Bleeding Green Interviews: Don & Marian Furner

[Applause] all rers fans it's Jared kroer Raider 284 here you're listening to episode number two of the bleeding green podcast series well Marian and Don ferer welcome to the uh beding green interviews absolutely thrilled to be talking to both of you but especially to Mar uh with her not only her knowledge of of of the past in terms of the Raiders uh but also the kind of lived life that goes back well before the Raiders and we might get to that in a moment but just so people may have got a bit of perspective what year did you and Don and family arrive in queenan uh I didn't have any family at that stage I arrived in 1965 okay and at that point um uh what was what was what was Queen Bean like for someone I don't imagine too different to tumber Umber and I'll get to that in a moment but what was Queen Bean like in those first years when you were living in the town a little like a big Country Town um but I found it a little bit difficult because in tumber I knew everybody and it took me a while to get to know people in Queen bin but that happened I can only assume and because of being with football it opened many doors and and of course you haven't left you haven't left we did leave tell me more we left in 1970 71 72 73 when Dawn went to coach East in Sydney of course yep yep yep okay okay but other than that the whole The Continuous time came back in Queen bin well let me take you back a bit and we'll certainly get to the raer story uh in time but going back um again viewers of this uh into the future will know that that Don had a a arable footballing career uh before he came to coach uh the queenan blues um and that footballing career was one that included of course playing for Australia uh playing for his State uh and playing for certain country country teams I think I'm right in saying I should have that he that he he was born in condoin that's right yes uh which is mightly out west as we know of of New South Wales but one way or another he is very much he was a a a a a true country footballer who found his way in well if you're as old as me I can still remember that style of football including Don uh and his emergence of course as a significant footballer um but it was the very Business of Being a footballer um after perhaps your most representative years that you were a captain coach uh I was doing a little bit of work on that quite recently and it's interesting that after the Great War so the first World War it was the period after that the 1920s all that way back when it was um uh the period of the emergence of the first players often City players going out to the country and becoming Captain coaches of country teams well that would have been relatively easy I suspect uh for Dawn but if we can move in on one particular Country Town uh where he was coach um and that is tumara actually the first question I'd asked occurred to me was he a captain coach so you spent four years in tumber rumber yes was he a captain coach in each of those years that's right yes okay okay well it would have been to say the least it would have been successful actually while I'm still with it and I should have checked this out as well did he win premise ships at tumber if so more one or more yes he did he won one in 63 1963 63 which would have been a great moment for the town 64 he went to J and won another one there okay in ' 64 and then' 65 came to queenan and won many with the queenan blues I think I'm I think I'm right in saying that in 13 years he won no less than 10 oh I can't remember the amount that's that's a St George that's the St George team of the Bush let's put it that way in a period where you know through the very you know a similar period but let's go to tumber and hear a little bit about that and your background so um uh you were born born in tumber yes born in tumit actually okay I know it will as it turns out but um so born in tumit growing up in tarumba yes yes and how old were you when Don came to be the first to to be a captain coach of tarumba I was 19 19 not long out of boarding school okay where did you go to school it's St Vincent College pots Point okay okay well not just blue blood in terms of schooling but clearly we get we'll get to the Blue Blood ferer family and the ra a story shortly um so and and and that's interesting so you're can I ask this I wasn't going to what did your mom and dad do my father owned a garage in tumber Umber a Holden garage you know I think I might have even big Australia map on it it is I was I was there only recently I W get but I know exactly the service station there you go yes so you went to boarding school but you're 19 years of age yes um and I won't ask too many question on this but how did the uh how did you meet Dawn oh well actually it was at a ball at Rosewood actually and um where's Rosewood just out of tumber okay okay at a country ball yes at a country ball where where fellows came up and asked the ladies to to dance there you go start could he dance yes yes okay there you go as distinct from young men of uh of the present the present day very lovely yeah um the last question I'll ask on this was it a relationship that uh was a slow burn or was it a more uh a little quicker than that a very very slow burn because my father was very very strict so I tripped on a long while to be able to take me out okay was your father um someone who was a little bit down on a footballer that's right yes yes okay one that's come to town and no one knew anything about him okay which leads to my last question on it how did Dawn managed to break the the ice with your mother and father I don't know how he managed to do it but somehow he managed to do it okay how long was it until you married and I'm M that 1963 I got married okay okay and then uh indeed the the chap sitting to your left uh was the first child I knew that three kids sorry absolutely and I I was going to place her in the middle but I've incorrectly said she's the eldest yes I have a daughter Kathy and she was born in 1965 okay in queenan okay all my children were born in queenan and I always said If Ever I had any more children I would always come back to Queen be oh that's excellent all right well that the tumber rumber story was only part of Don senior's uh footballing career but but significant but you'd have to say in terms of his life after representative football then you are talking about um the queen Blues era yes yes um which is a vital part one of the really important cogs in the Raider story yes because without even trying as we read and I've done quite a lot Don's presence as the very successful coach of queenan uh the queenan blues was something that was really important in the bid that finally went in for the Raiders to be the first non Sydney team into that competition um he gave it credibility um but it wasn't just Dawn and let's move on to that so so when the era of the Queen Bean Blues is happening can you remember by any chance at the point at which I imagine a year or two perhaps a little more when there were the first mentions of the possibility of the queen you know quenan queenan blues or the area putting a Sydney a team into the Sydney competition was that something that was talked about and and and Don might want to come in on this 1981 it was talked about something in that sort of 1980 19808 okay and and and and given Don your age which is your a mid teens kind of thing yeah do you remember that yourself and you know and what was the impact in the household was it talked a bit in the ferer household yeah Dad would be talking a lot to Les MacIntyre and then later Johnny McIntyre cuz the Leakes Club was fairly financially um successful Maybe one of the best in the state if I'm not wrong across the border when there was no PO machines in CRA um the Premier leag Club was you know a rich Club had a rich history of rugby league the team was very successful um so it was always felt that that would be the precursor to a team that came in and they were all confident that you they could be competitive because they made up a lot of the country teams and Monero teams so definitely 1980 probably 81 was the application and then success at the end of 81 for the 82 season and was Don and either of you can answer this was Don enthusiastic about it from virtually the beginning yes Don was very enthusiastic I wasn't so because I thought my goodness how are we going to manage this because I'd been in Sydney with the roosters and I knew how hard that was yeah yeah and of course he was successful he made the team made the a Grand Final in that period so you had a well to say the least a pretty clear idea of of the sort of Demands I had a very clear idea of the demands yeah yeah da was very keen did you feel it would be because you were in Queen be and it was going to be a non Sydney team that that might ease the I won't say the burden but isas the load on you was that going to make it a little easier say that yes and and was it the case also that that by then of course you were not only well known in Queen B but you would have had a town of friends I'm sure at that stage so that would have made it made it easier as well now you mentioned the mcintyres um and if we're talking about blue blood families in the Raider story and maybe even in the queen well certainly in the queenan story then the furnace is one such family but another one is the mcintyres absolutely yes can you tell us a bit about the emergence of your relationship with the mcintyres when you first came to queenan well of course they were Les Les and Elsie were the first people we ever met in queenan so they were very very special okay and did you hit did the two you know you and Don and and absolutely yes absolutely okay cuz what's I I throw it out there what's the age difference between you Don and Jr and John McIntyre John McIntyre is my age okay okay okay so yeah quite young yeah yeah I just wanted to place it correctly Les and you know Les Les and Elsie were like sort of grandparents to us sort of thing know they were they were you very very good to our family you you can't help but feel andag this was the case but you would have both been sort of seeing it happening at closeand that the significant discussions in the very first instance that I'm sure people would be interested in uh all those raer fans out there and that is those first discussions uh in down here would have been between Don and Les one would have thought there was a committee set up but um you know without a doubt Dad and Les Les was a driving force he had a committee behind him which was the licensed Club behind him but um there was a lot of planning in uh 81 um and and and as mom knows it was difficult then to get players to come um I think you've written some notes on that haven't you Mom about how very difficult yes yeah it's very difficult we get got lots of knockbacks can we and we'll get to that in in in just a moment uh can I get you both going on the record for something that was a bit of conundrum for me when I wrote absolutely bleeding green the Raiders book the history there was a little bit of a gray area as to who came up with the name the camber Raiders and who came up with the colors now I do know you would both know that Don has depending on who you read Don has been credited with that but others have as well Maran let me ask you first I cannot I cannot tell you that I cannot remember that okay the color is debatable definitely the name was a preference of the New South Wales rulu yeah um they wanted to go with an American name that was known um likewise they did with the Steelers yeah um and the Broncos who later came so definitely that was at the direction of the the new South R RoR League they obviously held all the cards they were going to give you the license you still had to to comply with it um as you wrote in your book you know blue and gold were the were the CRA colors but we couldn't have that because of par so um yes there is two stories behind the green couch I think we probably settled on the right you know or I did in the in the story so that it was in a sense a marketing decision but of course the the rest is history so let's just shift and before we talk about recruiting Marin at the point at which in 1981 you were thinking well this could well be a reality in our lives um and you would had basically thought your way through it and thinking well you know there's a lot of keenness so this is probably you know this might well happen what was your what was your sort of sense of things when it was getting close or if you like when it finally became the reality that the Raiders were going to be um you know the the first non Sydney team to be entering that competition did that make an impact on the respective wives and partners um uh that decision at that time by any chance well I become very supportive and went to every game um because you know whatever Don did was very important to me and was that did that include as you you know and you pointed this out um that the extraordinary difficulty that Don had that the club had this this fledgling Club had to try and attract players because necessarily you were going to be looking at Rejects and you know you've talked about that um that made Don's um uh uh what is one and say his his task all the harder but I wonder could you comment on something that I I know I've read a number of times and that is that Don's background in country football meant that he was not only willing to travel around to look at Players firsthand but also that he was a very very good judge of footballing talent so given he wouldn't have had that much money to be working with you know in terms of contracts uh his skill in identifying the players who are going to be a part of this new club was going to come into play here's my question I I guess was it a consideration for him can you remember to be thinking about the right players who would be the right fit for the club here it is it's a country football team when it's all said and done it's not Eastern suburbs you know it's not Manny ringa um it's going to be a completely different Club was was was did he look did he ever talk about in trying to attract these players um players of of of that are going to be good country fits and I'll and I'm going to ask Don in his new we'll get there but because Don Jr your son next to you has talked about this in his roles which we'll get to um in in one consideration definitely being identifying the kinds of footballers who are going to fit into the lifestyle here as distinct from a sort of of urban Metropolitan so I'll come back to the question did Don talk about this did did either of you at the table ever talk about the footballers did he say much about his job or did you leave the footballing you know the football identification to the to the coach I I definitely left it to the coach but what I do remember is that John Quil sent a telegram to Don when he did recruit the players and he said congratulations you have taken all the um cleaned up you've cleaned up um all the C you've cleaned up all the city city okay well done he did have to take ones that others didn't want they turned out to be very very good now and and given the footballing side is you know slowly but surely takes care of itself and your husband's doing that you know and your oldest son and probably all three of the young fers are taking an interest one way or another um uh did did it become clear from the start that the wives the partners had a role to play in this new club in the way I guess we'd say that you might have even sort of seen in tumber rber when you were growing up do you know what I mean that that the women who were not playing football then but nevertheless that they that they had a you know a kind of in a sense a role in the club did that get spoken about in those earliest years Marin of the camper Raiders dad made you do that and you want a need always welcomed the ladies yes yes well I must say the secretary's wife Anita McIntyre was very very good as welome with myself welcoming the players that came and their wives and children did you find that they because the the challenge there would would have been and that's the challenge of country football when you had new players coming in that were maybe growing up in the city was that something that you tried early on or a little later to have regular kinds of get get get that's right yes we did yes yes yes at the family home or where would these take place what would you know at at the homes of the footballers that's right yes yes both at home both at the home cuz they they come over and at the club functions CU we' we' we'd get called on to babysit their kids so that the W could go out so we'd get $5 babysitting so it was both but I'd say it was way more social than what it is now because you had to welcome in the country Trad that you say because they didn't know a soul when they got here yeah um and their partner was off training and working and playing so definitely mama and Anita did a really really good job back then there was no well-being people there was no um massive welcoming committee other than probably mom and um and and McIntyre okay and was it a part of um uh you know what you you saw as perhaps your role to be one of the first people welcoming the the partner do you know what I mean is my role yes and presumably likewise Anita yes very very much Anita yes yes yes we've got in in when I did was like enough to put together the absolutely bleeding green history yes there are three lovely photographs I don't know whether you've seen them you in fact they're probably yours occurs to me but nevertheless three photographs one you're in one of them certainly but a range of women including Ros Kelly as I recall I think she might got into couple of them because of her interest but but women who were it you can almost tell in the body language of those photographs that there was a certain camaraderie amongst the women which would have been important yes we knew them all especially welcoming like the new cuz that's still important that's important in 2023 as we know for for to try and get them settling in but the more so when one of the things that you've got going for you is them settling in to a country Town atmosphere you know and even though you know clearly camber has changed nevertheless that queenan part of the story is still a really vital part of the story yeah so let's push it along a little bit and Don I'd asked you to come in on on this so we get to the first season 1982 MH it was always going to be difficult by any chance Marin I'll start with you on this one was Don one of those people in the workplace in his case football bringing his job home would he bring the the the footballing home to talk to you about was he was he would he get depressed would he get down I mean everything I read says otherwise but I don't want to put words in your mouth tell me what was absolutely not you wouldn't know whether they'd won or lost he was always very jovial I used to worry about it I think more than he did okay did that include games yes yes I would worry about the games and I still do worry about the and you said would you go to you'd go to I mean certainly the home I can but would you go to the games as well yes I went in the Raiders bus to the away games with Tony wood okay present Viking yeah yeah yes I'm lucky enough to sit next to him at the meninga medal dinners every year so I'm very happy yes no no very yes yeah that's true so just in that early period the the home games the away games um do you have any particular other memories about that time those early years let's say 82 83 884 which were not easy uh clearly not for the coach not necessarily for the players but as we all of the three of us know um uh there was a modest success in the first year and and in a sense disproportionate success in the years that followed one way or another was do you have any particular memories from your side of things about those early years beyond the women do you know what I mean like like meeting up with the women I could just remember something does come to mind it's Julie GTO with all her little children used to be making slices and so forth and look after us on the buses I've read I have actually I think I might have even put it in the book I think you did put in the book and I can definitely okay cuz the baking was a bit of a part of it wasn't it s of you know which I mean there something so delightful to have a club started with that kind of thing happening on the ground and we came home in the footballers bus we didn't come home in the supporters plus oh that's interesting now let me ask about that it's one thing going up in the bus when the footballers are sober yes um and uh and partaking of the of the of the baked goods yes it's another thing after the result be it a win or a loss but especially if just trying to think in terms of the wins but especially in terms of the Winds um there would have been a few drinks were how well behaved were the footballers well I well well I was was in the bus with Dawn so I in they behav yes yes car okay okay no I mean I've heard a number of stories about this which would which included stops stops that were needed on the way often often regular stops it must be said presumably for the men and perhaps even the women uh one or another either side of the bus I can only no toilet on the buses back there no no no they were definitely stops so don just to oh sorry going to say about the recruitment that people forget because I remember dad used to always talk about and they finally overruled the the 13 import Rule people don't have an appreciation of how hard that was that was a restriction that was put on the Raiders by the Sydney clubs they didn't want to be losing all their players to us so you know that first year of signing up um three grades worth of players um 50 60 odd players they were limited to 13 from um from from Sydney so that that was and it was the first couple of years and then I think in the third or the fourth year it was finally rescinded but it was a really really tough it was the only never it never got put in on any entry for any other team that came in in the NRL afterwards but yeah certainly the Raiders in the in the little war at the time and I remember Dad saying that was very difficult that was potentially I mean a crushing you know what I mean if if it had continued well it would you would never have been able to buy the malman ningas Gary beles so it was you it was very very restrictive and it was Sydney clubs looking after themselves which is fine but eventually I think after certainly it was at least 2 years if not three and then he could go in the market for some high profile players and be comfortable to get them but it was very tough I remember him you know he and Jr very glad when that rule um was was set aside so when the Raiders come in um uh what do we say the difference in age between you and Dave is five years five years five years so you're in your sort of mid sort of teens and and and playing football was your dad able to get to games did he take an interest in the definitely took interest um but Mom was the one that took us everywhere cuz Dad would be away a fair bit very familiar story but go on yeah mom um but yeah he would definitely get there when he could and if it was a weekend that we were all playing at home in Camp it was great um but if he went away they were away for two or three days um and also even in the offseason he was away quite a bit he was always scouting and going and meeting people and um you know he he had to do a lot of travel um because he it was you you you were the coach the recruiter you were everything um so but yeah that's he had you mentioned before about the country he had a lot of people in the country he trusted so if some of them tipped him up about a young player he would go out and meet them and see them because he trusted the the people that he nine for for years so that was that saved you having talent scouts back then they were just all footy mates of his that that that cared and would ring him up and say that we got a good player so that helped a lot um but certainly getting rid of the third import helped a lot um and you then Dad targeted queenslanders he was he played for Queensland he targeted the queenslanders because he knew how strong that competition was and we were very very lucky to to get queenslanders down here before the Broncos that even existed that was the the biggest break we had particularly getting a male but um you know to be able to get those guys well certainly get to that in a moment uh you know the the the Milestone moment but D to you you you mentioned that you had some little earners as a teenager they being perhaps a little bit of part-time babysitting that work Babys but you you you you had I believe one or two other earners in early know um I was officially the first Raiders statistician and you go get paid $20 by The Daily Telegraph to do the tackle camps oh by the Telegraph and they on the Monday morning would be in the paper the tackle Counts from the games that was the first stats really ever taken it wasn't missed tackles or all the stats you have now is just purely tackles so um I used to love it I'd get down to the sheds and i' had hand the journalist over the the sheet of tackles and I'd get $20 so yeah we all had jobs um but the ones that were paying were always good babysitting was always good but it was a big part of our life it was it was it was everything that you know we grew up with it the whole time I was only I was looking around for Sarah Williams Sarah being the uh the the daughter of Ashley Gil Ashley hooa gilbertt and you did mention that there were one or two players that made sure that they they came straight to you to make sure you got the tackle count correct very important and Ash G was one them used to come up and see how many tackles did I get and are you sure I only got 30 and um you know I'd always have handed it over already to the to the journalist but um yeah certainly I remember Ash was always keen on his tackle counts and uh but yeah it was interesting to see it printed in the paper the next day and um it's it's a lot more sophisticated today but yeah it was we always had roles within the club somewhere your mom was unpaid roll um and when Don couldn't do the tackle count if he was the way I had to do it for there we go there we go so yeah that would have been tough would it would would you was that a tough job or that was a tough job yes it was a tough job I would like to do that myself I also we had David was the ball boy and I also organized the ball boys each week excellent did he get was that an earner for Young D I don't think it was I can't remember thought they got $5 they might have I I got a feeling he said got each very much a family affair it was yes well and and and just picking that up just in case I don't get to it or don't have a chance and given you your father's role in Queen Bean with the Raiders uh and having two sons in a era where there weren't as many opportunities for to be to be a daughter as uh as daughters now have as we know but going back then um one of his uh uh uh sort of almost extracurricular skills was boxing that is to your father who in I believe I'm right in saying on one occasion did fight for the Australian heavyweight title light heavyweight title Lighty was um but he never boxed when we were growing up he never boxed he'd finished boxing by then my mom was horrified when she met him and that he was a boxer um and had to watch him a couple of times but he he' finished boxing he hit the bag to train and but he definitely finished boxing by the time we we were born and growing up well we and we just to to pick that up um I I do know because the the that we were hearing this on the Great Vine uh or indeed saw it on a couple of occasions that that that Mar and your younger son Dave was fairly useful with his fists uh not quite an era when when when that could occur because that might have been a little bit before his time but it was certainly still uh happening in his time and and he was one of those players on the football field that didn't get picked for obvious reasons but I'm told that your older son uh was a DE was rather good with the gloves we all dad made us hit the bag downstairs so we all had to learn how to he used to say it was no load to carry to learn how to defend yourself and that was what he he would made sure that we could defend ourselves and it was we would get in trouble if we got into a fight we didn't get in many fights but he would always we always had a bag boxing bag right and I was the only kid that I knew that had one but we always had a boxing bag in our house was can I say in your from the time sort of you know perhaps mid teens in your foot calling was were were fights still common place at that time or was it beginning to change it was definitely changing we went to a strict Christian brother school I mean you'd get in trouble if you know during what playing the league and Union yeah it wasn't wasn't really you know it wasn't the done thing You' certainly getting in a lot of trouble at school um by the coaches so not necessarily but it was you know it was it was good to keep Fitness and um as I said dad was strict on that sort of discipline and and making sure that you learned how to defend yourself if you needed to down the track I think Dave took it more seriously than I did he interesting talking about your father and discipline because he came to to to the coach you know coaching the Raiders with a very significant track record of of of coaching and playing of course um he one thing he brought was was and with along with it his offside of Brian Burke if I'm not wrong the two of them were were were were were I do believe I'm right in saying that with Dawn he felt that the the way of staying somewhat competitive in the earliest years with the Sydney teams was to be fitter than they were and he brought that to he and Brian brought that to the early years to be a a disciplinarian yes yeah Brian was very strict and very very tough very fit man himself yeah um and preseason started earlier um but without a doubt um they both were big disciplinarians and so Dad leaned on Brian a lot yeah he was fantastic for the stories are you know legendary on that side of things but interestingly it's pretty much the the perfect segue well we might we might stop there I'll tell you why CU we'll go straight to meninga arriving and the changes Mar can I start with you on on mail the weather about the weather remember you mentioned how important it was it was a really nice day right yes which which so let me we ready to go so Maran when we talk about major moments in the history of the cber Raiders rugby league club I don't think you'd get any dispute if you said that the most crucial moment in terms of the players success of the club was the arrival of of malman ninga now I know you've got a couple of memories of that um one of them to do so the Raiders are trying to pitch to Mal to come to this club which of course in the earliest years hadn't been par well not very successful um he was very much one one of the one of the major players of the code at that point the weather came into it let's start there well firstly I was told not to mention a word to the reporters about Mal maninger coming I was playing tennis in CRA with Brian Burke's wife cesley Brian was the trainer for the Raiders it was a beautiful August day in in 1985 and I said to CES what a beautiful day he'll probably sign today and he did sign that day that's something I can always remember and why you know in terms of his his signing was it clear to you and Don that this was going to be significant was there anything around that and you're discussing it or once again did you leave the football to the to the coach well I did leave the football to the coach but Don did say by signing a player like that you had a chance to get other players to come and that what followed with Bel and the Ws and pretty much the rest is history after that as has been well covered but it was really important so did the just on that um did the club in the early well let's the first several years of of Mal being here were there changes other than on the football field was there was it was it um was it becoming clear that the sort of pretty much Bush Club cuz it was in the early years this this country Bush Club was was was going to be changing in the period let us say well M you know ' 86 87 888 did you feel that the club was changing in some ways for the better what was the feeling then oh I think so yes definitely for the better more professional and Don if I can ask you on that with with your dad cuz you're getting a little bit older at this point males arrived um bringing up you know other players are being attracted to the club and if we sort of to the pretty much the chase of 1986 and 1987 we know that he arrived and there was an expectation talking to Glen Lazarus about this uh who remembers it a huge expectation from Cambra fans that the Raiders were going to have significant success immediately but of course 1986 was not a not a very successful season um so we moved to 1987 Don do you have memories of those two seasons I can remember ' 86 you know you know people being dis disappointed with the team and there was a lot of pressure on M obviously he was a big name um but on um the queenslanders that followed made a difference and then for the for the Glenn Lazarus and Ricky and all that and lorries that came up to play alongside M they loved running out after him so definitely it changed and and the patience of the fans you know was getting thin after 3 years y but um 87 absolutely they saw the light but I know 86 I think M had a couple of injuries and lost a couple of games that we should have won and so there was frustration you know people say what they say in the in the in the grand stand so he was under significant pressure as the highest profile player we'd had and and what about Dawn's as coach so 86 is going to be a fairly difficult year um and and he makes the decision in in hindsight a clever decision there's no doubt about that um and and I think I'm right in saying the very first time in in Premiership football that they'd been a co-coaching situation yeah uh they had been you know in a sense silent you know ghost coaches as it were but nevertheless that this was well publicized um and as we know and from both Dawn and from Wayne um it was a relationship that did work well in what was itself an interesting and slightly volatile uh year that that as we know ended almost in glory but not quite what what Mar I'll start with you do you buy an insurance do that first Grand Final year um 19 87 is there anything that that stands out for you in that in that that you know when the Raiders this was this was definitely disproportionate success do you know what I mean for a club beginning in 1982 to to be doing so well in 1987 late especially do you have any memories of that grand final year I do have memories because in 1972 Don was coaching easts and we played Manley and Bobby Fon was in the side and Manley beat us so in 19 87 Bobby Fulton was the coach and Manley beat in the grand always remember good have that on I can remember that that's one thing I did Don talk about this did you no I just remembered that that one but it's quite significant that it was you know Bobby for yeah yeah a hard man one of the greatest of the game as we know to say the least very very disappointing but it was a wonderful thing to make the grandf farer but very very disappointing that we lost well I myself grew up in the northern beaches of Sydney and Manley was was our team back then and to say the least fton was a was a key player in the side that's exactly right in fact I still remember when he played because he was called up into the services at one point and as a result of that he played in the services against the All Blacks I think at North soval for memory and the All Blacks won of course but but Fulton was had they all said you know was was the best player on the field when he played the All Blacks but that's by The Bu Don can we go to you season 1987 you're getting a little older y um and and what are you you know what's happening for you are you still doing anything for the club no you know any Earnest still happening no um so no I I I wasn't here then um um but um I remember um it was pivot pivotal time and dad was getting to the end of his coaching career and but he knew Wayne Bennett no one down here didn't know who Wayne Bennett was nor did they know him in Sydney but they both because of his Queensland success know Y and Toba dad connections with tumba um and that's where Wayne was from so he he picked this guy out he wanted to have a say in who was going to take over from him and the plan was that Wayne would take over and be here for a long time yeah obviously that didn't transpire um but I think his pick was justified because everyone realized what a good coach he was going to be of course the Broncos come in in ' 88 and then they pinch him back so um as as has been missed for many times we were lucky to get those Queens then players in here before the Broncos came in because undoubtedly the Gary beles and Walters they would never have left pris their Hometown um and indeed some went back and some went back that's right Peter Jackson and all those went back which you understand but um yeah the plan was to hand over to Wayne that didn't happen but um the selection of of of way was was a great choice and dad got on very well with him they weren't certainly there was nowhere he goes between the two and um it was a great year Well to consider and on you might want to comment on this to consider consider that then and you can appreciate it better than most because of everything you've done and that is that you know you're looking for a coach so you get Wayne Bennett you know Don and gets Wayne Bennett and then because you know and and alas Wayne's going back to coach the Broncos and then you get Tim shein um not you know CU even with as we know with shiny even though he'd had some you know some success it was still on the face of it not you know you're not going for a sort of Glamour coach but but the rest is history so the Raiders managed to get two of the two of the great coaches of of of of the code and they were young for young best young coach coming through absolutely both two very good choices Yeah Yeah by the club so Mar just to and we'll leave 1987 but you would have gone up of course for the Grand Final anything particular about I can only assume disappointment but still pride in having got there oh yes but very disappointed but then of course we've had I had 994 which was great yeah yeah the Raiders well well we certainly get to the to the great to the great years absolutely but before we get there um so so 1987 passes and as we know and I think I'm right in saying in fact Glen Lazarus was only repeating that a moment ago when I was interviewing him and that is that that that Tim has always said that he felt 1988 the Raiders could have won that that year if things had gone right if had a little bit of luck Ricky Stewart's always talking about that every coach is but a little bit of luck the Raiders could have won in 88 but we didn't and thus we go to 1989 and we have to get to to the year that culminates in a grand final that is still regarded by most Keen judges is the greatest Grand Final ever I must say the Grand Final we just saw was pretty darn good uh there have been some very very good ones North Queensland for example but nevertheless 1989 still holds up for all the reasons that we know and all the people viewing this will know but let's get to some of the memories that both of you have of that special year um um perhaps some of them did you feel Maran can you rem recall perhaps whether it looked as though 1989 was going to be um you know an outstanding year in the event of course a premise ship year did you feel that at the time can you remember or was it well I wasn't I wasn't as much involved in it at that time so I can't really remember a lot about it um what was the enthusiasm level in quinan well I think we'd left quinan by this time had was that in so 8 left quean hadn't we had we left okay and you there didn't when they come to camra oh no 89 still in Queen were they still in que uh uh yes 99 I think I'm right saying 990 I should know that myself I'm letting you down but I think to to go to go out to Bruce but they just you know I mean it's been written up by many people including myself about what a special year it was uh as it turns out and I've I have I think perhaps even mentioned in my book that I was I was teaching in the United States at university in the United States I was away for the entire as was my family for that entire year but what I can say and it goes to sort of hearing from both of you that for all of us it was a special year that that in sense you don't forget regardless of where you were in my case I could still remember at something like 1 a.m. or 2 a.m. United States time the phone calls from Australia started coming through of the Raiders having won I was feeling calls for about the next five or 6 hours in the United States about how amazing the game was and of course it was from both of you were there anything and and Marin I might be putting you on the spot and and and and and just in terms of the players playing for the Raiders in '89 were there any favorites that you had for any reason well oh I suppose M and Gary and the Walters brother okay Ricky Ricky okay the local boy but remember I wasn't quite involved I was earlier Don what about you where where were you were you I was at I'd finished un so I started work in Sydney I went to un I started work in Sydney but I knew Rick and Lori and all that and but they had a tough year they weren't I mean they weren't they weren't outright scraped into the semi so um you know certainly couldn't say looked like they going to win the Grand Final this year like people said of pen this year you just it never looked like that but then everything clicked in the last 10 rounds and they just in and in fact as we recall the two teams that all of Sydney expected to be in the Grand Final were Bain and sou two teams that had to say the least and Glen Lazarus was interesting on this like monster packs who were very hard you know they were they were excellent packs but Sydney expected that virtually it will up till the semi-finals yes they do that you know and and and then things began to change but in terms of the two of you anything to add and perhaps not but in terms of your response to that Premiership success was very very real Pride but just an amazing time to be in a one team town like you know here but just to to win that for CRA um there was a lot of naysayers still in Sydney about CRA being in the competition there was a couple of very prominent media personalities that never thought the Raiders should have still been in it um I think Steve Walters tells a very good story The Breakfast the Grand Final breakfast the introduction of all the teams they went through one by one the balain teams and called out all their names and they went Mal maninger and and the rest of the Raiders are sitting like we were an afterthought you know we were we were there as a sid show because B were going to win it yeah you know and they all got that sense the players say they all got that sense of this was this was a c done done I you know I mean so certainly having gone through the newspapers you know right through them so when um Maran when did you come back to queenan did you say you were you say you were away we were we was Dawn coast East and sou1 and 72 and then we would and then 73 he wasn't coaching the league club had burnt down we didn't come back till the end of 73 yeah no this is 89 now M so just to go to when the Raiders won their first competition yeah you were still living you moved to J bomber or something like you were still living here but just no I see but just to Jer bbra I'm you know oh yes but I yes it wasn't until DAV had come back into the Raiders at 91 that I started you know taking a lot of more interest in it naturally yes and that's actually the perfect segue for me because I was going to get there and that is um given the connection that you'd had but then Dave you know I mean his career is is is is beginning to be significant did that um reactivate you know well a greater sort of involve not involvement but interest in in the games because it was your son well actually yes that's right because I I sort of more or less retired a little bit from the football and then in 1991 when David became you know came into the Raiders with Tim Sheen oh I said my goodness I've got to start again so of course I've started again and now I'm still going in 19 in 2023 I am still following the Raiders there you go there you go sorry you go yes well that's and still worrying about the don't we all but the so and going back did and given taking Don around to his sport and and your and presumably your daughter yes did that also go cuz Dave being a bit bit younger but were you were you the transport for Dave as well absolutely the transport for David and luckily I had more time David was in a lot more football than Donnie or especially my daughter uh and I had a lot more time then because Donnie and Kathy were older so I only had David to concentrate on so I was able to right take him and was that uh let's just spend a couple of moments there you know Dave in his in his sort of early footballing was he and it's interesting to I mean I'm certainly I'm interested and I'm sure viewers would be in in your memories there was he absolutely committed to to getting somewhere somewhere with his football from the start H absolutely he was yes but there was no he didn't have to do it like I mean you know just wanted wanted to do it yes yes cuz he and again you might you know it's in in the absolutely bleeding bleeding green book where he ke he had he filled out a sheet about his goals apparently and the and the goals that he mentioned were were were preent to say the least you know they achieved virtually all of them so he's starting to I mean he's has come into the Raider system and you say that did that involve did that mean uh did you then want to come to games as often as you had back in those early days of the club well what I'd like to say is when the Raiders left Queen Bean I think I signed a for paper like everyone else in queenan that I wasn't going to come to camra I mean you know we wouldn't do that I do remember Tony Woods for example was particularly insense sign all those things well when David became Raider in 991 of course what did I do I bit my tongue and came and started again it was it now let's that's an interesting one the queenan the shifting because given that I'm I'm I'm living in in sort of you know uh mainstream camber at the time yes um it's becoming clear to supporters of the club let's start there that the Raiders are going to have to move from Queen be and that from seit that you know a wonderful history is there but that the club was getting too big for that um and there was to say the least a really significant ground swell and to say thinking that you signed it I mean that tends to suggest that there was a there are a lot of people who wanted it to stay yes yes was it very disappointing was it was it was it slow to sort of come to the realization that this is forever what were you thinking did that include your your social group absolutely yes we none of us were going to come out we're not crossing the border that's right we're not going that was our team that was our team yes did they now given your you go into a change S of dramatically because of Dave's presence yes what about the rest did they did they change quickly and the the queen be people who are Hardline it's got to stay in seet well one in one in particular was my cousin John Mah who he wasn't going to come either but of course once David started with the Raiders John came every every week okay okay and that there was a lot of people that said they weren't going to come yeah I I think think there a lot of said they're never going to go and it wouldn't be very hardly hard and interestingly I think Tony cuz I've talked to you about that that he was one of them know that's it that's it I'm not coming so the change is a foot and let's just go to your uh to to Dave's you know career there um uh did did you find that I'm just trying in terms of the living arrangements and I should know this and I don't know but you might be able to help me out is he still when he's first breaking into the Raiders is he living at home absolutely David lived at home yes certainly for quite some time absolutely lived under with Mom yes my word and at one stage Wayne Bennett wanted to take him up to uh to when Wayne Ben went up I remember he wanted to take him to the Broncos I no way he's not taking good to hear that that I've talked about Wayne Bennett in terms of that that migration that in the book which I wasn't that happy and I'm sure many people weren but and given that so you said absolutely no was he of the same opinion or did you did you have discussions with your son about that no I don't think I even told him but I can just remember and i' said no he's not going to to um so of course and we can go it's interesting you said it was 91 and I you know so as we know Financial you know that was the the era of of of real financial difficulties and and there are a lot of Sydney journalists who are saying that's the end of Raiders let's let's scrub them from the comp uh and it's been covered everywhere and certainly I did in absolutely bleeding green but the net result of that of course was that and I I read I'd forgotten that until recently that something like in the season that followed the Raiders lost some 60% of their playing Personnel three and five left that's amazing now the regrouping and indeed the selections made as we know Tim says Tim Sheen's coach says is going to stay the key players say that they're going to stay and and the rest is history but Dave comes into that story of course because he's his footballing is just coming on at the time that they're building up to well in the case of and I think all three of us can remember that 1993 because if ever there was a competition that was going to be ours I'm certain by by some margin and then uh Rick's broken leg in the last game second last um you know and they we won that game by 60 points and I don't believe we won another game I think that was it we lost the last game of the round of the whole round and then and then so we've got 93 um and it it is The One That Got Away one way or another um but also then we go to 94 and that's going to be a season where where Dave comes of age first question I you know it's a good one for those was he still living at home in 94 absolutely he after after he was married and had a child there we go that's that okay all power to him and to you more more to the point yes but his footballing is is going from strength to strength uh and of course it must be said that if if the 18 1989 Grand Final was a was a brilliant game and it was always close and the 990 was a game that was comfortable well then it must be said our third and thus far only three competition but our third one in 1994 was more than comfortable it was convincing pretty much well from the kickoff Marty Bell if I'm not wrong uh drops a football drops a football uh Lex marinos who I did a book with back in the day but Lex Lex is talked about this because of his North Sydney affiliations and and and Marty Beller Etc but pretty much from that that opening whistle but his career going along at Dave's career then was that something special to you as the sort of a later installment of the club's history did you Absolut did you and did you enjoy it in a different way to the earlier years I probably worried about it more because I had a boy playing the game and so you're one of those you know and I my mother different was cricket too down it was always worried so you were a worrior absolutely and I still worry about the football now but once they retire I won't worry and was did and I did Dave ever have any I don't believe he ever had anything serious occur where you had reason to really worry I don't think it playing career no no no injuries so so and given this is the important thing for I think these interviews uh with the fers so there's Dave whose career we know is a is a stellar career to say the least um uh in football and indeed uh in coaching and we we'll get to in the moment but Don I I I remember when I was writing the book I was trying to actually figure out where when you know what what role you had when you rejoined when when not rejoined when you when you joined the Raiders in an admin capacity what year was it and what was the role okay that was 99 I can tell you when that was I can tell you when that was Don came back from he was over in England living and I can remember he came home to live with Mom and uh they never stay away did they can't get rid of them get rid them and 199 and he didn't know whether he'd go back to Sydney or not and in 19 and I happened to hear on the radio where Mitch Brennan was retiring as marketing manager for the Raiders right and somehow or other I just don't know how it came about but uh Kevin Neil was the Secretary of the time and Ricky was playing for the Raiders Y and Don came Donnie came out to get the became the um marketing manager there and then I don't know what happened but he became a chief executive now I don't know how that happened but that's what happened well let's spend a tiny bit of time on that so in the first instance it's what year and your marketing manager Super League it was 96 96 Super League start was just starting and I remember thinking that I was in England and Sky TV had taken off and pay TV had taken off and soccer was on pay TV I thought this is going to be the future of sport in Australia um and Murdoch bought um the TV rights I thought the future of sport will be pay T vs that's what's happened in America it's happened in England so then um at that stage I thought I was going to be a player agent of some sort and Rick said why you starting this job and so I went down and saw Kevin so I was the marketing manager for a couple of years um we could have done with you taking Sam A's yeah then after having dealt with them I thought I'm glad I never did that job but I did have this thing in my head where I'd provide Accounting Service and tax service and I'd be be an all in one shop for cuz as people might know that was obviously your background profession so anyway I thought that' be a cool job to do but anyway we never started it off I just stayed there and then so how long were you Mar I reckon it was three three years and then came back together the uh Club was sold um back to the Leagues Club so then Kevin lost his job y because he was Aline with news limited Y and then um Simon and Jr said you want to stay on and I stayed on for a year with Simon and then I took over after Simon went back to run the license Club so that would have I remember being the youngest CEO in the room in the first couple of years of meetings and now I look around the room and I'm the oldest but I used to I used to be very young I was a young I was a young C so what year did you say I reckon I was uh I was about 3 I think I was 34 so it would have been about 19 2000 that's 2000 if you're 34 it's 2000 2000 and that's so you I mean again cuz I couldn't make out in reading reading the sources but you went from marketing manager pretty much pretty much Simon to because it's also mentioned about general manager but and they can be different positions but not necessarily pretty much the same position and it was that's right that be 24 years ago so yeah um so it is that so you're in fact um your CEO at the point at which again it becomes another financially important milestone for the club yeah is the decision to go back to the licensed Club fully committed Jr was fully committed um and Simon was fully committed so that was always a lucky thing for the Raiders because you know we needed the license Club more than they needed us terms of financial it got us through those tough years Absolut we weren't necessarily winning but we've never ever um one of the things I always say I remember the real we're the only club that never gone back and asked for um an extension of time for money or could we get our grant money up front so we always solent um and that was very important to us cuz we had to make sure the club was around forever so financially we had a strong group behind us good relationship with Simon and Jr obviously so that made my job a lot easier because I wasn't worried about jez are we going to have enough money this year or we going to have enough money next year so we always knew that we were underpinned by a good group yeah and and and the other part of that is that and I believe you've gone I just mentioned this in in in in on the public record that the the the awareness that you had to have that if the Raiders were in any sort of financial Straits um we not it's not that hard to knock out you know to to take out of the compa gain in other words there was that looming that looming so you know no longer exists so I believe but maybe you might talk about that but but back then it definit was very real without a doubt there were clubs that didn't want us in yeah um luckily for us we weren't a financial burden on the NRL they knew we were well-run they knew we were solvent but they also knew that that we looked out to a region that was massive you know we looked out to the whole riverina so that if we're gone well then you know AFL comes all the way up from the border so if only they could appreciate that even more these days in 2023 yeah I think they they need to get out the country more but you know we're a big we're a massive geographical footprint which is often lost you know when you talk to people in Sydney but all those kids from the country look to he so um yeah so thankfully we we were successful financially during those periods it was tough some of the years you know we had turnover of coaches and um it was still also hard to recruit players here but um you know we were lucky we were well supported well supported by Cambra um so it was it's slowing by when I look back upon it now but um you know I've seen a lot of clubs people forget the clubs that came in in that time have gone you know people forget the ill Ro Steelers no longer exists Northern Eagles didn't work West Tigers didn't work AB the Super League clubs came and went Perth Adelaide um the the teams in the goal Coast three teams have come and gone during that period you know we're still we're still there and still soling so a lot of clubs didn't last and a lot of clubs came in that period and were out the back door so thankfully we never we were always out of the risk so don we are now looking at uh your longterm indeed I think probably the record making would it be is that must be close I think if Frank fcer it's in George I wonder how long he was that's going back a long way but he was he was long term but Don Fern is certainly making his Mark in years and every other way um you come on line with that the beginning of the new century uh and a coach that we get fairly early who's around for some years who's there coaching for some years is Matt Elliot um can I get your thoughts what did you think of his his period more successful early than it was late yeah and look every coach it's really hard to stay at as one Club but he was excellent for us Maddie and he was what we needed and brought through the young guys um and you know fa a difficult period that that all coaches find us it's hard to recruit here from Sydney um we he left and went to penth we didn't want him to leave at the time definitely didn't want him to leave but he he was very good for this club and um was a very good coach and and and knew his stuff and bought through a lot of good young players you know we we've never been a club that's mentioned Mal I think he's the only big name we've ever signed in the history of the club yeah you never see us go out and make a big no we haven't got the money oh you know you can't compete with the club that got the third those third party agreements we won't even get into can't match the third party agreements but be that as it may that's that's all a part of the history of the code that's all frustration but but we haven't we really haven't people go again to sign a big big name signing I well we've developed them all you know apart from Mal who had never played in the M of Wes rugby league then but he was an Australian player but yeah you know the Walters all those ones that we' signed weren't Gary coin was you know none of them were they were all developed so it's interesting it's it's forgotten today uh and when I did the book years ago it it it it brought it back to me was that a couple of those years of of matd Elliott were very successful as we know as I recall 2004 yeah uh where the Del you know we we went to the delm and I think you're actually on the public record of saying we're normally at the back of the room true and at this particular delm we were near the front yeah cuz very successful unlucky in a in a preliminary final not not to get through um dropped the ball out the line so very successful Matt Matt was and again without bigname players you know the the players that we had the Phil grahams and Adam mogs and all those were he he did a very good job with them um and we it's interesting so and and and I hadn't really given it that much thought but it but but the Raiders have had absolute top tier coaching for virtually the whole time and that and and and choices of coaches y um which have been not left field but a little different and and succeeding or if not succeeding one thinks of Wayne leaving and that's the segue to Neil Henry um who comes to us you know as a player with with a background of the Raiders as we know but also comes to us as sort of not well credentialed but not well credential but of course a quality coach uh who we lose almost immediately which must have been a disappointment to you yeah and I've seen NE plenty of times since then it was very disappointing um um um because he was assistant at the Cowboys we knew who he was of course his father was on the board we knew how good he was a coach um I was disappointed the Cowboys should never have let him go really they should have kept him and given him the job the year later but um I was always worried did he go back there but then they let gr Murray go and grabbed him back so that was disappointing because he'd won coach of the year I think um that year with us and um we had a really really really good season um but again we knew how good he was and he was um it was a bit like developing a young player and he had close ties with people at the Cowboys obviously they had thirst and they had they had some some star players that we didn't have but um but certainly you know our our identification of a good young coach has never been in question and they and speaking of which uh it must be said in terms of the club moving on is that soil uh Henry goes to North Queensland and our n next coach is one Dave ferer y um Marian to you now in terms of of Dave's uh you know growing coaching credentials um uh what were your when when he when he retired as as a footballer uh and was contemplating and ultimately did go into coaching what were your thoughts then well I naturally I would support him but I wasn't very you know not very happy about him going into coaching because a very very difficult job and it has proved to be very very difficult and no one knows that well you know it as well as anyone because of your background my background and I know and it's getting harder and harder now it is but of course naturally I will support him whatever team he's with I will support and as we know he had that well he had it stin with the Raiders with two things that I mean there are various things that we could the three of us sort of talk about in those years but one was that there was some significant younger players uh who were uh at the Raiders uh who also it's fair to say proved rather difficult to handle uh in terms of their private lives their game away from football and that was and that's a that's been that's become more and more a problem for coaches in every Cod of football not just rugby league in Australia so that that was that was an issue uh there were other issues but as we know in that period of some success and and and not so much success we get our way to 2013 where in fact you've got the situation with your two sons yes the one is CEO and the other is the coach of the Raiders in difficult times um that must have been very you know and I'm not expecting you to say much but that must be in particularly difficult time for you very very difficult time I had two boys to support and I'll always support the two boys and I'm sure I mean I know they' got them well but I'm Don I shift to you because again and I've I've used it in the book that that was you felt the most difficult decision you've ever had to make possibly in life but certainly as a CEO of the cber Raiders um but at the end of the day it seemed to me in balance it was handled with as much dignity as you could possibly have and not just you but the situation has could have been brought to bear but do you did you want to say a couple of things about I think I said it in your book it was a awful time was the worst worst thing I've ever ever had to do letting people go is terrible anytime anytime you know and um you close family member I um and I I did it and the board instructed me to do it but he would have been disappointed if it wasn't me that told him but it was really really difficult and um you know people forget the human side of you know for families you know mom might sit there when we're losing and hear people say terrible stuff about your son you know from the crowd you know whether you're a coach or a player it's it's terrible being a family member when it's your family that's getting criticized and you can't do anything about it and I've sat through that when when Dave was coaching and as his mom and people forget all of that when it's sport it seems to be I can't imagine what that's like but because having most recently when the Brisbane Broncos only beat us in the 2023 season at home and I'm sitting there with a bunch of with the family A bunch of Broncos behind us who were to say the least rather vociferous and even holding back when you're identifying with the players on the field as a fan supporter of the club much less that you're the brother or you're the mother I couldn't cope it is difficult you always read family members say the same thing it's no different it was no different when Dave was coaching it was very difficult and um you know you just got to you just got to bite your tongue but difficult period in our club's history um and um but he still has a great relationship with most of the people here and um he understood because he'd been in footy all his life coaching is results driven absolutely it is we had a couple of good years horse racing and football coaching football coaching so so he knew it was results driven he knows that's the risk of what you take you know and I we've got Ricky here he's been by two other clubs you know like he's been through it and he knows abely it's you know can be a run of outs that you get that you can't you can't resurrect and then you're gone so um you know the the the relationship with he and the club is still good and and from that was the most important thing for me still my brother I still love him he still loves me we got on really really well you know he laughs about it we he introduces me after he's had a few views you know he's the only one that's his brother's coach and only way unique aspect of R history we you know make jokes of it so but yeah but he's I mean as as we know he's he picked himself up dusted himself off uh back in the th whether he want whether M wanted him to go back into coaching is another story but that's what he decided to do he did it was in his blood and he always wanted to do it and coaches are like that they you know you see you talk to mad you see what he went through at West you know and just drain their life and and then they back up a ganger gets a drug that they just can't uh Shake it's absolutely absolutely and we we know this it it exists very real so look we'll we'll bring the the the inter View to a close but it would be remiss of me Maran not to mention uh when I was doing the absolutely bleeding green Raiders history uh you were kind enough uh through Don uh to allow me to go through your meticulously kept um scrapbooks of raider history the one thing I didn't ask or perhaps I didn't I've forgotten uh is when did you start those scrapbooks and when did you finish them I finished I started the scrapbooks to 1960 from won is that right yes wow and I am still doing scrapbooks now fortunately continuously have you continuously I have every word that Don Don junor has said didn't Mo scrapbook and anything about David I get all the papers and I cut little bits out and they will read them eventually after I've gone they won't be the only people who read those I'm going I'm going to tell you because if you can get your son of his backside because the thing is with the history of this club and hence in fact even getting these interviews camra every Club has a unique history but some clubs the uniqueness of some clubs is better than others uh we fit into the latter category ours is ours is better than than virtually all other than the 19908 I'll I'll defer to the 1908 uh clubs but other than that we've got that history I didn't I wasn't aware I assumed Don was I was you know but a so that's an absolutely unique historical record it's amazing yeah and one you know basically all of us are going to pass on uh it must be said and that's something that should be it's already is for the for the Raiders something very special but it's also something that can be a boost to the club understanding and working with its history even more so so I hoping that at some stage you will consider that is you have you have left various elements of your legacy to the club that we've discussed but that would be an additional one to keep in mind because I wasn't aware you know I I had in mind that you'd done like the first five five or six or sort of that period but to go back to 1960 that's a rugby league and incidentally we might get the you know get the the the the Peter vales off his backside as well because if if we've done history better than the than the than they've done history I'll tell you that right now but at the moment it's in a it's in a grim stage but I mean that's a that's a real that's a real historical record so well done remember when I met Don you know his mother had lots of cuttings but they were all messed up you know so I thought well I'll make them I'll do it from 96 she she had on before 1960 but they were just you know not done put in a book or anything so from 1960 these things are very they're very special and when players retire no matter how glittering their career might have been or otherwise they do look back do you know what I mean now when they're going through it not so good very hard to get them sort of sorted there and to talk to the playing the footballers who are playing but when they retire especially if they've had a an important well you know significant career they do take an interest and that's when it becomes even more we'll just wait and see because they're in the garage and they're in boxes I hope they I hope your son and your daughter are aware of how Val unique they are know and they're they're not a dollar value value but in fact a a value to the code because that's what they are they might be absolutely unique I I they I mean West there's a couple there's only two or three clubs that have got anything that might resemble this so keep that in mind furnace because that's extremely extremely important well I'm very lucky to get the papers I'll give the papers and I'll see something about Donnie and I'll put it in he wouldn't have even seen it he doesn't even read it and the last thing and we'll finish on this note and that is that given how important they are if there's anything else and you know when you ask the former players you know they got anything significant inevitably you're going to get jumpers that are signed or you're going to get videos or whatever you know that's that basically they're not quite a DI a dozen but they close to it yeah in your case with the the club give some thought maybe talking to Dawn and I'd be happy to be a part of that if there are any other items things sort of memorable I that are a part of the special history of the club they too should be something that you might want to think about uh not necessarily leading leaving to your to your children but in fact to to maybe the club that's been so important in their lives because I think that's um it's very important chamber Raiders respect in honor the traditional custodians of the land and pay our respects to their Elders past present and future we acknowledge the stories traditions and living cultures of Aboriginal and torist straight Islander peoples on the land we meet gather and [Music] play this project was supported with funding made available by the ACT government under the ACT Heritage grants program e