't already have this thing where they thought oh that no I have to go to this state it wasn't none of that existed and and I'm not sure why it even had to exist but that's yeah I I remember that too and you know you're talking about dinosaurs and no that's baloney it's quality because these kids man even today I see kids that are 15 walking around with ACDC and Black Sabbath shirts and they listen to it so it's it's a testimony to their staying power that stuff you know well you know you know what I find Vinny is that it's not the it's not the old guys like us or even the even the 50 year olds or whatever and it's not the kids and their teens and their 20s the kids in their teens and 20s are listening to the stuff we listen to like you said it's sort of that part between 30s to mid-30s through mid to late 40s that kind of don't pay much attention to it I mean at least that's what I've found because a lot of kids my kids you know who just my daughter's 19 knows all about the Beatles my sons are are 29 and 30 and they you know I I brought them up listening to the Almond Brothers and said look I know you think this is a southern rock band but listen to this there's not only blues and rock in there there's Jazz listen to Dicky Betts play on in memory of Elizabeth exactly I'm saying and so and johanny Johansson you know oh absolutely I mean like a jazz drummer yeah yeah I mean the two of those cats Butch trucks and and and J those two guys the way they played together was seamless it was like they were they they each had half of a soul that joined with the other half a soul yeah what the other was going to do it was incredible and uh and back to what I I was going to say earlier which is when the British Invasion came along I mean first we were listening to Elvis and and Buddy Holly and all all those people and then when the British Invasion came along that was our thing somehow we all that resonated with us and then the Beatles started to grow into something else the next thing you know when they were doing like you know getting into pot and acid and things like that and the next thing you know they're doing a day in the life and all this and then as the Beatles grew we went with them but it wasn't it wasn't a new thing I want to hold your hand and A Day in the Life have a link together there's it was like the same band and you knew it you could hear it Y and and so then when the as the Beatles grew we grew and then in 66 and 67 when it turned from and I think' 67 in particular when rock and roll changed to rock and then all of the sudden we're listening to Deep Purple and uh and traffic and and cream and you know all these people and I'm listening at 11 and 12 years old to beefart and the mother's invention and uh the bonso dog band out of England and you know this kind of stuff and here I am a little [ __ ] bucktooth kid with black glasses in Arkansas listening to Captain beefart and the bonso dog band in the mother's invention because we saw something that was beyond where we were you know we thought wow there's another world out there and we'd kind of like to be part of it so we were all driven to where we are these days we're given who we are and that's my sort of poetry on that part well that that's that's very profound that's that's a powerful statement right there that's a t-shirt you know but it's true it's true and and you know you're talking about uh Growing With The Beatles and stuff it's because you know we artists we we sort of stayed with them in their in their their their progress um it was sort of like they come out with a record and then they come out with another record and it didn't render the first record obsolete it was just another uh chapter in their story and then the next record and it didn't render the first two records obsolete it was like just a building upon and and we followed that and we grew with it and and we just became part of that lifespan and and now it's like you know give me the hook in 10 seconds or we're out of here and you know it better not be more than three minutes and and all these elements are getting stripped away as well like um just just elements of Melody Elements of Harmony and and and the Rhythm you know it's autotune and just real grid oriented and and and um yeah I mean big difference and you know and and and as far as that goes there goes the stories with it you know there there went the stories and and and and I think you guys to me sound like that you know you're encapsulating these stories and you know condensing them in in the lyrics that you have you know and we've I think we've we've lost touch with just I don't know storytelling by and large in that in that regard I mean does that make sense completely I it's you know we have forgotten the story I mean you look back see the thing about it is with the Box Masters we have a lot of songs that just sound like songs that are based on our love of the pop rock of the 60s but if you listen to lyrics sometimes they're very heavy and like the song kicks by Paul River and the Raiders I mean it's about uh you know tell trying to tell this this girl you you can't keep doing this dope it ain't good for you I mean this was in 66 or so yeah I mean you know what I mean it's like it was pretty heavy in in a two and a half minute pop song and and we can do that it's possible yeah to make a a a record that because now I mean they're not going to listen to us play a song that lasts the whole side of of an album first of all they're only streaming anyway but uh you know you can make a three and a half minute song that does tell a story and I talk to my buddy Dwight yokom about this all the time about lazy songwriting I mean people are out there rhyming you know pillow with love and stuff like that it's like you know I mean I I don't think you know Keats and those guys really appreciated as poetry but um but one way or the other uh you know when when uh when these things were going on you know when we were following these bands along the thing about it is is it didn't change to another social thing now you can be I mean I won't name any names because I don't believe in that I don't like to put people down you know publicly or anything so it's just you know it's it's not worth it it's not fair to them because God bless them whatever they get I'm all for them yeah but there are people who are gigantic stars who make a lot of money uh doing concerts for a 100,000 people who literally have three or four lines in the song but it's to a beat that feels really good when you're drunk on your ass so exactly it's not that we didn't do uh you know drugs or alcohol we would I mean I would you know take acid and listen to Pink Floyd and gentle giant and yes and you know everybody else I mean it was you know that's what we did but but that was this experience it wasn't like this sort of you know uh we weren't like chimps or something you know just out there sort of whatever makes us feel good just jump around and look at the shiny ball you know it was there some thought into it and yeah and and and you know and by the way uh you know we uh I mean at the risk of sounding like the old guy who's putting this down we were we came up when it was invented exactly I got your back on that man I me like we were there we saw it happen and then so and here's my goal in my life and I want to get you and other people involved to try to Lobby someone at corporations uh if you notice there are country stations of various types they're Hip Hop stations rap stations of various types pop stations how many rock and roll stations are there where you can play new music on there there aren't any so I mean they have a few independent you know stations you know like called India dck or whatever and you know that's fine that's good I'm glad they are but if any of these bands there are a lot of bands like uh for instance let's say uh uh Bad Company Aro speed wagon and Foreigner bands like that to make a living now they have to all three play together and go and they can't sell out even an Amphitheater let alone a Coliseum now unless they make it three bands on the bill and that's where they make their money and they sell their records in these concerts and all that they're not they're not selling records no well nobody I mean in a sense you know right but they're not even selling on streaming because nobody cares about all all the rock bands are on stations called classic rock so if you listen to the classic rock stations these are not new songs these These are songs that were the and and not that they're they're the most popular songs the band had that's all they play yeah if you hear zezy top it's lrange or tush one or the other maybe man you know or something if you hear Boston it's like more than a feeling it's like whoever it is you're going to hear whatever their hits were their biggest hits on a classic rock station and there's nowhere and there's still rock and roll bands around I mean box Masters are around me you know I mean whether you like us or not we're a rock and roll band and we're touring and we're making records with vinyl and CDs and we love our fans and we have a great cult following but they can't just turn on the radio and listen to us you know they have to buy our records at the shows or on the website or stream it or whatever and since we're not social media guys we're you know people get like 500 billion followers or whatever we got like I don't know 7,000 I mean because we don't do it really it's the weird it's a weird phenomenon now yeah and the whole idea of of getting that many followers and it just like if I look and see what what gets you know 10 million views it's like somebody in in one corner of the screen uh reacting and commenting on stupid things people do in a mall you know stuff like that and I'm thinking okay that's where we are culturally that's where we are now it is you know and not only that but but radio stations breaking a band or with AirPlay and forget about the fact that P poola was involved okay look there's just been Hanky Panky and in whenever the model has changed you just you know me the new bus same as the old bus right I mean some things never change but the point is is that you could break a band and the whole thing was to to get to to buy records and and and then you know back the tour and you know I'm sorry man but I'll jump on the you know the old Boomer bandwagon here and say you know I'm I don't think this new model is necessarily better there's a hierarchy in in social media too and even though there are opportunities and people say well you just don't know what they are and you don't know how to get them I'm like look please I'm not I'm not an idiot I'm not I'm not technically illiterate I've been into this stuff since the first max came out in the little TV screens and right you know I've just kept kept in it just because it's become a part of our way of life but but it's just it's just you know part of the I think that that as the shift happened and people stopped paying for music and then it became this freefor all you know where we've gone beyond Andy warhol's thing of everyone will be famous for 15 minutes yeah we're we're way past that that it's you know people not only do they not want to listen to songs that take up a whole side but but it's they just you know the streaming thing it's the attention span's different the Ze Guist is different now it's like I don't think the environment like I've even talked to Legacy artists I say Legacy artists because you know everybody you know people from multi-generations know their hit songs and they go back and play their hits from you know a long time ago and they're saying yeah nobody wants new songs and I've I've had conversations with you know at least one in particular saying you do really believe that just go into the studio make some new songs and see what happens you know you know why don't why don't you just do it instead of thinking that your fans don't want any new songs you know and there are people who do want them I think so too yeah and that's who you do them for you do things people who do want it and if you get new fans that's awesome if other people come along that's great but there are people who want it and I I just wish they would start to have a couple of radio stations where you could play rock and roll and by the way one thing about the old days which was awesome was that that which doesn't happen anymore uh now they take somebody and they go oh wow she or he is 21 and they're really pretty we'll make them a pop star and you can uh yep you kind of had to have something back then in order to become one it wasn't as easy to create someone because there wasn't a lot of hygiene she could pull to make them seem like they were a pop star and and we also the record labels in those days they were guys who they were almost like Louis mayor at MGM they were like you know big cigar chewing dudes you know who they didn't really know what this stuff was but they had a few kids that worked for them and they said hey do people like these kids yeah they do ah sign them up you know exactly then what happened was you would have some of the famous bands that we grew up listening to you don't know this at the time because you just like everything you don't love rock and roll so you listen to them but then you find out later how many of those bands that we loved got bad reviews didn't sell records and the label they would have three or four albums come out and wouldn't get dropped from the label and then all of a sudden their fifth record becomes a gigantic hit and they become whoever it is you know Jethro t or whoever it was and uh and now if your first thing doesn't happen you're done you know toast exactly they would develop people back then and they would believe in them and cross- collateralize things you know and so therefore it wasn't like oh we're gonna lose money if this guy doesn't make on his first record you know and and you know and and it happened where you know Hendricks went to England and then you know became famous in America and and etc etc etc but but it's true absolutely I mean going back to what you said before about people you know I remember going to this concert once and it was a it was like an 80s concert somebody invited me and um there were like three or four 80s bands on on the bill and what struck me as soon as I walked in it was at this place uh Universal Amphitheater it doesn't exist anymore they tore it down it it was a great place um and so I go in there and and the first thing that struck me was that on with every one of these bands you know there were the audience was at least three generations and they were all doing this yeah you know and and it was like you know there were kids that they didn't know who these people were when the when the bands were new they just thought oh it's got a good beat and yeah I kind of like this and they just you know what I mean so it's kind of like I think that there's there's a bit of this whole thing that you know there comes a new crop of Executives that come in and say no we got to make this fresh we got to modernize it whatever that means it's like who are you trying to kid you're just putting a different bow tie on it it's all the same [ __ ] you know it's like it's like I remember once hearing like 180 beats per minute when I was in England once you know and and it was just like and I'm thinking who named that like it's just fast sped up Boogaloo so some guy probably thought I'm going to call it un0 BPM I'm gonna name it that it's like a dog peeing on a tree you know what I mean like I gotta put my thing on it to to make you know so it's some original and he just took the the drum machine and just sped it up it's all you did and it's just a Boogaloo be you know what I mean but but but not getting you know off track here it just makes me think that people will just respond to stuff they respond to stuff viscerally and we don't need Eggheads to tell us what's good and what isn't just let the artists put their stuff out there just let them do it and just you know let let it see if it sticks you know people will respond you know and and Market it Market it you know I think people have a hard time marketing stuff now because it's like a free-for-all there's no more Gatekeepers you know no for sure and we don't even know what's real anymore because I mean honestly when when I used to you know when I was growing up and I would buy a live album by somebody the reason I bought the live album is because I wanted to hear what they sounded like live yeah exactly it's not I didn't buy it to hear the same [ __ ] studio record they made it's like you know and and this is not only on the records or streaming or whatever it's even in the performance live performances it's like what you got another band behind the stage plus a guy running a a machine and stuff like this I mean believe me I mean love us or hate us if we screw up live you'll hear it you know yeah it'll be an honest screw up and you'll own it right and is the the I wanted to hear the leag guitar player do a different solo than he did on the record you know right yeah and if he's struggling great you're you're gonna AB in there with his struggle man you know sure and and and if they and if they draw it out and the sort and the solo section instead of being eight bars is now 16 bars that's awesome you know yeah it is great it's like it's SE of the pants I mean I Grateful Dead did a lot of that too where it's like now everybody's like I'm got to be perfect and you know I'm gonna shred and I've got all these chops in and everything's perfect and you know I'm raising the bar I'm super human and it's like I want to see a guy struggle a little bit maybe you know it's like okay you know it's like maybe he only knows four chords but he means the [ __ ] out of those four chords and when he learns that fifth one he's going to mean the [ __ ] out of that too you know you know what I mean it's like I don't and and I mean I've been in a lot of musical situations as a performer and and I'm saying this because I just see this the the the focus is changing into this whole thing where it's like yeah everybody's got chops now it's like okay well what about content you know what about and and and and not saying that you can't have chops and have content because I remember I did the same thing I went to see all those bands live when they came out and I loved them yes Emerson Lake and Palmer all this guy you know lead Zeppelin and you know okay but the thing is they were servicing the songs man they were servicing the music and you know just being some kind of virtuostic robot wasn't their priority it was it was about them the song playing the freaking song You Know well there was no way that robertt plant could do a whole show and sing the way it was on those records he was sing them to the best of his ability live you know I mean because that was some crazy [ __ ] they did and you know and you know Eddie Kramer did some awesome [ __ ] in the studio I'm sure but it was just it was only using Echo Chambers and tape loops and things like this that they would do in those days it wasn't just like literally going out on the street and saying hey come here a minute honey you're hot and so are you dude come here you're going to be a pop star here's how it's GNA happen and they don't even have to show up I mean I've been in recording studios where the artist never came by except for maybe one night for a couple hours we we stay in the studio when we're recording a record we start at noon we're here till 1:00 in the morning we love to be in here I mean I can't imagine being an artist who comes in and gives you a sample of my voice or my guitar player or drum play whatever it is and then I leave and you guys make the record I mean the whole point is that we want to be you know what's missing to me Vinnie is a community I think what happened is if you notice if you look at any of these award shows which to me these days are just stupid all of them in any form of media uh medium but uh we're missing a band we're missing people in bands and if you see these award shows it's all individual artists you know I mean you see the band here and there I mean you see them it's not like they've disappeared but for the most part uh you don't see five people come out there with a stack of gear playing songs live in front of an audience you see an individual pop star with one of those little microphone deals that comes around off your ear here on the your mouth out on a marble stage with no gear and I was a roadie you know when I was in my lens early 20s I worked for some pretty big bands as a roie I had and I was like you know 140 PB long-haired skinny hippie lifting you know Altech Lancing cabinets you know voice of the theaters and stuff oh yeah and and you would have 16 to 30 or 40 of these damn things on each side of the stage and giant trusses with lights and stuff and like stacks of amplifiers and when we went to those shows that was part of the show now you're looking at one person in the middle of a marble stage with a little microphone and you don't even know if they're singing and you don't know where the music's coming from and uh it's it's not rock and what we wanted was we wanted rock and roll because we wanted three or four other guys or gals to be with us and be a team of people yeah toward the same thing and we wanted to feel like we that we wanted to be the Rolling Stones or the Beatles or The Kinks or the animals sure or whoever it was yeah and and that camaraderie and that Fellowship that you have with your bandmates and to get in the studio and stay in there for hours till you can't even play anymore to go out on the road together I mean we we have one bus there there are 10 of us on one bus and people say why don't you fly or it's like why I'm just a guy in this band I want to be with those guys yeah easier to just fly from Huntsville Alabama to Nashville why don't you do that it's like because I want to be on the bus with my buddies who I've been with for years that's why I'm with you a thousand percent yeah a thousand percent I've done the same thing and it's it's you know we have a bunch of laughs and just the whole thing everybody gets to know each other it's just there's nothing like it man I agree the community and and there has been a kind of a conspicuous you know diminishing of bands in that in that regard but you know I'm hopeful that there there might be a turnaround and I'll tell you what I think I think this whole AI thing is going to get so nuts that I mean we already don't know what's real and and what isn't real but I I think that that the one thing that could happen that I'm I'm hopeful for is um that you know it'll get so nuts and people not knowing what's real and what isn't real that they'll probably want to go and see live gigs just so they can go oh there's a real humans up there man they're they're actual people you know I can almost touch them and and you know yeah I heard the guy doing a sound check and he went on his guitar and the sound came out of the amp and the guy hit the drum and then the sound emerged you know and and it's like yeah it'll be this whole thing again where it may be not and it may sort of you know incite this this this this thing to happen because if you you know you rely on any other kind of media nobody's gonna know what's real you know sure and it could be a good thing it could be a good kick for that to happen again where you know versus people just I don't know going to Raves and you know taking selfies while a bunch of fireworks goes off and a guy's up there going like this with a turntable and you know look there's something for everybody so I'm not going to sit here and say oh you know for sure yeah but there's got to be some balance definitely I agree and I I think that you're right about that and I think people I think there will be a backlash and I do think people are coming around to that again and and also to your point about there's something for everybody look you know my daughter and I used to take these drives around town and I would listen to her pop music and she's listening to Imagine Dragons and Taylor Swift or whoever it was I don't you know you know disparage anyone for for what they do I mean I there is a place for everything it's just that you know you can't shut out everything else I mean that's my problem with it it's it's like there's room for everybody so let's let rock and roll be a thing again is all I'm saying it uh without having to go out and see like tribute acts to Pink Floyd or somebody you know it's like you you know it's like let's let's get a let's get a a format for everybody to be involved and uh you know it's I saw I saw some kind of thing uh I don't we have an Instagram for the band but I don't I don't know how to do any of it JD does all of it but uh uh somebody I think maybe my wife because she's into all that and she sent me a thing the other day and said something I don't remember exactly what it was but it was something about when I was growing up we had had there was World War II and then this happened and that happened named a bunch of heavy stuff right and so when people you know a thousand years from now find that stuff and they'll go oh wow and then from now from this current time you know they'll wonder why there are so many pictures of each other standing there in their bathroom mirror taking a picture of themselves saying yeah you know it's like here's me brushing my teeth that's right you know it's like I mean you can all you can say we're dinosaurs but at the same time you can't say my God that's so [ __ ] cool you know to look at countless pictures of of of Johnny and Mitsy brushing their [ __ ] teeth exactly or a cat on a skateboard I mean I get it I get it cats there are cats who have been trying to ride skateboards they're not Elvis Presley I I I mean maybe I'm insane but that's my opinion yeah no I get it man I don't I don't think so I just think I mean I don't know if if it's just a media problem and what can be done in order to to make that to make that happen again you know there's it's it's a it's got to be some kind of a focus on the media but do you you guys I mean what would you like you know the Box pass what would you say is like like you know your your primary overarching message that defines the band's identity and what it is if there's one thing you're trying to get across to people or that you hope that you're G to get across to people and that is a big part of it and like I said we don't have you know a hundred million fans you know we play rock and roll clubs we play amphitheaters we play theaters and we fill them up for the most part and those are our base fans and like I said we welcome more fans we'd love it but we make the records for the people who need them and want them and we try to write music and lyrics that mean something and we try to pay homage to the people in our history and I think we're losing history very quickly and I think it's amazing it's being lost these days is history not only in music but in everything if you don't know your history you know that's what I tell young artists of any type whether they're in movies or music or whatever it is learn your history first that's what you need to know where did this come from who did this what made this something that people responded to and so maybe Chuck Barry can't play guitar like say Steve VI or somebody or slash or whoever it is but uh they listened to him and it made them want to play it so that definitely made Keith Richards want to play it there you go and and so there's something about the Simplicity and that sort of poetic nature of rock and roll that young people responded to and so we just keep trying to do that and we do it for the young fans of ours and we do it for the fans that are our age who still need it and so all we want to do is come out there and be honest and and and connect with people and I think Community is a great word like you said yeah and and and history I mean that was uh I couldn't agree with you more I think I think that in a way you know you you and I have been joking about this all you know dinosaurs and Boomers and this that and the other thing but really there some cultures and and it wasn't that long ago in our culture where people respected their elders and not only that but it's the idea that we've lived more life so we actually know like I actually know what it's like experientially to leave my keys in the car without having to car stolen I know I lived like that so you know I don't care what Google's going to tell you you know I could tell you that it can be different cuz I lived it and I could tell you what it was like you know more so than any kind of distortion you're going to find just by looking something up and waiting to see if the fact Checkers have got it right who's factchecking the fact Checkers you know so it's like you I mean it's you can go on any side of the aisle I always tell people that I'm a radical moderate uh because I believe very strongly in certain things but they don't necessarily belong to any side or anything and then sometimes they do it's like oh these guys I think are right or these guys you know that's a good idea too so you know best idea wins and as far as I'm concerned but uh but I think what's funny these days is there's so much whatever the narrative that they want to push whoever they are whatever that narrative is they're get going to get those people elected on either side of the aisle and the middle is never going to be elected they want to kill the middle because the middle is where critical thinking lives and critical thinking is exactly what they don't want and so uh you know I I believe when you talked about fact Checkers there's always somebody debunking everything and it's like well are every always people saying Ah that's just a conspiracy nut I mean there have been conspiracy if you and I right now say you know what Vinnie you and I ought to go blow up Sunset Boulevard or whatever that's conspiracy you know what I mean and so yes conspiracies exist and then there are conspiracies that are [ __ ] ridiculously stupid some that are real and and but but there's so much stuff that's shut down and they push whatever they want to push I think the media is worse than it's ever been I believe that you can't watch any station on television and hear the truth because they all have an agenda and we don't know what the hell's happening no and and you know you and I both are fans of a guy you played with Frank Zappa yeah and Frank years and years ago knew this stuff you you know he was saying this when nobody was saying it yeah he was very astute that way I mean I think that a one point he's going to run for office and and I don't you know I I couldn't if somebody said well do you think he was liberal or conservative I'm like look I don't know I think he was common sense um there's some noise there I don't know what that was he supported free speech and now free speech is really under attack I mean you're you're you know we could really run with with this football right now Billy but I you know we really could oh yeah it's it's so under attack I never thought I would see this happen in in my lifetime so you know doesn't matter what side of the aisle you on it's like it's a real thing and um yeah so well you know you know what we have fun doing Vinnie is people have fun telling crazy stories about when they were growing up we've we've loved it since we were born we love to hear about oh you never believe this what this guy did and and and you laugh about it and you have a a great joke or whatever yeah yeah yeah now I can tell you this I mean as a baseball player of myself and and a baseball fan you know growing up uh I and I played ball throughout till I was 18 I was injured in a major league camp and and then I didn't and then I went on the road as a roadie and you know never look back but I followed baseball and still do and in the old days you know Billy Martin and and Mickey manell and those guys were drunk while they were playing and Babe Ruth was eating like 17 hot dogs in the [ __ ] Dugout and like drinking pints of whatever it was he drank and going out with hookers and all these kind of things okay so now if a guy who's on the Dodger or the Yankees or the Cardinals or or Tampa Bay Rays whoever it is if they say something wrong they don't have to eat hot dogs and smoke pot in The Dugout or drink whiskey and play the game or or like what was his name doc uh Ellison the guy for the Pirates Who was on acid and pitched the game um but you know now they can say the wrong word or phrase or the wrong opinion in an interview and the next thing you know they're traded or gone or not on their social media thing so the fact that you can actually ruin someone's life because they expressed an opinion is really sad it's out of control I mean it's just wrong r o n on all levels you know it's it's kind of criminal really you know I mean in my opinion and and you know I'm all for you know being a freedom fighter and and just fighting back against it as much as possible and you know and and and I think that that in the US we have we can do that um this is the last chance Texico man I keep saying it over and over I mean we can do it because we have state sovereignty we have the 10th Amendment we have you know protective measures it's like if if there's too much overreach and we got enough people in enough states with enough balls to to say Noah stand up not no we ain't playing that bro you know then you know it can be it can be arrested you know so that's that's really what it is but man you hit the nail on the head and then some so but so but but back to the to you guys you guys are getting ready to go on the road uh like real soon right very soon we we actually uh the guys get into town uh JD and I are the only guys here n La everybody else is from Florida and one guy from Tennessee and uh they all get here day after tomorrow and uh we go through November 4th the last shows in San Diego uh we're going all over the US in Canada uh well we mostly western Canada we got five shows in Canada sort of Vancouver through Winnipeg there and Edmonton and yeah uh so uh yeah and uh we did Europe last year which was which was great and uh so yeah we're getting ready to go on tour we just finished up a new record uh which I sent you a copy of which is not even mixed or Master that's uh it's called Pepper Tree Hill it's uh which is the name of the studio yeah that's great I mean for not being mixed and mastered it sounds amazing and thank you for that well that's that's up to JD there JD's isn't it amazing when you're partner in the band like he and I started the band together there were five of us on stage JD and I started this together 18 years ago with the Box Masters and uh before that I was doing solo records and tours and JD worked for me a little bit on that and when we F formed this thing I was like how lucky am I that the other guy who started this band with me is an a world class engineer and so our rhythm guitar player isn't is the engineer and so there's no there's no middleman and we produce our own stuff for the most part I mean Jeff Emer you know the Beatles engineer yeah Jeff uh uh produced One record on us and then he passed away uh he would probably still be doing it now uh you know on our records but uh amazing he was it was awesome and uh but uh one way or the other yeah we go tour and then when we get back uh then I got to fly all over the place to do press for a thing and then uh two or three months off my daughter goes off to calp and uh I'm going to be with her for part of her first semester and uh great then I Texas for five more months and then we do another tour next summer and make another record so it's kind of a full life for an old guy you know no it's great and that whole cycle of you know making a record and then going out and touring it and you know and I'd love to be able to see you guys too man I really would so would love for you too man yeah it would be awesome and hopefully uh like I said we mainly play theaters amphitheaters and big rock clubs but in La we always play a small show and the reason we play a small show it's either the Troubador The Canyon Club or the mint and the reason we do that is because here we know everybody and everybody wants a comp we can't give it to them because they only give you 12 or 14 of them and that's taken up with the family yeah so we just have to say it would be like the remember the baked potato when people go over there you it's like yeah you just go to the baked potato yeah yeah exactly oh man I played many of times in that place but yeah it's sort of like I'd be on the road and all of a sudden here I am coming back to LA I'm gonna play somewhere like the Hollywood ball and all of a sudden the phone calls would come in you know and I'd call them the Heyman calls right because it was always like hey man been a minute so yeah yeah like nine years yeah it's been a minute you know you know yeah I'm still alive and yeah you know so you're playing and and there you go the man yeah we're doing the mint on November 3D this year uh we' played there several times before it's on November 3D at the mint and it only holds like 300 people you know is great but it's awesome because we don't get a chance to do that very often yeah and it reminds you of when you we coming up playing places you know and and it's always fun there we always have a great time there or or any of those you know Canyon Club all of them oh yeah they're great places man I mean these small clubs they're kind of like the musicians version of the theater I guess in a way but but you know like you're talking about amphitheaters and theaters those are my favorite my favorite venues because they're just big enough but you you still you're still in touch with the audience you could still feel them yeah but they're not out of control and you know otherwise it's like you know sometimes you know these shows get so big it's like Ping into the wi you know oh for sure the 1500 to 3500 SE theaters those are awesome and and they sound great too right they sound amazing they always have the best facilities they're they're terrific audiences are very receptive and you can always get them up and make them act like it's a club anyway you know they they want to and yeah but when you know we've played in front of a hundred, people before at festivals and different things like that are opening for somebody yeah people say well don't you get nervous in front of that many people it's like well no we can't see them I mean that's when you're the least nervous you're the most nervous with 250 people there and they can all see you you know yeah exactly exactly so man I'll be looking forward to this and the new record what's the new record called again Billy uh the one we're touring with is called love and hate and desperate places but the new one that's not out yet oh that's called Pepper Tree Hill and that'll be our record next year yeah great man we all be looking forward to that too well well um Billy thank you so so much man this has been a real real real kick doing this and man we I felt like we could go on for hours because there's so much to to talk about and it's just great to get into all this with you so maybe maybe who knows maybe there'll be a part two you know for sure I'm available and would love to talk to you anytime yeah same here all right Billy you guys you guys take care and and and thank you so much for being on thank you so much for having me on I appreciate it all right thanks for listening stay tuned for the next episode of breakfast with Vinnie [Music]