Bleeding Green Interviews: Ricky Stuart

[Applause] all rers fans it's Jared kroer raer 284 here you're listening to episode number six of the bleeding green podcast series okay it's the 30th of January 2024 uh shortly before what is going to be I'm sure an outstanding season for the cber Raiders um it's my great pleasure uh to be conducting the sixth interview um in a series The Bleeding green interviews uh which are with key rid of people over all the years uh so that we've got from got these interviews for both the ACT um Heritage slac government archives and also for the club itself it is my very very real pleasure to be interviewing uh today Ricky Stewart uh it's the old cliche to say needs no uh uh introduction but not only that um a legend of the club a legend of the codee um we're going to work our way uh from childhood onwards uh and see where we get through from childhood all all the way through to the uh the constantly enjoyable years as coach of the camber Raiders Ricky Stewart welcome thanks David I uh was lovely intro okay we are going to go back and and and and to those earliest days in in uh queenan and growing up but let's start with a general one was it important for you to be growing up in a um mediumsized Country Town rather than the city as you look back well look back at it now I'm I'm very happy that I did obviously there was no choice in that but um looking back on it now I'm very happy that I grew up in a uh born in queenan at an early age we moved to naraba where Mom and Dad still live um naraba quean they neighboring suburbs but in a New South Wales obviously and but very similar um quean quean had a country people um to me the upbringing with country people is they're very selfless and still today I see this type of uh environment atmosphere around queenan um narab underwear mom and dad are still in Gord street today it's um it's a little Community you both those areas and Al also also growing now queenan um with a number of uh satellite suburbs around but um I remember those days those early days where sport was such a big part of both queenan and CRA you know if you're before school you're either kicking football bowl on the ball lunchtime you have doing a bit of sport cuz it's got a really rich history you know what I mean for a town that size a really rich history of of sport full stop but especially you know rugby and rugby league um and you sort of a a lucky recipient of that it wasn't uncommon to be um playing Indoor Cricket in queenan or playing touch football in queenan uh touch football in camber or as I say before school during school after school you doing something with Cricket or football and and it was very common those days with um the generation of how we grew up um it's a uh for me an up bringing that I would never ever want to change let's say a bit more on that you you know you mentioned your mom and dad and uh and obviously a close family I know about that from from our talks in the past but how important was that that for you family life and the Family itself in terms of encouragement um and your your settle life I think it's help my coaching to be honest cuz I've been very fortunate had that support All My Life um with my brother Jamie and sister Julie you know we've had that support from Mom and Dad and not every girl or boy are fortunate enough to have that from their parents um whether they there was been a um uh a single parent family or a or whatnot and I find that it's a big part of my coaching in providing that support especially to those players that uh haven't had that arm around them as a a young boy maturing young boy growing up and you can you can provide that um comfort and advice now you found yourself at cetti's uh school which itself has a rich history of a rich sporting history uh let's let's pause there for a moment how how significant was that and were there any earliest influences on your football uh that you received in in those those school years those sport years those those rugby years at cetes well they liked it the boys all reckon I liked it that much I reputed um some say I had a couple children before I left that I repeated that many years um I did repeat year 12 there was probably the best decision I ever made it was a great balance right throughout my time at St Edmund's College it was a great balance of Education Sport and um sensible discipline and one person that comes to mind who has had a a big influence on my life um from the early days being at St edmans is brother Bob wallow um he was the the Headmaster of st's college very high up in the Christian Brothers and also the chairman of of the Australian school Boys Rugby Union um very very strong man um but had a major influence on my life and um one of those one of those teachers Brothers um head Masters who um um really put a lot of spirit into the school and camaraderie um it it goes without saying that that that rugby and rugby league are very strong in the entire region was that ever an issue for you and I'll sort of we'll work our way forward to the decision made given thatth you know and I put it in the book cuz you'd mention it to me that you did say to John McIntyre to Jr y uh that the Raiders would have the The Last Call on on your services um but but just before we get to that in growing up and with the two codes did did you play both I I don't I might have asked you this but I played I played I was four year old when I went to kindergarten and played uh Union rugby league right up until I was 16 Saturday Sundays Saturday which was which which which Saturday was Union Le League was Sundays I played for the quimi and blues Y and played for St Benedicts as a uh as a four-year-old I did three years in the sevens and then uh moving into year five at St edmans College that's when I played for uh St edans U but it was always Saturday Sunday so I was training four days a week and most days there where you talk about support from your family most days there was always Tuesday Thursday so you do after School straight into a 4:3 5:00 session of rugby league in at queenan so there's a lot of travel uh a lot of logistical uh work from the parents but uh um Dad was also heavily involved in the administration of the the junior Blues right so um our weekends were full Saturday's Union you know my brother will be playing as well um Sundays will be League my brother be playing as well so we usually finish that and um have a showerer and go to the uh go to the home Raiders game at Su overal but it was a it was it was an issue when I got um got back into uh sorry when I moved forward into 15 16y old age groups because brother Bob Wallace wanted me to um give give Union I give League away and play Union and and I didn't want to then I started moving into playing first 15 football um I remember a Funny Story one day I was playing S3 ball for the cber Raiders at seford ail and we played an early game it was that morning and it was it was quite muddy and I um I thought I was it was going unnoticed but I played um Dad was the coach of the SG ball team under 16s at that stage played that game had a shower got in the car and mom took me straight to St edans college to play a first 15 game was against Daren Mar and I got bad cramps late in game and I still remember walking off I still still remember to this day uh that we did win and going into the change rooms that um I said to brother Wallace that gee I got some bad cramps there today and he said it usually happens when you play two games in one day so um and I still remember where I said it and how we said it and I knew there was going to be some change but yeah I was always going to finish that season off with SG ball in the under 16s um and there were some consequences there on the at the end of it which I'll make you aware of in a moment but um brother brother Wallace um we made the final y ball final the cber Riders versus param we played at the the the Sydney showr just outside the Sydney football stadium there yep and we had a New Zealand Tour on and myself and Lance Willington another very um successful school boy footballer um who played Junior Raiders um well allowed to play in the in the Grand Final so it didn't go down real well with Dad and the cam Raiders were prepared to let us play and then fly us over to New Zealand for the tour right uh but it wasn't good enough for brother Wallace and he was putting his foot down and and there it was he he basically said to me that um you got to make a decision leave school or uh give League away did your dad and brother Wallace ever chat about this yes right yeah right that might have been interesting to be a fly on the wall did well I went home to Dad and said look I've got to make a decision now it's either um I've got to give School away um I've got to give School away um or I got to give rugby league away and I said so I'm I'm going to give School away yeah yeah tough fun tough fun dad at time well Dad worked hard all his life he was a laborer y worked very very hard and he said there's no way in the world you're going to going to be doing the work I've done he said you're going to school and I wasn't happy CU I didn't like school he loved it for the sport reasons but I wanted to play rugby league but um from the advice of dad I um had to give League away and then finish off year 11 year 12 and I actually did year 12 again in 1985 right just a back track cuz it does and it does pertain the the so the the first season of the Raiders as we know is 882 and you've talked to me in the past and indeed in other interviews about the impact of of that you know and we'll sort of jump just on that point how significant was that you know the first couple of Seasons the first few seasons for you the Raiders I know you've talked about kind of basically being something of a groupy like a lot of kids your age um do you in in in terms of memories what are your memories of being kind of a fan in that earli period and and also were there any players in those first years of the Raiders that stand out in your memory as not necessarily influencers but players that you really appreciated and appreciated their work yeah I I I remember um being in the SG Ball Teams 82 83 um it GES me the exact date but it I feel as that it was the second offseason that the Raiders have had because Gary Spears was it was Gary Spears first season which I think was 83 yeah I think you I think that's right believe that's right Lloyd Martin 83 yeah um because I know there was a host of um West Tigers players at Don ferer sorry b m players at Don ferer recruited um along the lights of David Grant um Ray Blacklock I think Ray he was from New Town um but Don ferer invited us to do the every Friday session with the um with the full Squad at Taylor Park right the the SG ball SG ball Squad so um I got to know some of those players through training with them and um I still talked to this guy today and he's he's been my favorite Raider ever and his name was uh Lou Bon yeah and Lou only played one first grade game but he was always very kind to me as a kid yeah right and I was one of those guys sitting out the back of the change room waiting for the guys to come out because I was just in a of the first graders yeah of the Australian rugby league playing here at se for AAL um um I was always at the games uh all the home games um and I was getting to a stage there where I was 16 17 18 year old and and you're starting to see these guys socially you're starting to see these guys in the community um and especially in quean you know where um you know I I spent a lot of my youth as a matter of Interest before the Raiders come in in ' 82 did you have a Sydney team Manley there you go as was mine as a out two favorite players were Tom ronas and Bob Fon yeah okay um but mey was my favorite team it's interesting you should say that and I grew up in the northern beaches but I do remember when Bob Fulton I think I'm right somehow or rather he was in the Army but I do remember that the All Blacks played uh that the team that he got selected in played the All Blacks and he had a RI a game I still remember that uh against the All Blacks but yeah phenomenal player but we'll leave that for another day um we will push forward um the your debut game and I had to refresh my own memory here was the 15th a debut game for the Raiders coming on the on the paddock was 15th of May 1988 that's right uh against Brisbane at Lang park by the sheerest great Fortune for me I was in an Australian literature conference in Brisbane and really was a coincidence but I went to that game and there weren't a whole lot of Raider fans there I do remember there were a few of the really you might remember in those earliest days there was some wild sort of biky supporters of the Raiders they were there in numbers and I was actually in that group but it was an absolutely phenomenal win to say the least it was a a brilliant game to watch uh especially of course to be a Raider fan what are your memories of that first game um and to be quite clear about my most vivid memory was Jan miles putting in a chaker hole when there was a BL when there was a brawl on um and um uh uh I got to know Juno quite well after many years playing against him but that was a one memory that I thought to myself I am really now playing with the big boys and and and also of course as we know there was a crop of young players who were blooded that year um did you feel at that earliest point and you might not have given your age but that there was something special already Brewing that there was some serious Talent around you well if I remember correctly that was Brad's Brad clud's first or second game second game I yeah I think that's right Lor's probably Lor's Lor's probably getting into his double figure games there he played in7 you're right look David seeing the presence and the unique talent of Lori and Brad um Lazarus yeah yeah those three boys just um and I knew Glenn very well Froman your background I knew Brad will being a local boy I knew Lori um just their presence um and the uniqueness of their talent yeah I knew there was going to be a m they're going to have a massive impact on not just the Raiders but the game yeah because at such a young age they were brilliant yeah and you know it's interesting we know this with the with the the guys you just mentioned that you were talking about your dad and he worked off and and that that had an impact on you you know if I'm not wrong you had Lori D an early age was working briefly in an Aire I think Glenn lazarus's dad was a sheerer brad Clyde's dad was a sheer you know it's so interesting to see that that kind of group together and hard work hard work never scared us because we grew up in hard work families yeah um and I I don't want it to ever be underestimated that um the the talent of the three you know well you put yourself into that think that four that four group i' I'd forgotten this that in 1988 basically you you you you guys won the awards at the end of the year you were player you know there were depending on it I think I think Cy was the was the the Rookie of the Year lar was the players Player of the Year you got I think it was you know some an award similar um as did Lori Daly so even in that year there was a recognition which is sort of almost the perfect segue to say how significant in the earliest period was the fact that Tim Sheen was the coach for you in particular let's start there well being being a player that never played a senior game of rugby league moving from uh senior Rugby Union straight into the ARL those days um I was so fortunate to have it was an advantage to have an experienced first grade coach um I still remember making the phone call to John McIntyre about John I'm I've been approached to um uh go to belmain through Warren Ry and um um the Bain Tigers Keith Barnes yep and within a week John was up in Sydney and the Dual was done to come back home um so and it's still around today in this club the loyalty and comfort in in our Le um but having an experienced coach in in Tim was a great Advantage for young players especially a player that never played Senior League football and was there an expectation even in that year 1988 that there was that that that something might even special might even happen that year or was there do you know what I mean a feeling that it was building there was a last year of Peter Jackson yeah Rusty Soul yep um and when you talk to Tim shes I think I have heard Tim say this before that he thought 88 was his best best team yeah yep yep I've talked to him about that as well isn't that interesting yeah um and and the more so clearly because of what happens in uh in 198 uh you know in in 1989 but I have heard him say that we have to just so we can move it along though given how significant that year was and the quality um you know just mentioned of the footballers then so we moved to 1989 and and as a lot of even proba die hard Raider fans like myself at moments you do forget that in that par in that that wonderful that that that fantasy first year um that that there was a well I won't call it a slump but there were a number of losses in the middle of the year I think I'm right in saying there were eight games in the middle of the year and two only were victories so that in other words you had you had that as well however the buildup and we could spend more time on it people can read the book if they want to and talk and and and and and pick up on that but at the beginning in the introduction to the book and I'll I just read a couple of things in the in the interview to get you to comment on um one bit right in in my introduction I say this older Raiders supporters today remember exactly where they were during the late afternoon of 24th September 89 when John chicker Ferguson Ste stepped and stepped again into history chriso Sullivan kicked a crucial extra time field goal and Steve Jackson bulleted his way over for the match winning try that ensured free dining out rights at any rate of function for the rest of his life that we both know he taken advantage of renowned Australian novelist Tom canel a manly Sea Eagles fan uh great friend of mine joined a host of ecstatic commentators struggling to find words worthy enough to describe the game they just watched canel perhaps summed up the Euphoria best when he declared it was a movie script that came to Life a game destined to be a unique memory this bit I like Ricky Stewart's boots given to him by fellow queenan product rugby Legend David campy were compared by cani to fragments of the True Cross Too farfetched I asked the question not for the hordes of raider True Believers let's start with the boots um give us a little bit of background am I right in saying in fact you did not have your boots you know I forgot them yeah I forgot my boots and I I didn't realize until we had to run the morning a morning before and David campoy was a um great mate and also ex teammate at the uh the quean whites um we wore the same boots and we were the same size did you know that or did you was it onp to give him a no no I no I knew that right I knew that and um we both W up uh ad dudas boots I Copa Mel and um the um Campo being typical camp delivered the boots with 15 minutes of advice and we went on to win the game so I still remember Camp coming to the change rooms after the match now as in trying to put that together uh in the book I I was so struck by Father John Woods um note to Mal um but of course he goes back a long way well a very long way in the club and indeed continues his great work with the club was he a part of your experience of the Raiders in that earliest period I I have heard from maybe from you but certainly that when uh when you were doing sort of the various early Fitness work when when when father Woods was was pretty damn fit he still looks pretty good but that he was as often as not he was at the leader the leader of the B he was a he was a apart from being a priest our priest Father John was a mate and today I still see father up to training once a week um we've just had him in and introduce him to all our new Squad members we've just had a uh um a brief um celebration of um um young doin's um unfortunate accident and um Troy dgen and and father father's just like one of the staff and to me who I've known for along um um he's got such a subtle way of being a part of things hasn't he you know it's impressed me he's a trusted man yeah you know a person in in a in in this type of and not many people I mean you've probably seen it David yourself a little bit of what happens inside the walls of an NRL Club it's it's not just the glory of running out to play in football there's a lot of work that actually gets to there there's a lot of disappointment heartbreak um there's a lot of welfare issues in regards to what we doal with with each and every individual's life um because we really are the second family of a lot of those players here who have have to move from from home yeah so father Woods is a really special part of that when there might be a little bit of trauma um but he's certainly here when the when there's a high as well when when we're winning football games and enjoying enjoying the the fun of being an interal player or coach being a part of an interal Club it's such a lovely lovely part of the story which which almost you know appeals as kind of a myth that really the 1989 the back end of that and we'll say a couple more things about it I'll get your thoughts on it but to uh as we as we basically recreate it um to have you know going down to the wire um and finding I think it's Chris Sullivan's boot isn't it um that that that he you know hkes up and Lor sort of shuffles it on and then chick does one of those remarkable uh uh runs that only he could do and then M you know a tow poker who you know the only time he ever kicked go straight over the black dot was when he had the pressure on I do know that you know for memory um but we get we it's all tied up and we go into extra time um it's we've talked about it before but just your the dressing room was there a was there a what was the feeling in the dressing room did you feel that you had them at that point going into extra time well right from the start we were The Outsiders and we were never meant to be in the Grand Final we never meant to make the final Phil Phil G certainly said that the forwards weren't going to be good enough team wasn't going to be good enough he might have been he might have been trying to give us some motivation he might have wanted us to win G probably backed us um but um right from the right from the Grand Final breakfast um we felt as though we we didn't belong and that was a that was wonderful inspiration and motivation and it has been for many many years here this club did Tim did Tim use that or did he not need to use that yeah he didn't need to it was evident yeah but we did yeah and um father Woods um he came in and gave a a brief uh Speech cuz he asked Mel to read something out and M said no you come in I want you to talk and it wasn't a matter of having to motivate us David it was a grand final uh motivating the motivation was there um but then again going in at halftime sheni always sheni always said I don't care what the scoreboard reads I just want you to be playing the best football and we're playing okay yeah you know we're playing okay 122 and um he he was okay CLE with the journalist and I I read the papers said easily the best team in the first half yeah that was their comment so we we we were in the change room not worrying about the scoreboard cuz we've been we've been being coached and taught that educated don't to worry about the scoreboard because the football will win the game and we were playing very good football and we're very happy with our our first half performance and that's how we took the second second half there's no way we were a beaten mob we uh we learned a lot from that year that game um but um I still remember when it was um even we went to the scrum and Su said hit me I was about to ask that very very he said hit me I going to kick a field goal I said no no no let's take a couple in yeah let's get closer he said no no I'm going to kick it so he's getting back deep on the behind the scrum I said no I said let's take two or three in first did M get consulted in this quickly or not I asked him about pass the ball just passed me the ball and I said well e and ask him yeah and Sul typical Sul no I've hit Sul with the ball and it's a good kick and it was a good kick he didn't miss a great kick he didn't miss it you Chrissy Chrissy that was a huge call I mean against the game oh absolutely he gets it from I mean un he doesn't get the recognition for his career sure you know I tried to do that in the book because it was a remarkable remarkable career s um he was um there wouldn't have been any tougher halfback h he might have been the toughest but there was none tougher um than S with a great kind of approach to the game and and and an arrogance not the right word a sort of confidence that did border on arrogance but and there's the classic example s always Sally and I were always fighting for a halfback spot so was ended up being 76 for a long time Y and I remember two incidents one um he said I I don't believe in kicking fulfill should only kick for yourself I said that's because you can't kick he didn't like that and then the other one was he was getting getting shitty with me spal on the ball right he said I can't catch the spirals soon as he come to me said mate can you just pass Orthodox to him I said don't worry I'll just miss him out we we buted heads every now and then s and I but I have total respect for what that guy did because he was he was there in the early days and and a rocket the early you know he's ham he certainly did of all the players he probably deserved it most yeah yeah to take it upon himself and to kick such you know it was like from memory it was like 15 yards up over the black dot on the toe pooke and then you know and then had the shits with Steve Jackson scoring the tribe because he was going to get all the glory and he's honest there we go he makes me laugh so well well list in those in those twin Seasons 89 and 9090 and you mentioned your spiral passes um for those who love their football to see what you did in those in those two seasons in terms of two elements that sort of that that that that were stamped one was the spiral pass that I can only think had its background in rugby uh the way you were able to do it and the other is in fact the way that you're kicking and it's been commented on by a number of of of football fans journalists commentators um that it was the finest kicking the only person I could think of and and I'm old enough older than you to go back was probably John Pi who was a mightily good kicker but as much as anything because of the bombs rather than anything else whereas you did a number of things question let's just I mean the SP you know that's in hitting hitting men wide was something that was very special to the Raiders and I'll come to Raider football in a moment but the the the kicking did you did you work how early were we how old were you when you were starting to think in terms of the ways you were kicking a football and I say that because that too has been commented on we've seen it um and and maybe even in the Contemporary game you don't see it as as much but did you purposefully work at that over over time you sometimes get old BLS like me now um exaggerating what we've done and making it all look you don't have to exaggerate this but go on but I can tell you from the ages of four five six year old living in naraba we we were 40 m from 50 m from a Aussie rules able two soccer aels and three Rugby Union league aels Arab AEL right near boal so I was there every afternoon if I wasn't training I was playing force and back against myself I was y having having field goal competitions by myself and I um I I wasn't calling it practice then I didn't know it was practice I was having fun so call it what you want but probably from the age of about 12 year old 14 year old I would have uh I still remember the calls we had at school when I was kicking for Wingers um whether they're on the right hand side or the left hand side of the The Rock um so you know what you call it practice or you just call it having fun but uh you can't you can't you can't kick like I did without putting hours and hours and hours of fun and practice into it and um you know and then when we did those spiral bombs those floaters and all that that's that was uh I still do it out here with the boys today I want them to kick the flers I want them to kick the spirals yeah um 50% of them laugh and 50% of them have have a go at it um the ones that get it they got another string to their bow it's interesting how that you know you and I talked I think even last season was that the the business of if you if you can get that additional little second or second and a half of Hang Time then it makes such a huge difference that is to say getting good contact on your Chase yeah but it's also it's also how the fullback has to catch it then yeah you can't catch it with with any type of run uh balance in his in his in his catch and run he's got to catch flat footed he's got to catch it and uh a lot of the times you're catching those types of spir will float as you're catching them falling to the ground for the security of the catch so it's a big it's a big advantage to the um to the kick Chase so that in those two special years consecutive premise ships 1989 1990 um uh I've had great fun writing about this uh you know back in the day but the extraordinary alteration in the fabric of this of this city and indeed its relationship with queenan um was that something that was important to you and to the players and what are your memories of those special years ' 89 and 990 both for sort of from the quean point of you and of course the uh the cam the memories are how everybody got on board you know camber quman everybody just got on board and it was like once we hit 89 had success getting into 90 it was like we're just throwing coal Co into the train again you know we're getting it ready we're going again people were getting on board people were thinking here we go again there's another there's another run here we're going to be in for um it was interesting how few it happened to coincide there's another part of almost the myth of the whole thing the national capital the place without a soul you know and I've done a lot of writing on that you know the soulless place for decades and suddenly you've got you've got Bob Hawk from you know prime minister through those years sort of thing you know R Kelly Fred daily you know you could go on Bob Bob Bob Hawk Ros Kelly and John Howard I probably leave out of this comment but too many politicians just give sport lip service where I think politicians can learn so much from sporting leaders sporting people Bob Hawk Ros um John Howard they authentic genuine people and you have look at the success of those two prime ministers over many many years they've been two of our you know some of our greatest Prime Ministers ever um they they would have made it in sport not too sure about John but that's for another day I didn't say I didn't say ability um so I suppose the the the the one thing a couple points that that that I um haven't thus far mentioned that is in the 1990 Grand Final was there um and and you were the Churchill medalist for for that game if I'm not wrong is that right yeah in 1990 was was and and you you alluded only a few minutes ago to the idea of sort of you know stoking the fire you know the keep keep the engine going was that the strong feeling of 1990 do you know what I mean that this was that this was something the machine was there you know what I mean we had a taste for it and you know we had a very similar combinations from what we had the year before uh we had a taste of what success look like and once you get that taste of what a success feels like um that's your biggest motivator and it's and it's something that I've winning a grandon changes your life M MH being able to do it more than once is remarkable doing it once is unbelievable but it go we had the taste and it was something that um kept the motivating uh uh roller coaster there yeah all raer fans know that uh that the the the 1991 and 1992 were difficult because of the uh the financial issues um but 91 91 was unfortunate it was very good penth team yeah and and 90 90 was probably motivating factor for penth as well um you know very similar to a different different scenario of 89 to 91 was the fact that we were leading at half time um you know a game we could have won we didn't West B to say exactly the same thing today too that's that's what happens in those big games you take your moments and um as disappointing as 91 was is I still remember the the the or grandf final losses I've coached at the Raiders at the roosters you know they they probably hurt more than the they probably they do hurt me more than the joy of winning yeah right right and 91 I mean and and and there wasn't much in it as that's that in in the 91 season but it's interesting that and I said 91 and in fact I meant ' 92 and 93 that as we know they're sort of unraveling because of the um uh Financial issues and what a story you know is is contained there but let me just I want to I want to get your thoughts on it but I certainly did from from M and that is I think I'm believe I'm right in saying they came karoo tour uh was at the end of 1990 that's right um and uh second test let's paint the picture second test Wembley the pals have already won the first test uh there's a record English crowd uh it's 10 all um there's approximately 60 seconds left on the clock given how we could actually relive and and have already the 1989 89 grandon in certain ways it's a sort of a cliched question but one has to ask what was going through your head at that point and just take us through that special moment and and surely if it's not the greatest test try of the last number of decades it's in the top two or three but but it's probably the best tell us a bit about the you know paint the picture for us one of the great test tries was a try we scored before it where there was went through a number of hands and then there was a chip kick and INF field and Cliffy lines caught it and scored um but yeah I've talked about this a lot and I won't try and repeat myself too much but 90 um it was my second test my first test as halfback and um partnered up with Cliff lines a six and a seven and I I threw the intercept pass and um they scored to take and they missed the they missed the actual conversion and went to 10 all yeah it was 7 Minutes of football LIF and and I went back behind the goal line and I've said this before it's on record where I just want to dig a hole and die mhm I was let everybody down Australia down my teammates down everybody we're going to lose the ashes M and it was a negative feel negative sense of selfishness from himself thinking about me yeah and Gary Bel said to me snap out of it 7 minute drill and the 7 minute drill we did here at Seafood a with Tim machines in our in our club training and it was a drill we did with the football to show you how much football was left and it sort of did help me kick Kickstart me a little bit anyhow we got into the game we we kept attacking we had a couple of shots at field goal one shot I think Benny had at field goal and uh the game kept going and then all of a sudden um you history history's is showing there where I I've set up a triy for M but when when I made the break and took off I still think of a lot of moments that went through my mind there and I was going to kick 3 two yep yep and where I say I was going kick I was going to be me kicking and hoping yeah and I often I often talk to players today about not passing and hoping and kicking and hoping you can't just kick and hope there's got to be some type of instinct you got to be some of when you don't think about it y do it that's Instinct yeah but when you're thinking I hope I score off this don't kick it don't pass it cuz instinctively you don't think about the actual execution of your skill now as I kept going the more space I found and as I kept going I thought I'm getting further down the field and then i' I've said it before there's a uh a dark shadow comes over top of me and I didn't know where he was on my right on the left and then I can't hear I I there's no way in the world I I heard M but I can feel him and then as I turned out I knew he was going to come under me cuz I had to pull the fullback away yeah and um an extraordinary athlete Mal in regards to when you have a look at it where I started from and when I took off and I didn't really stay down for M he caught me yeah yeah to get there it was yeah it was a unit then too I mean to say the Le no it was one of the one of one of the I mean you know it's it's certainly the one that gets most replayed at the moment and quite quite rightly so oh it's still I get emotional when I see it just it's just from an individual point of view being able to pull us back out of the um the dark because absolutely magnificent especially given when you second and last uh Second and last uh test yeah yeah no it's terrific um just and then we'll we'll we'll move further into the uh uh you know the later parts of of of your playing career and also uh coaching of course um but you'll be talking about coaching and I hope we I can conduct an interview with you uh you know in the years to come and talk more about the coaching and we will get to that um if you were to compare grade football but let's start with grand finals the intensity of grand finals the state of origin the tests how would you rate them in terms of toughness intensity I I don't think you I don't think you get a more intense or faster game of football than origin right you've got 34 of the best players those days really 34 out of probably the 40 to 50 players in the world you know if you look at the Internationals and it was really only England and New Zealand and how many of those players would have the ability to play in Queensland or New South Wales I'd say six or eight each yeah um but you know you you're 34 players 34 players playing against each other who are the best players some of the best players in the world now Martin have being talent because origin is not just about Talent it's about mind the mind and the physical toughness um yeah I I I think origin football is probably the the the toughest challenge in regards to the physical and this the intensity and the uh um the spood of it it's a kind of unique phenomenon isn't it really and and and almost almost everyone says exactly the same certainly those who play it y it's a holy different different Bas yeah well it's and the Test match football those days was a um they were they were SLO they were tough the pommies were very very physically tough um some of those test matches we played over there uh in 1994 the World Cup in ' 92 it it was a um uh very physical they they're just tough individuals to poms yeah you've only got to have a look at all the pommies I bought here and we're going to see another one this year in Morgan smiies and he won't let anybody down in regards to his one his ability but two his toughness M well I still remember that's you know I'm old enough the 62 team dick hardart Cliff Watson po boy they were something and that that continued for some time it's a little different now for all the reasons that we know yeah let's move let's move things on a little bit [Applause] 1993 yes I was at the game the family my son Sam who is getting you know getting a little older then just said Dad it's trouble it's trouble um that was the the year that got away and and and and and given how good that side was um you were if anything i' I'd say more dominant than you had been in the earlier years how disappointing was that and and and and and what was it I I asked M this but what happened to the team when uh you know they were they were simply unable to regroup after losing you it's as simple as that but your thoughts on that yeah it was you know I was actually it was my best year I've ever played um you get a Purple Patch at times you know you have good years but everyone's had a best year and that was you know that was my best year uh from an individual point of view um the the where I put it down to in regards to how we we couldn't go on with it was the fact that um the other young halfbacks who come in Trevor Shadel Steve Stone um they they didn't do a lot of training with first grade let alone play m and that's where it's different today we do mix up combinations with our preparation training but those young BLS um who I don't think they played a game that year with first grade yeah now they all of a sudden they got to come in and play the last last competition game and then into our first semi-final yeah um there was so much pressure on those poor young BS yeah and and it it was a um you know it it was just unfortunate was it was the luck of the draw if they if I had been out for eight or 10 weeks through that year they would have got some play played half the games or whatnot they would have got some experience they would have got um game time needed in regards understanding the game with who's playing inside outside them understanding our strategy our game model but paor buggers didn't get that opportunity throwing them in the deep end like that it's a tough gig that's definitely maybe another position you know it we could have got by but when you're the link between your your middle and your Edge and you know and we we had some we we were on a roll those days yeah yeah well suffice to say that the the game that you were taken off the score line was 680 in that one and we didn't win another game so saying to me why don't you come off um at half time and I said just give me another 10 minutes I heard you mentioned this before and now fful decision David now I'll send a trainer out to take somebody off the field and he said he wants another set and I say no yeah um and then I always go and explain to them Reas I say to Blake at half time I don't want you to play the next part of Y which I did two years ago three years two years ago we played West Tigers we were leading by a great amount and I um asked a couple of players to come off in the Chang they said no no no I said yes yes yes and I explained on the reason able to say that too it actually got impact it actually it does have impact because it actually makes sense to the player yeah yeah no sure and then when they see that I'm so strong on the Note they know there's a reason behind let's move it along to we're going well on time moving along to 1994 um I'll I'll get you to reflect on the teams that you played with from 88 onwards um but let's just uh focus on 1994 did you feel during that season that there was a a little bit like 1990 perhaps that the machine was you know because there were some great great additions to the team that Tim had been responsible for looking to New Zealand as I recall but I mean it was a was a wonderful team to say the least um the was was there a sense of gain did you feel that was a part of Destiny the way it built itself up the way I feel we were rolling on from 93 right and 88 where I thought you know we could have maybe went to another game we could have been a little bit uh longer in the competition than we were as as I said Tim thought that was probably his best team he coached here 89 understanding feeling what winning was about 90 we learning and and and then using what we've learned 90 as you you talked about 91 92 we had some difficulties 93 the you my ankle but 94 um we were mentally strong we weren't going to lose and now I that mean we were we were always going to win the Grand Final but we were a confident football team we're very resilient uh physically um physically tough um and these things don't normally don't necessarily happen in a grand final but of course that was the perfect absolutely we just it was timing and was just molded well together um we had some great young plays in that football team um we had a a recruitment of of kwis com Hard Men tough men yeah yeah tough men and people have always asked me who's the toughest person you've played against and I said I've played a lot against a lot of tough people I actually say Aly Langer he was my fiercest competitor right but the toughest person I've ever played with was Quinton yeah Quinton pong yeah now 94 we we were taking the we were taking the field knowing we weren't going to lose not the Grand Final but games I remember following Malia and I say this all the time when I ask about Malo we all know the talent of malinga the individual ability of that Blake he was a he was Immortal yeah right is only Immortal now um just following that Blake out over that sideline gave me his belief confidence I was going to play well yeah I had that as one of my last questions and you just and it goes to the point of certain players and there aren't that many through the history of the code where that would be the case do you know I mean that's leadership you know I mean I have a joke there about Bob Bob Hawk and John Howard that's leadership with Mal and Mal Mal just he he just um instill that confidence in all of us and it didn't matter if ma was sitting out there not doing anything but I knew at some stage I was going to hit him with the pass and he was going to break three or four tackles he was going to do something for someone else but just from an emotion and a mental point of view the confidence that man gave us as a team not to mention of course the incentive of it being his last game absolutely going into the Grand Final yeah it's um going into that Grand Final obviously we want to send him out a winner G uh we'll get onto the coaching uh shortly a couple of things Tim saying about the 1988 team now you played with all the all you know the great teams in the Great era what's have you ever and you perhaps have and I've missed it but what do you feel was the the the most talented team of those years that you played in is it possible to single one out or not I don't think so yeah and I think it'd be unfair too yeah right because we're all fa different challenges y 89 9 we fifth yeah you know yeah 94 we're coming off a completely different uh prep to um what we did in ' 89 to 90 you know different squads different athletes uh different competition sry different opposition yeah let me ask the I hope a better question and and and that is did you feel in those years something I'm really interested in that the Raiders from well you could even say 1988 but that era of 1988 to 1994 and perhaps fractionally Beyond but but those years that the the camera Raiders changed the way rugby league had been was being played definitely Absolut and in what way can you comment on that well one of the first teams to go uh fulltime fully professional we went we went to semi-professional to full-time professional uh right from the early days we one of the the first teams to ever uh sorry one of the first teams to um uh um to make it compulsory we're in the gym three days a week so that was through Kelvin jws into Shan crra and and all on the back of shiny and that was an advantage you know instead of making it non-compulsory if you can go and do some was this afternoon that's great boys but no it was in our schedule we do weights um it was a massive part of our game sheny I've always said one of the greatest coaches of preparation yeah hard work preparation and that was I believe one of the keys is it and and just just tease out a tiny bit perhaps the nature of that football I mean to say the least you you were the Lynch pin of that and and and I'm wondering whether uh a key part of it was your capacity not unique there have been other footballers but not too many who could send a pass at such length that is to say to open up a field but also the players you were playing with who were able to stand so deep so that suddenly the days of the football of especially the ' 80s you know when you from ' 89 to '94 when you're looking at that era 88 to '94 I should say there was no negotiation in regards to our midd they were tough and they might to one every battle but I'll tell you they weren't they weren't far off they were tough men and you can go right from our front rows in 80 88 right through to 94 and that's where that's where confidence comes from in regards to wining that middle third of the football field we had some wonderful talent in the back row and we we loved to attack we love to attack We There was Defensive from a defensive point of view was a lot different those days to where it is today and there's a lot more spaces wide and with having Lai sitting out in Open Spaces Open Spaces sometimes sitting on the third or second man off the sideline um I I was fortunate enough to be able to hit him and create space and then all of a sudden L do his work La L is an unbelievable attacking player the power of His running game was such a a little bit of the Bob Fon about him you know you know you know yeah yeah sheer power power of His running game um assisted so many outside players for us know our centers including ma um and and they getting ball in space and we we had a you know it was in our DNA that we wanted to attack well I've never seen I wrote this up in the book at one point and and for memory and particularly with the memory of Cher in the background but Wingers full stop our Wingers never seen Wingers stand so deep you know when in fact it was attacking the opposition line off a scrum which is just you know and that so difficult to make a read on that when when chica goes Kenny comes in yeah um you know Brett Mullins comes in no and andru no and andu you know um you know and it was a uh the speed you can't coach for sure um last question in terms of the the playing career if you had your time over if you were starting again as a player uh or no I'll put it another way reflecting on your playing career would you have done anything differently in hindsight not one thing right right because I achieved everything that I challenged myself for and I achieved everything that uh um as a team as a group of uh players um in this club um we achieved it yeah yeah and I I didn't ask this that same question of meling I suspect he would have said exactly the same to that um okay uh we know that code changed you're in the the the basically the Twilight of your career uh in the in the in the mid to late you know the later 90s um super league is is is is on uh question about Super League um first question what impact did it have on Rugby League and was it a beneficial impact for those few years wasn't a beneficial wasn't what isn't benefit to anybody at strin toy relationships for for that Al you know that's been that's been talked about as well it just it did it strained too many relationships um there there was there was greed in regards to who um who won down the game and that's the players of the porns I don't blame one player for any of the decisions they've made uh the the the good thing about Super League for us was that we could stay we could stayed as a um uh as a team yeah yeah as a group of players we could stay together that was the beneficial um ingredient for us staying with or signing with Super League okay uh just to move on um in the uh introduction to um absolutely bleeding green the book um I write this when present day coach club and rugby league Legend Ricky Stewart took up his new Post in late 2013 he could not conceal his Delight in coming home Stuart made it clear that he wanted the Raiders back on their rightful pedestal after some lean years as one of rugby league's leading clubs a product of the PowerHouse in Edmunds College in the heart of camra Ste many times stated in the media that a crucial part of the pursuit of rugby league Excellence involves his players understanding their place in the history of the club how important as a coach has it been for you to be at least having your players as they pass through the club um aware of the history of the club and I suppose in an Ideal World some a little bit of knowledge about the history of the game well I think it's a responsibility of the player to understand who's become who who's coming before them um I think it's a responsibility of the player if they care about the club um they'll have more respect around the the facility um they'll appreciate the the past um and not just players but Administration CEOs chairmans I I think it's our responsibility as their coaches and leaders today to um help educate them in regards to um our history I'm I'm I'm a firm beli of that and I think we're one of the best clubs in the competition actually who do it um we have history lessons every week right throughout our PR season we have uh the cahoot games where we have the quizzes in regards to um some of the great uh moments some of the records some of the um outstanding Milestones that have been achieved by our greats um constantly getting INX players here and introduce them and make them feel a part of it because a lot of the ex players feel as though they've had their time they moved on their time is still available here now today I want them to be involved in in coming in and seeing the boys train and saying hello coming and sitting in meetings this it is my a big part of my job is to make the boys here respect the club and I've always said the club will look after you if you look after the club um when you began as coach at the uh in the the last uh weeks of of 2013 uh coming on board um how difficult was that in the context of Dave Ferman being your predecessor and of course the relationship that you that that that you'd had with Dave I think I'm right in saying I know 1994 he was he got the he got the medal um a terrific footballer um uh in terms of the the the the the the camarad of the club um is it as you look back do you feel it was handled as well as it could and I and I and in saying that it seemed to me it was from a distance you know this was this was tricky given given uh uh the situation with young Don as well but nevertheless it was handled with a certain dignity yeah I said earlier that you changes your lives when in Grand finals the comad the mateship um you get from winning a grand final is different it's just it's as simple as that it's different you've done something that a lot of other people haven't been able to do achieve with that group of people and he was one of them in ' 94 um there was no way in the world I was going to take this job whilst David ferer was coach um I was asked to take the job uh knowing the fact that David was um released and I I'd have to compliment Don who was asked by the board that the board would speak to um David about um standing him down um but to Don's credit it was he jumped in the car and he drove to where David de B Mar had a camp and spoke to Dave um I think that respectfully is courageous um to do so and would have been very very hard standing a coach down sacking a coach is one thing when it's your brother it would would have been a extraordinarily difficult horrible feeling yeah um but you know there there was obviously a time there with Dave where it was very sensitive um but we we let it settle and then both myself and deom pay come down and had a um both myself and doom pay come down and had a um a beer with David and have an afternoon with him and um he gave us some great insight into the club The Players um you've been coaching for some years now um uh do you feel you yourself have developed SL matured as a coach and if so in what ways definitely matured um and if you haven't if you don't keep learning you know you can't keep coaching and I try and continue to keep learning and I think uh the players help you grow and I think what's helped me grow is um my children have grown up from young young boys and girls to uh mature adults and seeing how much um being involved in their journey of maturity and growing up has given me a real insight into how these young men are growing up how much uh like my both my boys play football how much it hurts when they don't get what they want and how much joy there is when they do and they both have their ups and downs and I I feel their emotion and such I do with these players here M MH um so answer I think a lot of you know growing with my children has helped me grow and mature as a coach and and if anything I think probably gone a bit a bit softer than when my children were younger and I was a uh probably a little bit more harder than I uh you would be now well the generations CH today too and that's what helped me understand with my kids growing up the generation has changed um social media wasn't around when I was a a bit harder um these players have a lot more pressure on them from social media media um there a lot more scrutiny so from a care Factor I'm you know I take that very much on board in regards to the the welfare of the player outside the the training or playing field we know almost the sort of the nature of the environments of coaching in Sydney and coaching in cra um what is it about coaching in cambera you know that that that is particularly special and why you you know yourself wanted to stay on when I was at the roosters there was very strong leadership very strong um and still is and they're a consistent performing Club money helps but that's beside the point money helps it does um I was involved in in reels at 12 other the clubs and there was a lot of change above me in regards to Chairman Sports um there was too much in um it was just too unstable yeah and you could have never have any you could never have any consistency but at crenella I thought I there was some of my best coaching where we got to a preliminary final um with a very much an under probably underwhelming team in regards to what we're playing against the um the club here at CRA there's honesty and there's trust and you know I've been friends with Dawn for most of my life and people would think that would make it a lot easier to have your boss as one of your friends let me tell you it doesn't you don't want to let him down MH um there's very honest conversations and they're a lot easier because you know there's trust there but the the the fact with with with the leaders I've had at this club um above me my my leaders and bosses um there are people there that I can go to and talk to and you know you're going to get stabbed in the front you're not going to get stabbed in the back can't say that about a few clubs and that's why you don't get that's why a lot of clubs are not consistent in performing it starts at the top in the coaching years at the Raiders one would have to say that the year 2019 stands out uh a because it was a grand final but B because it was a grand final that was so desperately close um as you look back on that game um uh how do you place it now did you feel that the better side um uh did not win no no I I wouldn't say that it's unfair to The Roosters M um it was a very unique Style a game in regards to the um the couple of incidences in the game then we had our chance to win it still um there was there's no doubt about that um but I did I did feel uh I did feel very um sorry for U for a ref yeah it was you know it was a very difficult period situation I was quite critical in the media amongst and and I wasn't the only one but I haven't been more recently for obvious reasons you know he's it was it was tough but it it actually goes to the human side does it not you know in the same ways when people dump on players but the referees it's yeah it's probably one of the greatest moments of um you know so far of of being a coach here but it's also been my biggest disappointment because we're good enough to win that game um but there was there was periods of that play where we could have still won that game and we we didn't but look it was um you know I don't hang my hat on it we've just we've just made a grand F I've said I wanted to I want to win a grand f with this club I I came here and said I want to make this club a very very consistent competitive football team and I reckon we are so we got to you know you want to take it to the next level you want to be looking to make the top four every year um and we we we have our work cut out here uh it's where a lot of other clubs do get a um an advantage we don't get an advantage here in camba has has it changed as has the um uh situation changed in terms of of of of the whole issue of attracting players have you know you alluded only a few minutes ago to social media the pressures on the younger players how would you compare trying to recruit players who do have never lived in camber and perhaps not even in a country town now to say six and eight years ago well the only real player that we've ever recruited here that was was he already a rep player was Mal we've never I don't think we've recruited a rep player here um of any great note right we've developed them all and we're a development club now everybody blames Cambra the environment the Raiders when we don't get the recruit we're chasing but it gets into the media today who you're chasing but if you have a look at the Players I've chased and we missed out on they're all been top tier players and if you have a look at the number of high-profile players I've chased and we missed out on that have won Grand finals you know we're on the right track I I won't go and recruit a name I won't go I won't go and recruit a player as some clubs do just for the sake of he's got to win he's got to kill because I know if I I don't feel as as though he's the right fit for this club and his talent's not there that'll cost you your job well you've talked a lot and perhaps it can be the close to the last question um when you are recruiting a player uh now and indeed in the past and you've commented on this before and that is that that as much as anything you are to the character of the individual involved can you comment on that yeah there's a number of things I look at obviously talent and that that's very important um does he want to keep improving does he is he competitive kid does he want to win and is he a good BL now sometimes sometimes you get one or two of those points wrong not a lot but the important part about that is they got to have talent they've got to be competitive they' want to win I I I couldn't coach a player that isn't competitive and doesn't want to win U when I say doesn't want to win he's just happy getting his pay at becoming a training and that's not the type of football that we want at this club most importantly though got to have all those ingredients and you got to be a good person last question do you do you look back with pride on and there was a certain luck involved of let's start with birth but look back with pride at the role you've been able to play in not only of course the the the the the establishment of this club but the establishment of the club in the context of the region and and and most specifically um as being that the Raiders are now a cultural component of the national capital do you take pride in the role that you've played there and continue to play I'm I'm privileged that the club's given me that opportunity to be the coach to their team that I can actually have a role in the community um you know that's then I set a responsibility of doing the right thing and for example my Foundation uh Rugby League The Raid has given me a voice to help a lot of other people to create Autism Awareness uh to help a lot of other families in need and through our journey um as a family with Kaye and and I with themma and the boys been able to help a lot of other people in regards to what's worked for us and that's what we do as a foundation the the club and rugby league has given me that ability to um uh to be proud and that's a great note to finish on Ricky Stewart thank you very much David chamber Raiders respect and honor the traditional custodians of the land and pay our respects to their Elders pass present and future we acknowledge the stories traditions and living cultures of Aboriginal and torist straight Islander peoples on the land we meet GA and [Music] play this project was supported with funding made available by the ACT government under the 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