Penn State freshman buzz headlines latest updates from preseason camp

[Music] welcome back into the lions 247 podcast first time in a while we're coming to you on a Friday this is episode number three of the week our full first full week of August there's a lot on the table right now if you missed it we had an episode pop on Thursday afternoon immediately after the commitment of Cameron Smith linebacker from St Joe's Prep in Philadelphia top 247 Prospect in the 2025 class he flipped his commitment from the Duke Blue Devils and Manny Diaz over to the NY Lions on Thursday we broke that down with Tyler calvaruso we talked about the impact of this Edition what it might mean for Penn State getting the doorm at St Jo's prep which they haven't signed a player from there in about a decade so this could be a key step for one of the Premier programs really across the country when you talk about power for football talent and additionally we talked about some other names to know as flip season arrives and with Penn State now situated at 24 overall players in that 2025 class we do think there is room to maybe add others who are currently committed elsewhere so if you missed that we also had uh 12 solid minutes with Devon J Thomas senior defensive tackle tacked on at the end of that episode so a lot coming your way from Devon from Tyler calvaruso uh we haven't come with three episodes in a week and a while so I wanted to make sure that one wasn't kind of swept under the rug make sure you catch out episode from Thursday if you tuned in to episode number one this week week back on Monday it was a big one it was coming out of Penn State preseason media day and Daniel gallon joined me for that one and he joins me again now here in the Lions 247 podcast because once again we're fresh out of a Penn State preseason event which is going to give us a little more Intel and perspective on how things are shaping up now you know three weeks from tomorrow is kickoff down in Morgantown it's happening fast and Daniel you and I Mark Brennan Grace Brennan our Lions 247 coverage team were out on the practice field in huba Hall and outside yesterday as Penn State had their seventh practice session of preseason camp working their way toward that West Virginia matchup not only did we get to see 15 20 minutes of practice action but we got to hear from James Franklin defensive coordinator Tom Allen a couple different team veterans and so the table's really set for us to dive in and this is going to be kind of standard operating procedure for us the rest of the way week in week out we're going to be bringing more content we're going to have a lot of interviews along the way and and we're kind of full full system go right now at lines 247 and here on the podcast yeah I think you made the comment after we got out of practice last night where it's like this is it till December you know going in seeing practice getting our observations up coming back talking to guys you know uh you know getting together afterwards figuring out you know what was the most interesting things that we heard and then getting on with it you know it's uh it's still kind of fall camp for us too in kind of getting back into the swing of things but you know it does really feel like like we're you know in season and that it's almost here I mean three weeks from tomorrow I can't believe it at this point yeah which means you have really two weeks of preseason camp then you've got a week of of West Virginia tune up and then all of a sudden you're sliding into the next game week and on and on and on it goes all the way through Thanksgiving and Beyond and so Daniel In This Moment you know it's hard to take too many things away from what we're hearing versus what we're seeing we are not seeing full practices we are not seeing 11on 11 I want to make that clear every time we get into the preseason conversation as we done it in past summers if that changes you know last August we got to see a nice chunk of scrimmage action that was a different look if that happens we'll bring you that commentary but right now we're basing a lot of off what we're hearing from within program facilities and just what we're able to see during these 20 minutes of drill work and some some some positional work and special teams action and so with that out there I thought you know you talked about how we huddle up after each one of these events and we fur what what what's at the top of the list what what do people want to know about it was the Freshman Buzz I thought Thursday night that really caught our attention it was what I came home and sat on my front porch and wrote about on Thursday night while the rain was falling it about tier Denmark and what we heard from James Franklin regarding him we've heard a lot of good things about Denmark really dating back to his high school time when he was at imotep Institute prior to that uh Roman Catholic in Philadelphia and it's no surprise that he showed up here ready to work I I compared I think you about a month or so ago we brought him up en rolling compared his skill set at that stage and kind of to where I thought Johan doson was coming to campus and he wasn't the the most physical physically impressive wide receiver in his class back in 18 he wasn't the guy that a lot of people circled as making an instant impact but he came through he found a role in that rotation he ends up being an All-American by the end of his career but it's few and far between Daniel where Penn State really gives a high volume workload to a freshman wide receiver 2018 Johan dson worked his way into that kind of a spot 2020 with the CO as a backdrop you had two guys step up as starters for you in Keandre Lambert Smith and Parker Washington durring their first year on campus it looked like Omari Evans might be part of that conversation in 2022 with that early work against Purdue but he never really got that consistently high volume over the course of his freshman year although he did burn red shirt and now here we are with the door wide open for everybody in that room to make a move you know nobody except Harrison Wallace has even surpassed 300 yards in an ny Lions uniform to this point and tyer Denmark is a guy that James Franklin says has continued to flash it's not just one thing it's a lot of things James Franklin said I'll read a quote in just a moment but he was effusive and kind of saying this is the The Freshman who has separated himself from that Trio along with Peter Gonzalez who he called steady Eddie and along with jiah brown who we who looks slippery out on the field but is still mentally and physically working his way back from an October 2023 knee injury and so Daniel to have this on the public record now from the head coach of Penn State about tyer Denmark being someone who's in position to really make a difference for this offense down the road here maybe sooner rather than later this is a far cry from what we're hearing about the receivers last year this time when it was Keandre Lambert Smith and Harrison Wallace are guys that we know about everybody else I'm not really gonna get into in any kind of detail I you know threw up the the question to start our press conference yesterday tell me about the three wide receivers and he certainly did when we did that exercise where we picked the the newcomers that we thought would make the biggest impacts um yeah I was pretty low on the wide receivers and it was definitely a you know kind of believe it when I see it type of thing and know wanting to get to Saturdays and see it and you know I kind of expected that uh in terms of talking about them that James Franklin would probably um you know kind of be how he usually is with some of these things where you know kind of cautious you know it goes with kind of his over his you know philosophy or o under promise overd deliver um in certain respects and I thought that that's kind of what um we would kind of get this fall with some of these newcomers and you know to hear James Franklin be that effusive with his praise for tyer Denmark um you know that really really caught my attention um because you know I don't think James Franklin would say that publicly if it wasn't true and we know kind of the the player that tyer Denmark could be you based on what we saw in him in that seven on seven uh setting and what he did at Roman Catholic and imotep down in Philadelphia for his final couple years of high school so I'm really interested to see you know I wish during practice we could maybe see you know some some routes uh maybe some one-on ones to kind of get that full picture but I I think hearing that from James Franklin and kind of knowing tyer Denmark's background um it kind of fits and it's really interesting and you know maybe it doesn't completely change how I feel about the wide receivers at this point but it's definitely another data point and definitely something to to factor in in that I'll be looking for once we get to morgant town now two weeks ago I I asked James about the those three freshman receivers we were out in Indianapolis on the field in the Colts stadium and at that point well he actually did mention the buzz around tyer Denmark but he stopped himself before going too far down the road with anybody and saying let me see them on the practice field and so yesterday they're through seven practices that's a considerable sample size of what you're going to get out of your Camp obviously you've got to have stained power and freshmen tend to hit the wall at different points in the preseason but through seven days here's what James Franklin said quote it's not one thing it's route running it's being competitive it's his confidence with his hands in catching the ball it's his ability to retain information he's just doing enough good things that you think he'll have a chance and of course you think you'll have a chance and this means have a chance to play meaningful snaps for Penn State in this passing attack and um look whether Ty Denmark can do that in game one or whether we're talking more of a game six you know mid October Ascension and that's more what it was for Johan dson in 2018 really started to stake claim to a large rotational piece in a starting position during the second half of the season but to hear this from James Franklin and match that up from what we've heard about from other guys I mean I I caught up with Kaden Saunders a third-year receiver with this program last night he's trying to make a name for himself he's trying to to to establish his presence not just at punt returner but in the slot and become a really integral piece of this passing attack and uh he said that since tyer Denmark showed up in late June and remember this isn't a guy who was around the program in the spring he showed up in late June and they could just tell when they got on the field together to get some of that summer work in with the receivers and the quarterbacks that there was just a natural fit for him in the slot because of his suddenness his twitchiness um know Kaden Saunders said you know he's not the biggest framed guy I think he's I think he's listed right around 5 foot 10 180 some pounds read around that Mark but he says he'll go up and make plays and the aggressive component here I think is what has stood out Kaden Saunders says he has the mentality that he can't be guarded and what did we just get ton talking about on Monday Andy codel Nicki spent a lot of time saying what he's looking for from the wide receiver room it was before you even get to production it was about mentality and your approach and dictating terms to the defensive back versus having those terms dictated to you by the defensive secondary which I think we saw happen more often than not on occasion last year during the 2023 campaign and so matching up some of the physical intangibles that we're aware of and and the footwork and the and the polished route running and again there's a level of polisher that separates him a bit and then you pair that with the open opportunity at wide receiver and and everything else we just discussed I I really am I got about one and a half feet on the bandwagon right now Daniel to say that tyer Denmark is GNA be one of the top four or five wide receivers uh for this team from point A to point B over the course this season one of the top five game one I don't know but I think cumulatively now if he's able to stay available if he's able to maintain this path I I I'm getting more situated on that tyer Denmark bandwagon and saying that he could be someone who you know kind of elbows aside a lot of these other names that we've discussed and you know are they gonna step up he got to campus six weeks ago and people can't stop talking about him yeah I you know a lot gets made over the you know enrolling getting the jump start um but Penn State has had these guys that they're putting together a really good track record of you know guys who get here in the summer and can have that opportunity and I think tyer Denmark is just kind of the latest you you think about two years ago Abdul Carter and Drew Shelton were both summer enroles um and you know we saw what they did as true freshman so you know I think that this wide receiver room there are so many opportunities out there um you know I think even if you do penccil in you know Trey and Julian Fleming and you know maybe Liam Clifford and Kaden Saunders as as your top four you they're still you none of those guys has that kind of um you know Alpha track record so um you know there's a door open there so you know we'll see I mean I think that uh you know you think about when those freshman were on the field in 2022 like Omari Evans it was kind of a I think they said that Evans was the tap Guy where if Mitchell Tinsley needed to get off the field for a player to you know that's what Omari evans's role was you know will Ty or Denmark be in that role to start off and then does that grow from there um that's kind of what I'll be interested to see but you know it does kind of also change the I guess to calculus a little bit where you know is does this mean that Liam Clifford can move to the outside um you know where where are guys spending time on the outside in the slot um all of that all those different things but you know I think that Mark you know I thought the the feedback from Saunders was was really interesting on him um and kind of the impression that he made because you look a little bit um you know at the body types at at the positions and you see some similarities there but you know the that mindset I think really stands out you know from Saunders you know from Denmark and kind of going from there um there's a story about at Lin 247 about this it'll be a topic that we revisit I'd imagine here as the month of August continues but the otheres freshman we've got to get to here is Cooper cousins and at this point it should be no surprise that that he is somebody who is creating a stir here in State College he's got a big personality and we've been telling you since we saw him as a High School junior that he was going to show up here and be ready to knock down some defensive lineman and to make his case for early consideration and now we're a couple months removed from Phil troutwine the offensive line coach telling me that he believes Cooper cousins is probably the most impressive freshman he's encountered as an offensive line coach at the college level I brought that quote to a couple different Penn State players including Tyler Warren and and they think it was a very fair statement that was made by Phil troutline and so now that we get into another Camp he's got spring under his belt he's got a really strong summer under his belt and through this first you know 10 days or so of preseason camp James Franklin is now saying it's going to be hard to keep him off the field now the second part of that question which we'll get to in a second is well who's coming off the field to make room for Cooper cousins but the main thing here is is that I said that James Franklin was effusive in his praise of tyer Denmark it really didn't even touch where he went with Cooper cousins which was funny because Daniel he let off the answer about well Cooper cousins what what's the latest he let it off with like I don't like to say stuff that's gonna set crazy expectations but dot dot dot and then he said a lot of stuff that's GNA set some pretty crazy expectations for Cooper cousins but to this point seems like someone capable of making it James Franklin uh said to us I could not be more impressed with him really from the beginning he referenced his low maintenance recruitment process for for a high level recruit he's done that a few times but when he got into where he is now he talked about coming out of a film study at night you maybe going to the bathroom going over to his office 9:45 9:30 at night that a long days already in the books these days start early uh and these these Cooper cousins out there alone on the outdoor practice fields working on his pass Pro with wearing headphones just out there by himself true freshman getting this done and he said it's a little weird to be honest with you to see something like that but quote he is as driven and committed as a young player I've ever been around and statements like that this is a guy who's been on this specific campus for 11 years he's been a head coach for 13 years now he's been around the college football he's been in the NFL reminds me of some of the stuff you say about like saquon Barkley when he's saying the best that like the best at this I've been around or like setting the bar setting a new standard this is just different and to hear about an offensive lineman you know so difficult to work your way into real consideration as a freshman in the trenches and so Cooper cousins not only getting you know options to play late and blowouts or or get involved as a rotational piece he's being kind of whispered about not so much whispered now but but discussed as a potential real key component of what they want to do on the Penn State offensive front whenever James Franklin prefaces something with the you I don't want to set crazy expectations I feel like most of the time we don't get the butt that it's very kind of you that's kind of it you know there'll be some equivocating uh you know like I said under promise overd deliver but um I was kind of surprised when he was setting up teeing up that answer I didn't think we would get the butt uh for from Franklin but we did and everything after that was was very very Illuminating um you know I think that you we we've kind of talked about how at this point given how long he's been committed to the program how familiar we are with Him from the camp circuit that Cooper cousins feels like a veteran to us that um you kind of he kind of goes over your head a little bit when you think about a true freshman and I think that comments like that from Franklin kind of you know bring you back into you know what kind of player this is how special he could be um you know all of those sorts of things and so that kind of feedback I thought I think is really interesting you know Drew Shelton had the feedback where you know he's getting text messages from Cooper cousins from the facility at 11 o' at night and Drew Shelton's just telling him to go home which I feel like is it's kind of relatable when you think about you know being a young person and you know coming into a new job or uh I remember interning when I was in college and you you show up and you're really just ready and then all the Vets are kind of like okay like don't don't burn yourself out like you'll you'll get there you can't do it all at once but um you know this Cooper cousins feed back I think has kind of I think it's kind of surpassed our expectations from what we're what we would hear about him we've got to say I mean we have to say maybe not up until Thursday evening when we walked into huba Hall but once James said what James said and then you have drew Shelton almost immediately afterwards tacking on his anecdote about the 11 pm whiteboard picture being set to him and questions and they got to force this kid out of Team facilities as a true freshman I haven't really heard anything like this about a true freshman and this is my seven season now covering Penn State and it was already kind of different because we were talking about Cooper cousins as an offensive lineman being playable way back in like March but to hear just these kind of stories these are usually the stories you hear about a guy when he's like you know leaving the program he just getting rolling with the program yeah it's it's really really interesting uh really unique so you know we'll we'll see I mean like you said uh yeah it's it's easy to say oh you can't keep them off the field but then when you look at what Penn State has on its offensive line in terms of talent and experience and kind of you know where you would or would not want to have a rotation it's kind of like oh like who who do we have to take off yeah um so what that looks like I'm really interested to see um but I mean at this point though you want all the good players you can get you want to raise the level of a room as much as you can and seems like Cooper cousins has really really done that since he got here I don't think Phil trout is going to keep him to the sideline just to not hurt anybody else's feelings if they think that Cooper cousins can help them get into the college football playoff and win the game this Saturday they're going to do what they need to do and this is where it gets interesting because with this returning starting lineup you've got two returners only but they they both happen to be at the guard position and you've actually got three guys with starting experience at guard Vega Yan started five games there last year on the left side JB Nelson started eight games on the left side and then Sal Wormley has started the last 26 games on the right side of guard so meanwhile you've got competitions going on at tackle we'll get to one of them in a moment but Nick Dawkins has really solidified himself we haven't heard anyone say like stamp him as a starter it's locked in Penn State's not going to put out a depth chart but I've heard nothing to suggest that Nick Dawkins is going to lose his grip on being the starting center for this team and you're not going to be rotating your Center out I mean if you do that would be a surprise to me and so does this mean that you know vengo Yan who is accustomed to rotating last year seems to have the edge right now is he end up in rotation again on the left side or does this impact Sal Wormley who came back for a reason six season at the college level uses covid eligibility couple years under his belt as a starter wants to really you know take another step forward not just for this Penn State program but really for his professional football aspirations and so is that now going to be you know cutting into his opportunities out there on the field with Cooper cousins remember we saw Cooper Cousins start at Right Guard for the Varsity squad in the blue white game when when uh s Wormley was just an observer that day so this is a really interesting thing and if you're not hyped up enough listening to our conversation about kooper cousins let me just leave us with with one more Franklin Franklin quote a lot of guys say they want to play as a true freshman but they're not willing to do necessarily What It Takes and the guy is either in the class or in the building and asking a ton of questions he's super aggressive he's not intimidated or afraid of anybody and I think that's that's a huge thing because we have heard from the defensive lineman that he is bringing it and he was bringing it in the spring and when you're an 18y old maybe he's 19 now going up against 22 and 23 year olds and it's your first power for practice experience some guys you know get in the fetal position and it can take them a while to get back up and start banging their chest and and fighting back but Cooper cousins had no hesitancy didn't blink and now here we are three weeks away from kickoff and he is still rising and rising and Rising Daniel moving on from The Freshman buzz and as we said that was really the Highlight from Thursday but we did get a little more insight on what's cooking at the right tackle position remember over on the left side you got Drew Shelton back now fully healthy had a really good weight he's very confident I can tell you that coming off the conversation yesterday but he's gonna continue to deal with Javin Williams the red strip freshman former five star on the right side though we've got guys who haven't done much in their college career on the right side uh you know Nolan rupie when he played at wisconin which was pretty few and far between with the Badgers he was on the left side and then when you got an an Duna you know he didn't he's got a half of football under his belt playing that position at any level high school college otherwise and yet it seems to be a spot where regardless of who's the first tackle out there there is a level of confidence right now in the Lash building um we know that Anthony Dona has really become a physical specimen we know he has a head start uh in a lot of ways on Nolan Ruchi being a guy who's been around the program for a year but Ruchi according to James Franklin has really settled in uh playing with more confidence he referred to him as very steady over the course of this Camp so far and he also noted that he is increasingly comfortable at his new weight and I think that's fair to wonder how comfortable was he in the spring you know 15 practices after adding weight I know he's added more but he's somebody who showed up at about 298 299 now he's around 320 pounds it's a short time to add that kind of weight and then you got to deal with the speed off the edge so how are your feet and how is your brain and how is everything connecting and and getting you coordinated and so Daniel this is something that I think is going to be if I had if I had to put a spot and say this is where the rotation will happen that's where my money would be I would put my money on right tackle being a spot where you see one of these dudes out there with the first team unit West Virginia and then maybe third series fourth series another guy shows up and then we kind of see that take place over the course of a game correct me if I'm wrong maybe I'm missing a spot but that's where it feels like things are trending at this particular spot yeah I I think right now you can kind of say that because you we still don't know how Cooper cousins fits in and I know s Wormley was like the you know he was not in a rotation last year um and he really hasn't been in a rotation over his two seasons so you know we'll see what that um you know actually looks like and how it comes together but you know James Franklin called it a battle at right tackled between Dona and Ruchi which I think is a good way to put it um you know in talking to Dana uh on media day you know he and have a really good relationship it seems like you know they both want to help each other along um that seems to be a common theme in that offensive line room it seems that Phil troutwine has done a a very nice job um that even where guys are competing for starting jobs you know they're still helping each other along um and you know Rising tide lifts all boats all that stuff um but you know I think that Dona I think seems you know kind of confident uh in in what he's able to do and everything um you know I am interested and the the physical development of Nolan Ruchi um you I think we've talked about it before where you we know the reputation that Wisconsin had in terms of putting together you know offensive linemen um for the next level and the fact that they could not get um you know Nolan rchi to really bulk up put on that weight um that he's been able to aten state is really interesting um and something that you kind of you know raise your eyebrow at a little bit and I think also speaks to Chuck Losi and and what he's able to do here a reminder that no one will get a shot to head back up to Madison this year show off that new physique maybe you know battle some former teammates when when they're going to visit Wisconsin during the schedule yeah so you I mean we'll see if they're still rotating at that point or or if someone's taking over that starting job but um yeah I mean it's I'm really curious how that plays out um you know James Frankland doesn't have a problem letting some of this stuff kind of linger into or or go into the season um especially if they feel like there's not much of a drop off between two different guys I think that's what we'll see here um but I am curious as who's goingon to be the first one out there you know who is going to get credit for the start um what is that first five going to look like and then how do you mix a match from there and I feel like we've said this at least the last one or two off Seasons or August uh preseason camps but we're probably talking about a situation where you know you could have eight startable offensive linemen Maybe n potentially depending on how the staff views some of the younger pieces and then how many of them do you actually get involved by Design versus by necessity when someone gets hurt or when you've got a 40-point lead in the fourth quarter and so that's you know still what's in front of Phil trout line and Frank Leonard in that offensive line room as the staff puts together their plan another note on the offensive line JB Nelson was mentioned unsolicited by James Franklin he said he's actually been getting reps at right tackle that was new to me uh we've seen him work at left tackle in the past um we've seen him work as a first team left tackle at times on the practice field in the past um but he's a guy that James Franklin explained can play both guard positions and can play both tackle positions he called him a Swiss army knife but really wondering whether he's going to resurface as a starter that's where he was for much of last year couple different rough patches with injuries including at the very end of the season opened the door for venga Yan to play a ton of football at that spot and we like his opportunity to be the start at left guard going into the year but it sounds like right now JB Nelson uh you know kind of maybe caught in in a little bit of a gray area but also clearly valued by the coaching staff and he's a guy I got some eyeballs on yesterday because I hadn't seen him in a bit he looks just every bit of intimidating run around the field as he did last year when we heard a lot of great things during preseason camp about his physical nature and his potential to go and playing the league down the road so the former lacana College product he played tackle there played tackle in high school so just something to keep in mind and just a really probably a nice depth note when you're kind of wrapping your head around what this offensive line could look like Daniel we've got an interesting dynamic in play here because the offense had some payback to deliver going into this year a lot of what we heard last year especially as the season came to a close and people were a little more candid with their thoughts on how things went was that the defense took it to the offense quite frequently on the practice field and by the time we got through through the 2023 campaign you had an Elite Performance on one side of the ball for the regular season and then you had the other side of the ball really failing to show up in some key moments they lost their coordinator along the way because James Franklin decided he wasn't a fit anymore and here we are we heard a lot in the spring the fight that Andy codal Nikki can bring and we can vouch for that Andy cotal Nikki is gonna be talking out there he's gonna be scrapping out there he's a fun presence on the fat practice field but it's a results driven business and James Franklin says as they keep score dayto day period to period more often than not now it's ending up as a tie or close to a tie where he says that was not the case this time last year and I know the people out there who are drinking out of their glasses and viewing that as half empty maybe are saying well this defense is slipping we lost Manny the defense is in hen I'm gonna encourage folks to actually take this how it was meant to be the offense is stepping up and you're actually seeing a little bit more balance which is very helpful for this team I think especially when you're talking about the confidence level of the offensive unit and particularly you know quarterback dreal yeah and I think that the narrative that you get in basically you know like any football camp uh you know whether it's College Pro or even down in high school is that early on you you always hear well the defense is ahead of the offense and that's kind of that's just a product um you know of the POS of the sides of the ball that's just kind of like how things work the responsibilities and everything um you know getting that question it's kind of an interesting timing last Thursday night was practice number seven so they're entering that second week um of practice and to you know kind of hear that at this point like this isn't you know if someone had asked on media day where was like day three um you know what sides ahead probably would have been defense but to hear that now you know at this point that you know it's even um you I think that speaks to probably how up to speed that offense is is doing and it probably also speaks to just you know how that it's a different offense um that this isn't the the Mike uch offense that some of these defensive players had seen in Camp you know one or two or three times um this is something that's that's new to them um and I think that that probably factors in a little bit more but you know to hear James Franklin say that it's been more competitive um I think that that really stood out to me as well um because you know it's kind of what we heard from Andy cotal Nikki in terms of bringing that fight um from the offense that you you want to have a unit that you know has that mindset that really can counter punch um I think the only time last year where Penn State you know was in a situation where they U you know needed a counter punch and they delivered it was in that Indiana game and that just kind of felt like that their backs were so far against the wall that you just kind of had to throw everything out the window and just kind of do it um but you know in that Ohio State game the Michigan game Old Miss game which you can put asterisk on for a variety of reasons there never really seemed to be that counter punch um and so I think that you know if you're having a team that's more competitive in practice if you know this is coming down it's like James Franklin said to a couple reps either way that's how he wants it to be every day um but if you have that um I think that that's something that can really uh can be a foundation for a team to to build off of as you get into the season and and you wrote a story about this at uh published on Friday morning at L 247 not just about that balance but about the fact that they're able to achieve that balance while having three new voices of leadership out there new special teams coordinator off to the side a little bit in this conversation but offensively youve got Andy codal Nikki leading the way and his unique coaching style and Tom Allen's very different personality we got a chance to catch up with him yesterday uh talk about that again in a bit but three new coordinators have gone through spring camp together but I think it was really important for James Franklin to reach this stage of the calendar and feel like they weren't working with three new coordinators and that they weren't still trying to find the right pieces and and find the right mesh as they as they come up with plans and he says it doesn't feel like that now it doesn't seem like they have new coordinators in place and if you can get through this and and and get into the the regular season feeling like you're on the same page um football involves a lot of egos you know and and the conver it's really that's why it's really important before you hire a guy that everybody knows what the responsibilities are going to be uh what the collaboration is going going to look like because you don't want any surprises when you get in a preseason camp or when you get in a game week and right now it seems like to James Franklin's credit because he's the one making the call on these hires that they were able to strike the right balance uh with these coordinators Tom Allen telling us that that he is so happy to be trading in that CEO situation he says no one's knocking on my door to put out fires anymore no one's calling me to do this or that he has really enjoyed for the first time in a long time walking into his office closing the door behind him and just going to town on film study and so you've got him Andy C Nikki this a guy I think that's a head coach in the making different kind of story different career trajectory right now but again two James Franklin's credit everything we've heard from players on the record off the record from within the Lash building have really Illustrated that this team is potentially gonna enter the season and and not need a few weeks to find its footing which sometimes that can be the case when you have this wholesale staff change and it's not like they had to replace a bunch of assistants but we are talking about the guys at the top of the totem pole with those offensive and defensive staffs I think that we knew that the defense would probably be I guess fine obviously we'll see when the the season actually starts um but you know even going back to when James Franklin had to replace Brent pry with Manny Diaz he talks about know identifying a candidate where who could come in and work with the Personnel that they wouldn't have to reinvent the wheel that the guys that they had been recruiting for the past however many years um you know would fit they wouldn't have to transform a bunch of body types um you know all that stuff to kind of keep things you know humming and I think that that showed through I mean I thought that that defense in 2021 had some really good moments um they know some shutouts in there I think and then you saw that continue under Manny Diaz in 22 and 23 and then it was a similar thing with Tom Allen coming in where you know they identified someone who you know runs a you know a similar scheme you know are learning about some of these wrinkles which I think are really interesting and potentially exciting like the lion position uh but overall you know it's a very similar thing so that you the guys who are in the program already can just kind of continue along with their trajectory and kind of keep things going um now I asked KJ Winston uh you know how much did it help him to have the same position coach with Anthony Poindexter coming around and he said that that was really big you know for the guys on the back end that you have Terry Smith you have Anthony po Dexter um you know coaching two of the deepest and most talented position groups on the roster and even with a new defensive coordinator coming in you know they had familiar voices that they could get help from that they could ask they could bounce things off of and Winston said that it really helped them along so I think defensively things are set up really nicely I think on the offensive side this is probably a bit of a testament to the work that they did in Spring and how they attacked that and how the players attacked the summer so that you get to cuz I mean sometimes I'm guilty of this too where it's like you get to fall camp and you're kind of like this is day one they're starting from scratch and you kind of you it's like it's our first look at the 2024 nney Lions where they've had all summer they had the 15 practices in the spring uh that we got a glimpse at you know there is a OTAs essentially now with like the new rules they can get out the field they can they can converse on the field it used to be like if a Coach and a player were seeing on grass Together season you'd have to call NCAA but it's not like that now yeah and so you know you had all these opportunities to build a foundation and to you know lay the groundwork that you can you know continue building on now so I think that and James Franklin brought that up he said you know the rule changes both in terms of what they're allowed to do and then how many people are allowed to be helping with that now um with with analysts being able to participate um on the field that that really kind of changed things around a little bit and has has really helped them so you know like I think a lot of people are interested to see what this offense looks like you know we're it seems like we'll find out August 31st that it seems like that'll be our first look at extended 11on 11 action uh the way things are going this month but I think that the feedback that you see is is really positive yeah and that I mean Tom Allen said essentially the same thing he said you know we'll see he said he's he's he's trying to you know find the right balance between what he brought you know the things that have worked for him the things that he trusts the things that he knows and also the things that were awaiting him here on campus and he says that you know he's trying to make sure that that he's going to achieve the right parts of both he says he's not quite sure what that will look like until they hit the field on August 31 and then from that point you've got to figure out well what works and what doesn't in game action right now they're trying to see what works and what doesn't on the practice field and I think Tom Allen was was really transparent about understanding he wasn't gonna show up to C show up to this campus and get to you know put together a defensive coaching staff James Franklin made it very very very clear to him during the interview process that they really liked all their assistant coaches Dion Barnes and and of course Anthony poter Terry Smith in the defensive backfield and uh Tom Allen specifically pointed to to Smith and point extra as guys that he quote leaned on when he got to campus trying to figure out what were going to be the right approach for this defense and you know Anthony poter was of course an interim defensive coordinator during December Terry Smith's been around here for 11 years so uh you know he said that that that you know everybody kind of put their ego side put Penn State first put that defense and and and the Really the the defensive roster first because their ambition is to make sure they utilize this Rost in every possible way that's why we're talking about new positions being filled we're talking about maybe some new schematics but at the end of the day it's about getting your best 11 on the field it was like that for Brent pry for Manny Diaz and for Tom Allen and in that regard it was kind of cool to hear him talk about some of the guys who have maybe you know changed their perception within this defense with the coordinator at least because Tom Allen you know came to campus with with knowing who Abdul Carter was he had a game plan against Abdu Carter last year but he brought up a few names Daniel that he says you know have popped in person that he wasn't really fully aware of their potential as Playmakers just judging off a film of this team last year he talked about Tamir Robinson at linebacker and and everyone seems to be talking about Tamir Robinson lately as someone really coming up to the surface in that conversation on the depth chart said he's really elevated himself he said the same thing about uh Colin dinkin who's working at safety working at the line position a red shirt sophomore uh he reiterated he is in that mix it's a c time really a cool story for a guy who was a walkon a few years back khil dinkin the tight end's little brother um has worked his way into being one of the top speedsters on this team and he's got a lot of size he he spotlighted Dom Duca a little bit um you know in both phases not just defense but also special teams he called him a Savvy Moxy guy that makes a ton of plays and if that isn't just the greatest description of D Duca I've ever heard and then another name he got to was a mean vanover and and James Franklin went out of his way during media day last Saturday Tom Allen says day by day he continues to flash more and more and they're gonna need him now with Jamal Lions no longer on the program and Zariah Fischer sideline and Abdul cter uh you know play playing defensive end but also gonna be dropping back to linebacker and one more name to get to and of course he was mentioned here Daniel Al Daven Collins the red shirt sophomore cornerback came in from Mississippi State last year got eight defensive snaps over the course of 2023 but we have had multiple people within the program in recent weeks and months really tell us that he is in consideration to be the best cornerback on the roster right now and we've talked about maybe being six startable type players at the cornerback position and so I think that that what has impressed Tom Allen most is the way that Collins has been consistent while navigating through a room that he says if you have a bad day you know you could jeopardize your situation because of how crowded it is and how impressive that group has been since they hit the field in the spring so any takeaways for you from that list of names that Tom Allen has has really said these guys are a little bit different than what I thought I might be getting here at Penn State yeah I thought that was a cool framing uh for for that question um especially when you think about the the history that Tom Allen has uh with facing Penn State over the past couple years when he was at Indiana but yeah I think too that that kind of gives you some you know on the record validation of you know guys that you know we've had we've heard things about I mean um you know team Tamir Robinson has been brought up by Franklin before um but and alavian Collins has been brought up by pretty much every single one of his teammates I think um but when you're hearing it from you know the coach on that side of the ball that kind of allows you to you know take some of the things that were maybe written in pencil or some of those thoughts and you know maybe put it in pen put it in Sharpie a little bit more um because you know you're hearing that from Tom Allen um who's working with these guys every day he's the one who is structuring this his defense around these guys he's going to be involved in picking which one of which of these guys are on the field and for how much how much time um so yeah I mean I think that you know if we were to pick like maybe if we were to do like an offseason All-Star team I think that you know these guys that Tom Allen brought up you know probably would have been in consideration uh even you know before but now you know I think that we would put them firmly on and as we look towards August three weeks away um you can kind of you know put together the depth chart in your head a little bit more and kind of see how the pieces might fit together one of these guys is a little bit different than the others uh my opinion Daniel you've got four players there and Tamir Robinson Colin dkin Aman vanover and Al Daven Collins that it's all been like you know stock up these guys are on the rise even you know it's year five from mean vanover some of these guys were later in their career but TR the arrows pointing upward I think a lot of folks hear Dom Deluca and think he is what he is we know what he is he's a redard junr he's got two more years of Eligibility and I need to remind myself of two years ago two augusts ago Manny Diaz told us a small group of reporters that Dom Duca was going to be a legitimate factor in the linebacker conversation and I think some people quite frankly didn't really realize who he was at that point he was a red sh freshman walk-on probably figured he would be fodder on on the practice field a special teams contributor well here he is a year year of being a special teams Captain under his belt played a ton last year as a two deep guy and he's just somebody that I'm trying to to even remind myself don't act like you've got Dom figured out this is a guy who has fiery as hell I think people think you know the cool Underdog Story he's got a lot of confidence in himself and he's got a lot of confidence in his stature within this program right now and you know we don't know if we're going to see three linebacker sets like three traditional linebacker sets with regularity especially like a first team look for this team but Don Duca is somebody that I think we're all probably still sleeping on in some way shape or form and to hear this from Tom Allen like when you get that moniker from the coaching staff and and now it's multiple defensive coordinators saying it like this guy just makes plays like then that's just who you are like that's not just a perspective or something that someone's witnessing like that's starting to be your reputation and so Dom Duca I think that if you think his ceiling has been hit I would reconsider it yeah I mean I'll I'll admit that I'm probably guilty as anyone to kind of you know putting Duca on the back burner a little bit um you know as we look at this this linebacker core I mean I think that part of it is the idea that it feels like we won't see as much of that traditional Sam linebacker as we saw you know under Manny Diaz and Brent pry and that's where Duca fit in and then you look at the gains that you know someone like Tony Roos and Kobe King have made um in the waight room like those are two really big dudes um you that are going that seems like we be playing in the Box a decent amount and we know that you know Duca is a hard-nosed player I think he came up in in run support and had the big stop at Ohio State last year um I believe he was involved in a goal line stand there you know he's not afraid to mix it up but you he's not necessarily what you think of as that box linebacker um and so you know I do think that you know we all had high expectations for Kavon keys this year and what he could add you know he not part of the equation anymore and I think that you you look to someone like DeLuca to be able to step up um and just add something to that linebacker group um you know what that looks like how exactly that works out um you know I'm not sure I think that you there are some unknowns about this defense and I think one of the big ones is how does the lion position kind of actually function in gameplay and then you know when do you see a third linebacker on you know when do you see you know that front seven that that were're more used to um but you know I think that having Allan bring up to Luca like that is a reminder that you he is someone who is going to be a factor there um it'll be fun to watch it and and we also have to note you know you talked about key obviously no longer with the program but Keon Wy is somebody that I think if we had if he was healthy we'd be sitting here you know probably talking about him being a buzzy guy because he was genuinely you know establishing himself as that kind of an ascending figure as a red shirt sophomore earlier this year injuries suck but that that's what it is for him currently sideline James Franklin said he could be back this season but because of a couple different variables guys like Tamir Robinson Dom Duca even Tyler Ellen that I know a lot of people put him on the back burner as a fifth year senior they're going to be called upon to to play um and they're going to need to play at a high level for this defense not to take a step backward um gonna finish with Allen by segueing into your conversation with KJ Winston because Tom Allen um really described KJ Winston and you know part of this is you're probably not recruiting a KJ Winston talent to Indiana the last seven years but he said even just preparing for him last year and then seeing him on the field in Bieber stadium and pregame warm-ups and just said from a physical standpoint from an accountability standpoint um just a guy that is allaround buttoned up professional at this level he said he's not sure he's encountered somebody like this and that's you know been hammered home to him getting to know KJ Winston over the course of 2024 uh yeah we heard James Franklin go and put a lot of crazy in the direction of KJ Winston last night too so when you've got the head coach doing it and the defensive coordinator doing it and just heaping it on this young man who doesn't really like to talk about himself that much um we heard all American possibilities about KJ Winston all the way back in his high school recruitment I mean are we getting there are it's it's like is the stage being set because this coaching staff isn't holding back any of their punches when it comes to their thoughts about what KJ Winston could accomplish and I'll remind folks he was among those denty Lions who were projected as first round picks in some of those way too early 2025 M drafts yeah KJ Winston's Buzz this off season was was built kind of through I think some you know I guess more non-traditional means where it was the the PFF uh ratings where he was one of the you know if not the highest rated safety in the Big 10 it's the college football 25 ratings where he is one of the highest rated players on the Penn State roster it's the mock drafts where you see him getting some first round Buzz um you know I think that that's kind of a you non-traditional route to kind of boost a a program in the offseason um but when you hear James Franklin talk about him when you hear Tom Allen talk about him then when you talk to KJ Winston coupled with what we saw on the field from him last year you you kind of get it and it starts to snap into Focus um a little bit more you know I've talked about this a lot I think that he's going to have a huge leadership role on this team this year um you know he and Tyler Warren were the two guys that were put out front um by Penn State at the peach bow when they got there and then after they lost that game um you know I think that you know those are two guys that Penn State put into those positions and I think that that's you know indicative of what they can mean to the team this year um but I think when it comes to on field you know you KJ Winston as a player he's not afraid to you know go up and run support he said that that's kind of how he was raised by his dad when he was young that he was told that you if he's going to play he has to be physical he has to be willing to mix it up he said that Shawn Taylor is the player that he models his game after that's why he wore number 21 early in his Penn State Career before switching to number two this year um and then physically you know he's long he's fast um you know he had an interception last year so there's some ball skills he really comes together as a very very nice package at safety and we know that he's gonna play a lot you know we saw him you know kind of win one of those jobs last year and hold on to it so um you know I'm excited to see what KJ Winston can do this fall him AB Carter maybe Tony roas enters the conversation these are some guys I just don't see leaving the field much unless they get DED up I mean some one of these saf is gonna have to leave the field you're not gonna have Zaki wedley KJ Winston and Jaylen Reed out there together snap by snap but I think uh in terms of guys who are going to be at the top of that snap count at the end of the year and just somebody that whether it's third and long fourth and short whatever it is he's going to be a part of that plan I just don't see KJ Winston coming to the side line and also the way they talk about him being an extension of the coaching staff it's so great to talk about how individually accomplished he can be and and and all the the physical intangibles that he has but Daniel what we hear about this guy is that he's elevating those around him that's the literal phrasing that Tom Allen brought so this is a really fun story to Monitor and KJ Winston could be a huge Junior season ahead for him and we started with the wide receiver conversation jumping in with tyer Denmark let's wrap up going back to that room that's been under the microscope since this year began and talk a little bit about Kaden Saunders just because he is the clear leader right now pum returner and in catching up with him yesterday night he said that that confidence that he's and he said it did mean a lot to him to hear the Special Teams coordinator Justin Lusk put that out publicly that he is the quote clear leader at pmer Turner he says that's seeping into the confidence at wide receivers he's doing a lot less thinking now in year three this is third preseason camp and I know a lot of folks out there are surprised that you know now through this get coming to campus in January 2022 that that he hasn't made more of a dent in the offensive plans and and and so I think right now Kaden sers has a really quiet confidence about him and what he can do and I think a lot of that is going to be what can Andy Cal Nikki dial up and I I'm sure k s has already seen the bag of tricks but when you talk about position that could be particularly fascinating with Andy cot Micki I look at that slot and maybe we see that TI Seer Denmark become a fun weapon there but I think Kaden Saunders is gonna be a guy who is gonna get a long look there entering the season and whether we're talking about ways to get him involved in the screen game short pass game taking handoffs potentially trying to utilize his open field speed it's some exciting stuff and and Kaden Saunders was a top 100 recruit he's a guy who was on this podcast multiple times during you know his Comm commitment to Penn State and you know we were discussing you know immediate impact type of stuff and so the physical development has been a really important piece it's we addressed that a lot in year two and now year and three it seems like the mental and physical stuff are in the right place um know if it doesn't come to fruition form here there's going to be some questions about whether it can but I think right now with Kaden Saunders and just you know getting a chance to chat with him after practice number seven of this preseason camp he is in a really assertive mindset where he is really going out to try to seize this thing and it felt like talking to him last year even still in year two he was still trying to the handle all the moving pieces around him and trying to take it as as they come right now I think he's walking on the field with a plan and it sounds like you know checking in with some coaches checking in with some players and Kaden himself that he is executing that plan on a pretty consistent basis yeah I think uh I think Saunders is is one of those guys that when you talk about the um you know there's not a lot sometimes there's not instant gratification uh with recruits and you know I think that when he came in I think a lot of us were expecting to see something out of him because you you know what that resume was for him coming out of college you know top 100 recruit first commit in the class in July 2020 you know seeing it through You know despite being from you know and being from Ohio right outside you know in the suburbs of you know a big 10 rival I think he ran like a 438 at some kind of combine before his high school senior season yeah and so you had you were very excited about what he could be you had High Hopes And I remember talking to Trey Wallace before last season and kind of running down the depth chart with him and that was what Wallace you know kept kind of returning to you I think I asked him about saers and you know some of the other wide receivers from that class and he just said that you know things happen at different times for different guys um and I think that it's something that in this kind of modern college football age we might not see as much of anymore because of portal player movement all that stuff but um you know I think that Saunders is in a very nice position um to kind of have his feet under him you know know what he's supposed to do I think this offensive change is really going to benefit him when you talk about everything that pen state is trying to to do to distort defenses distort is the word that's come up a lot um and so we'll see what this looks like for him but I think that you know we talked about in the spring I think that he's someone where it's very stock up arrow is really pointed up for him and he has a a a long-term built-in relationship with Drew Aller these guys lived together earlier in their college careers they got together as Ohio as Ohio residents a couple times during their respective uh you know High School careers at the end played catch a little bit and so there is a lot of Rapport between those two that's a good thing to have with your starting quarterback and uh yeah we'll see what it looks like but the launch pad is there for Kaden saers it felt like last year he was getting there and then whether it was a fault of his own or whether it was one of the you know the number of issues that Mike yuch you know ran across last year kind of the carpet was pulled out from underneath him it was like the snap count counts weren't steady and then ultimately dayquan Hardy surged and took everybody by storm won that punt return job but it seems like we'll see Kaden sunners as the starting punter and he's you know doing his best right now or trying to make that case to be a starting wide receiver as well uh Daniel anything else to add Before We Say Goodbye again this is episode three of the week kind of a uh exemplifying what we're going to be escalating in the next fews weeks we're going to go to four per week when we get into game weeks as you know a few during the week and then one postgame podcast but um Daniel we're getting a lot of information we're trying to Churn it out over at Alliance 247 it's not enough hours in the day when you get to August yeah we're we're really ramping up right now just just like Penn State is but no I mean I think that we had a lot of information coming out of that and we're gonna be back out on the practice field and just a couple more days so we're gonna have even more uh to come but know it's really exciting uh and you know I think that we're starting we're starting to have things come into Focus uh a little bit more yeah three weeks shy of Penn State's trip down to Morgantown for a match up against West Virginia as Daniel said we are back on the practice field on Tuesday we're expecting to see more Penn State football action get the he from James Franklin again U perhaps another coordinator certainly some players so we'll be back with a couple more at least a couple more episodes next week to break down the latest and what we're hearing what we're seeing from Penn State and of course whatever is happening in the recruiting world for the NY Lions Tyler caluso will hop back on to join us again if you missed our Thursday episode that We snuck in uh this week Devon J Thomas senior defensive tackle interview with him about this upcoming season he talked about a lot of the rising Talent on this roster and then Tyler calvaruso joined me to break down Cameron Smith joining this class flipping from duke uh great colleagues at lies 247 uh happy to do it with you Daniel thanks for joining the podcast again thanks Tyler that's going to wrap up this week's coverage at lines 247.com here on the podcast of course the site never sleeps go over there we have a bunch going on a story on tyer Denmark that I have up late on Thursday night Daniel has a story on this offense defense Balancing Act that's going on during preseason camp and we have our what we're hearing thread that is live and being updated constantly as we are adding a bunch of notes quotes and context whatever's coming our way from the Lash building and from the practice field we're going to bring to our subscribers and right now 30% off gets you in the door for a complete preseason coverage and in through this 2024 campaign at lines 247.com on behalf of Daniel Gallen Tyler caluso Mark Brennan and our entire team at lines 247 I'm Tyler Don who we'll talk to you real soon right here lines 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