'Rebel Ridge' Is A Must-Watch | Director Jeremy Saulnier Interview

Intro I say goodbye to him on set but man I do love that guy um I would always consider anything that brings me and Aaron Pierre together is is certainly uh not off the [Music] table hello blunders and welcome welcome to the sweetly titled episode 320 of real blend a podcast that refuses to say Kevin McCarthy's name three times h's not here on this week's show we're reviewing Beetlejuice Beetlejuice and director Jeremy do this for me again Gabe Jeremy son Jeremy son is going to join us to discuss his incredible film that's going to be available on Netflix Rebel Ridge my name is Shan O Connell the managing editor of Cinema Blend co-host of the RO blend podcast Uh Kevin mccarthur refuses to join us anymore because we didn't name every Christopher Nolan film an s unfortunately so yeah but last week thank God I have Gabe and Jake with me Gabe Kovach and Jake Hamilton uh so for people who don't know I'm referring to the Christopher Nolan tier list which your guys comments for the tier list was incredible I loved reading all of the stuff underneath the YouTube channel uh several people highly anticipating the episode and uh for years it's been years it was a fun one it was definitely has it been at least since like tenant that we' been talking about it wa I feel like the moment that we did our very first tier list the conversation of one of you guys going to do because here's here's the interesting thing when doing a tier list for a director it's got to be someone who respectfully hasn't directed that many things like if we're going to do Spielberg I'm going to have to do some homework like I'm going to have to go back and like rewatch always I'll put it this way when we did the MCU tier lists tier list we did across like three episodes CU there was so many movies yeah so like you know Quinton we can do uh you know Nolan we could do I think vure we could probably do did we do Kevin Smith we did Kevin Smith I don't think we did Kevin Smith no I don't think it I think we talked about it at one point um I think we could do Fincher sure definitely do Fincher could do um see I I I think we could get ambitious and do like a Spielberg or a scorsi but we just have to break it up ac across multiple episodes we have to do break it down by decade yeah like 80s spelberg 90s SP and give ourselves time to watch the stuff yeah and also like I don't know about you guys but um whenever yeah whenever I love a good excuse to go back and do like what I call homework you know I love if I know that I'm going to be interviewing a great director it excites me to go yeah I know I got I got uh scori last year and I went back and just did a deep deep dive on as many scor sayi movies as I could and it was great you know and not not that we should need an excuse but when you can tie it to oh I have an interview coming up so it's kind of like homework um you know it whenever you have sort of that that assignment it feels uh it feels fun and I would love to have that kind of reason to to to do that uh you also did a deep dive into Kevin Cosner which is why you were so excited for Horizon part one I was man I am any day now chapter 2's coming out baby did didn't chapter 2 play at Venice Venice Film Festival they play Venice you didn't buy a ticket you didn't go it'll be on Max in like 18 minutes didn't fight you on his jet he sold the jet for parts three and four very possible Who Sold off more money to make their movie Copo or Cosner oh here's the thing in the grand scheme of 2024 stories Horizon's way ahead of megalopolis in terms of Buzz and and uh try first time you're hearing the name of that movie Down Below which is coming out in a couple of weeks far as I I think it's like end of September so if anyone from Lionsgate is listening we'd love to have Copa on the show Fran Francis would be a great guest did you ever watch the offer uh no I did not oh I loved the offer was that good loved the offer it was it was great man as as someone who is super into sort of Pop Culture history and and I love The Godfather and and who played Copa in that D I forget his name Dan gabes looking him up he's he's a great actor and he was fantastic in it as was the actor who played Pacino who' Miles Teller play oh Dan fogler Dan fogler played for Copa it's great it's it was it was fantastic and it's just I mean is it is it a little bit of a Layman's version of like how the business Works sure but it still was fascinating and I feel like I learned some stuff you know right now you and I are uh right now doing deep dives into the history of Saturday Night Live obviously because of of um Saturday night coming out but it's it's a very similar sort of thing interesting all right I'll give it a shot um if you're watching us on YouTube Hello thank you very much for joining us go down hit subscribe turn on notifications share the show with a friend we are at youtube.com back/ real blend podcast and all the different places you get your audio podcast needs met if you want a real blend premium we'll get you an adree version of the show blend premium a newsletter from me um and uh and that's it just those two things but still that's worth it's worth signing up for real BL premium uh check the description for information on where you can sign up okay uh we have been fans of Jeremy son since Green Room uh and Blue Ruin Blue Ruin Blue Ruin a lot and then he had um one other uh had a third movie that came out after green room that I liked also Green Room was on my uh blanking top 10 list the year it came out green room had Patrick Stewart and Anton yelin in it um you think can hold the dark yes that's the one I'm trying to think of yes also a really great film so he's been batting a thousand I was excited to see Rebel Ridge because of this because of his involvement in it um it stars Don Johnson and Aaron Pierre and uh absolutely worth your time I will review it on the other side of this um but in the meantime we're to have um Jeremy son on the show talking about his new film Rebel Ridge this is our interview with him on behalf of that film here on the rbl podcast uh am now only going to refer to Jeremy Saulnier Interview a bad situation from this point forward as a real Soup Sandwich I think that's it's my new favorite phrase that has been coined I love it so I was reading that um you were really interested in the concept of the uh civil asset forfeit and and in a sort of chicken or the egg concept and I legitimately was was curious about this which character did you have first did you have Terry Richmond or did you have Chief Sandy burn um oh I would say it was mostly the premise it was the the act of being wronged the Injustice of the Civil assd forfeiture was kind of the um the spark as far as how I set it up so it's yeah protagonist first okay knowing there would be law enforcement involved and how that how that took shape um but he was Terry Richman and he's he's sort of my first ever highly competent protagonist that was a lot of fun to explore yeah uh I'm curious how much he changed over the course of write writing and rewriting him how much did you add to him and did you take anything away so that he always felt more realistic and grounded well you know I'm not exceptionally smart so it was a challenge to someone that competent didn't change much I really let the narrative sort of find its own path I do a lot of research I definitely put pressure on my protagonist and that sort of generates its own story often like I I'll set up okay this is this is a landscape these are the institutions this is the sort of that corrupt or or sort of it's legal but it's an an unjust practice of yeah seing property or money um and weirdly totally legal uh through some loopholes so just like when I sort of figured that out it segwayed into okay the these sort of underfunded mun courts that are out there in the middle of America without Indigent defense without that constitutional right to defense um that are just there and totally um off the radar I had no idea the level of it's not all like you know nefarious corruption with intent sure often a matter of small towns having a hard time can't generate revenue from tax base and it gets convoluted so but I I really am interested in that but the challenge was like to to let me have my way with exploring all these situations and you know administrative or bureaucratic uh sort of um pressures that are put on our protagonists but also give people a good oldfashioned American action movie hey I I don't know okay so I'm the I'm the son of a police officer yeah and so when we got to the point where where Don Johnson's kind of explaining what he's up against there's a small part of me that was like all right man I a little bit feel bad for this guy I a little bit feel bad for the situation that he's in you know like there's someone above him with his thumb on him too absolutely and I think that's you know when people get past the trailer which is like a really fun kind of whoop ass type situation going on there yeah and get into the the the layers and details that this film offers they will see that it's not that simple and hopefully it's that propulsive and that sort of cathartic to sort of survive this journey as an audience member but everybody there is a human whether you're rooting for them or not every character is given a chance to speak um and Don Johnson's character Chief Sandy burn is under a lot of pressure too and again I just wanted to make sure that by humanizing people I not only add perspective but I I think increase that static charge between the the protagonist and the antagonist um because real humans create real drama and that's what I'm going for um Jeremy I've been lucky enough to watch this movie three times what yeah I I just I mean the next night after I watched it the first time I just watched it again straight through but then the third time I'll admit to you I skipped right through to the confrontations every confrontation between Aaron and the police officers um and there's a few of them sprinkled through uh but the dialogue in them is so meticulous in how the balance of power kind of shifts with almost each new sentence yeah and I'm curious if you can coach that kind of tension on the set is it something you find later in the edit like what's the process to almost ramp up those dialogue scenes oh yeah I mean it's a pleasure to write them uh I take a lot of time and care to make sure it's not and there is sort of a battle of wits which is fun to sort of play Both Sides yeah not just lean towards the guy that I'm rooting for um but when we explore that with the actors on set it takes on a whole new life which is great yeah and there's a specific moment in the film where Aaron Pierre as Terry Richmond goes up for his first full-on confrontation with Chief Sandy burn played by Don Johnson and that's when the filmmaker sort of drops away my intentions as a filmmaker my my my shots you know my aesthetic I just put that away and let the actors do everything so that whole it's about a seven page or about a five minute dialogue exchange one shot one lens per actor so we did about between five or eight takes on either side but to to your point we created Live Theater we just we weren't doing a lot of coverage now when Aaron steps in that Medium becomes a real nice closeup intensities there but it's built into the blocking so as an editor I'm sitting there I'm not worrying about which camera angle we got this performance on it's all just one shot per side and I can just pick and choose let the actor shine and keep it simple and that was like one of my favorite moments of of the shoot and as it's realized in the movie A God that scene everything hangs on that scene and the movie pivots completely a different direction now are you the type of director who you know you have it you're done or do you like to shoot multiple takes just to make sure you get stuff for later so my I my if I have a rule it's I need at least two good ones okay I need a choice because in the edit room you do sometimes say oh you know tonally I need something different this is my favorite take on set but when you start to ju tost things and and use montage and and put you know one take against another the the the the compatibility of shots comes into question so I was very sure to always get two so I mean if you're in the edit room you have a tough decision that's a good thing uh but you also don't want to burn everybody out uh technically this this film was very challenging I mean if the Techno crane was off two inches from Terry's eyeline as he charges towards the camera with a shotgun right it work it had to be not in the camera but just off center so we' burn 12 takes on someone walking right but sometimes we just let it go and if we get it in one we're out of there now is there stuff that you learned on Green Room that made this a little bit more seamless or is every every project kind of a learning curve because of its new new challenges oh it's it's always the same thing but it always has up being some brand new you know film making is is insane that way where um every the challenges are unique to each film um but a lot of the Dynamics carry over so I was just make I I had to really be disciplined about um holding the line protecting the Integrity of material when I could control things and then when I couldn't control things if the if the wind you know if we have like you know everything lined up the actors there the props looking great the py Technics they fire everything's in sync crew's excited and then all a sudden the wind blows a different way and all your background smoke or foreground smoke just and then you just lose the atmosphere um you have to go again you know everyone on set can be doing their job perfectly and in Louisiana in the summer still not fully in your control yeah you're like can I be back in LA on a set somewhere so so when it's out of my hands I'm at I just let things happen and I and I dig in and I I definitely will not leave a set or a set up until I get what I need all right I have to ask you about the line it's included in the trailer it gives me goosebumps when it happens which is Terry on the phone he's about to let uh the chief off the hook and he goes but then I was like nah did you write it that way uh uh I will take full credit for the line okay but I will give Aaron Pierre credit for the assist in that when he flips that phone like a like a like a finger roll whoop you know that adds that amazing punctuation and that sold and I that wasn't me that was him and I remember you know finding that take in post like you know there is no other version of this scene right right it it was very fun you know it's a bit of a spoiler so I had resist that filmmaker urge to keep everything but that line as cut in the trailer too was just it was so perfect um I had to let it go and I'm glad I did because that line went like completely viral um oh yeah it's I don't think it's a spoiler in that we we kind of know what Aaron's gonna do where it's going yeah we do um you know I can't imagine anyone but Aaron in this role but was it originally John boa is that what I read and what was yeah it's somebody before him like the casting process is we keep that sort of Under Wraps as far as like um you know you go through offers it's sort of I'm up becoming filmmaker I think I've certain reached a certain level now but um schedules this and that agents you know it's complicated um and and that last iteration you know wasn't meant to be and just out of respect for you know everyone involved you know we just had to move on and I think all parties would agree it was the best interest of ourselves in the movie and finding Aaron Pierre was just Revelation I me he was just uh and it's not just me like you know sort of retroactively you know um making things right it was the second I got on a zoom with Aaron Pierre I knew that he was Terry Richmond and he was the only version of the film he would he would have to helm the movie um and and that was was the only version I could ever see being fully realized and I was so actually grateful of whatever headwinds that we faced um or turns that you we took along the long road to make rebel Ridge but yeah I mean Aaron Pierre brought me such Comfort the first day on set I was witnessed to you know the ongoing Journey a stop along the path to him being some huge movie star and I hope he remembers me he's gonna be Mufasa I mean but he's also Terry Richmond yeah absolutely yes and uh oh what was his rap name in uh in old he had a great rap name I forget what it was something Mercedes or something like that midsize sedan midsize sedan now he's full on freight train okay yes he is 100% all right so we're the same age I can't not see a film like this and and not think that you have some relationship with First Blood do you remember seeing First Blood do you remember the impact that it had on you and and the influence that it had on you as a as a young movie Watcher I do I I remember at the time the critics were tearing it apart for having so few words okay um they counted the words that John Rambo says um but I the premise came organically as far as the Civil asset forfeiture and the sort of every man who's actually you know more of a Clint Eastwood man with no name as far as what I was I was doing a guy who rides into town on a horse but this case it's it's a bicycle um but as soon as I was like oh so this is going to be one guy versus a Small Town police force then yeah of course it's first blood and I would make sure you know with that awareness I would either you know I want to carve my own path this is its own story but uh First Blood certainly affected me as far as the the texture uh the the the craft of the film if you go go back and watch it now it's very elegantly shot the the anamor the anamorphic cinematography uh the locations are huge in that just like that sort of North Northwest Pacific Forest um the fog the Lush Greenery um and the action choreography it's it's it's beautiful it's simple it's it's very well laid out so yeah definitely became a huge influence as soon as I knew you know where I was headed with Rebel Ridge well I don't doubt that people are gonna talk about Don Johnson's performance the way that they do Brian Den you know it's it's different it's a completely different shade you know but it but it lends that sort of meanness toughness you know but but like an obstacle to overcome yeah and also yeah a relatability and um it it there had to be some level of mutual respect even though it disintegrates of course um but yeah when Aaron and Don face off you know they're not just complaining there to each other or or arguing there's some jousting verbally you know and I think it's fun to see that you mentioned it before when the the weight shifts you know I I even had a passage in the in the script where it's like you know I didn't know how tall Aaron Pier was going to be but you know when when Terry Richmond says that that line to the chief I said Terry is the taller man now like it's just who here we go seesaw anyways but but Don is amazing and and he was very kind to come aboard this movie and we had a lot of fun we played uh I was really struck by his performance in the Watchman M uh you know he he that scene around the dinner table I was shooting a spot a commercial in Mexico City I was just I I got like a a download of that episode and I was like oh he's our guy and so I I fought hard and I went I flew back to to California and I met with him and we just we knew because he has these choices but but I think we really had a great talk and knew we were telling the same story so he come on board and and it was just it was so cool because I I you know Vice come on um that it I said it like you know many times but that show is known for its sort of sort of Pop Culture iconography and turquoise and tester roas and [ __ ] but um the gravity and the chops that that Don Johnson and in the entire cast of Mii Vice displayed was uh what impressed me as a kid you know my first unhappy ending I looked up to my dad like how come the drug dealers got away yeah and so that that was some that was like serious [ __ ] and and I I wanted to bring that to this role definitely some fun playful lines back and forth but ultimately you know Don knew that I wanted to be very grounded very human and sometimes just deadly serious is it tough to give notes to someone like that when you idolize not idolize him but like he's a pro he knows and he'll give you range and he all because you know the way I make films like he always knew to give me one super quiet you know near reptilian delivery and it's fun to be proven wrong in the edit so and I often want quiet subtle quiet subtle well you got to let actors do their thing that's what they're they're for you know they know better than you sometimes you keep them on the rails as far as story and beats and what you know the exact um dialogue means in this context but you got to step back and and let them do their thing and then in the edit the options I was given was just like you know a dream come true so obviously I want you to keep telling Terry stories is that something that you want to do are you thinking about the next situation to drop Terry into or have you said goodbye to him oh I mean I said goodbye to him on set but man I do love that guy um I would always consider anything that that brings me and Aaron Pierre together is is certainly not off the table Goa thank you so much Jeremy I really appreciate your time yeah man have a great day thank you take care ‘Rebel Ridge’ Review we want to thank our good friends at Netflix for getting Jeremy on the show I want to review Rebel Ridge for you guys I'm going to keep it spoiler free uh and I'm basically going to make the comparison as you heard in the conversation with Jeremy as well too I had to ask him what influence uh First Blood had on him because this is essentially the story of a guy who comes into a small town Aaron Pierre's character rides his bike into a small town um with a with some bail money CU he has to bail his cousin out of prison uh there's a reason he has to bail his brother out of or his cousin out of prison before he gets moved from the holding cell to the to the big prison I'll let you guys discover what's going on uh and he essentially gets stopped by the cops and it's small town I think it's Alabama uh yeah smalltown Alabama cops unsus harping on this guy for for no reason whatsoever probably racial but they don't even doesn't even really make that clear um it's just them flexing their muscle and then not realizing that he is a trained soldier uh and they start messing with the wrong guy and if you watch the trailer there's an amazing line read that I had to ask Jeremy about too with giving iron Pierre uh the time he does it but he is having a phone conversation with Don Johnson's character where they finally get to the point where Don Jonathan's like all right I made a mistake I'm going to leave this guy alone and uh Aaron Pierre's character is like I kind of thought that I would just walk away but then I thought nah and he essentially takes like a a a wagees war a oneman war against the the rural uh sounds very first Blood oh it's yes it is first Blood I'm trying to think of another like good example of what it is um and he and the way that the Jeremy talks about a little bit in the interview there's a there's a motive that's driving the plot forward there's there's something going on in the town and the that's the angle that kind of hooked uh Jeremy son as he wrote this he wrote it and directed it and I I it's it's more elevated than what you got from First Blood First Blood was really just a Wanderer you know who happened to be a Vietnam vet who wanted to get a meal in town and ran into a you know belligerent Brian Den character essentially there's more to this story um and I appreciated that there was another layer beneath the you know idiot cops who just want to bully bully a guy who's trying to come through town there's something to do with the cousin there's something to do with Don Johnson's character the the chief of police and there's something to do with um I is it an Sophia Rob I believe is the name of the actress um she was a kid actor for a long time and now she's playing a an attorney in the town who kind of helps Aaron Pierre's character out Aaron Pierre is a force like that dude's gonna be I was gonna ask because he was he was um he was recast it was originally John boa who had to leave like mid- production a few years ago I I sort of blatantly asked Jeremy about that too like losing Boa at the time half to had filmed a couple of days with boa and then something happened where boa had to leave and they chalked it up as like a scheduling conflict I think they said it was like family reasons I think is what was reported some sort of personal personal thing but was Pierre do you know how much time he had to prep or how long they paused or not long no not long at all and maybe he was in consideration for the role also too probably I would think yeah yeah I think he was in the mix um but I did this I did the interview virtually and I so I didn't get a chance to meet him but I've been told that Aaron Pierre is about 65 oh wow um and it's just like when you see him in the movie he's like a behemoth like he could be Reacher if he wanted to play Reacher in an adaptation of those movies so so he's great in this someone else also God I just read this tweet today and I can't think of who was it was another director who was like give me any movie where there's a guy who's um cunning like a character is cunning who's who's in a situation their back is against the wall they have to think their way out of it and I too love stories like that like where it's the problem with that is your smartest character is only as smart as your writer so you have to have a great writer I will say that this script is incredibly smart because there's a bunch of opportunities where it's like oh this probably should have gone South like the the script should have fallen apart at this point and it isn't there's an answer for almost everything that sort of come through it so highly highly recommend Rebel rich I'm not saying that is going to be like a movie that changes your life but if you want to sit down for just a genre exercise of yeah dude coming into town with a mission gets diss I also love Don Johnson Don Johnson is perfect in this role perfect I have another random a Pierre question because he's playing Mufasa yes it reminds me that makes me think of like a sort of bravado presence how do you feel seeing him in in this I assume he has some sort of presence bravado in his performance oh my God his performance well so there's this is the and I I I like I didn't want to give too much of it away but what I will say this what I as soon as I finished Rebel Ridge the next night I went back and rewatched it but I skipped to the my favorite scenes in it and my favorite scenes were were dialogue scenes they were they were whenever Aaron Pierre's character was was interacting with the cops cuz there's a there's like maybe five or six different times where he's interacting with the cops and it's always what he's trying to to do to get out of whatever situation he's in because very early on it's like I didn't do anything what's the problem here then it's very much like I'm within my rights what are you guys trying to do and then there's a great confrontation with him and Don Johnson and but he's always protecting his reality which is that he's a trained military guy cuz he's like you don't need to know that I don't have to tell you that and you don't need to know that at this stage in the game but then there's a confrontation where they do need to know that and he turns the tables on Don Johnson it's one of the best scenes in the movie and so when you talk about like him being mu I mean his voice is incredible he's super intimidating physically and so yeah when I went through and read that he's going to be Mufasa I was like oh yeah nailed nailed so uh yeah Rebel Ridge highly recommend um and if you haven't seen Jeremy son's other films especially Blue Ruin I know that that one kind of played the festival circuit and and got some attention but go check that one out too it's a great Vengeance story and then of course Green Room is fantastic as well too so uh that's a big recommend for me ‘Beetlejuice Beetlejuice’ Review Jake is the one on the show who got a chance to see Beetle Geist Beetle Geist uh a sequel 40 years in the making almost almost 36 goodness um and it was worth every minute of the wait huh okay listen um I I I'll start out by saying I love the original Beetle juu it's it's probably top five Burton for me it's a 10 out of 10 movie I watch it at least once a year um it's just it's y easy easy easy beet juice once a year at least once a year it's a quick fun 90minut watch I loved as a kid and it's always it's always on one of the streaming services I own it um it's it's just super I love it very much um I don't love the sequel I do not love Beetle Juice Beetle Juice it it really feels like Tim Burton looked at his original film and said well if a little is good more must be better and that is so very rarely the case um more of that character of just everything you know um the original film has such a really nice balance between the real world and the wild Tim Burton dark Fantastical element and and also very very similar to like a hanni elor situation Beetle Juice himself is really only in the movie like 15 minutes he's not in the movie that much and well his name in twice so he's got to be exactly um Beetle Juice shows up very quickly in in this new Sequel and never leaves and is in it throughout um a majority of the movie takes place in uh not the real world but the sort of uh underworld dark the afterlife sort of the the dark sort of Fantastical elements and while there are a lot of really great creative ideas there I've seen these interviews with Tim Burton where he's talked about like how he felt rejuvenated again and it really felt like he just had all these W it really does feel like he must have been rejuvenated and was just throwing all these ideas but it's just it's just too much it's just too much there were so many moments I was like oh that's clever but like it I never had anything for any of these wild fantastic ideas to be Tethered to one of the reasons the first Beetle Juice works is that you have this balance between even though their ghost sort of the the reality of Alec Baldwin and Gena Davis yeah sort of you know they were they were just this normal couple who who had an an anchor and and this it's you have all these wild and wacky characters a lot of them are sort of Dead characters the the reason that Bel his back was not inherently interesting to me it involves his wife um you know Katherine O'Hara you know has has moments you know they they all kind of have moments where I sort of go oh that was clever but is his wife Monica beluchi yes yes okay and it it just it just didn't work for me I like how um Winona she's fine but you got to keep in mind that the difference you know she the the character she play she's not playing the same character you know because the that was 36 years ago you know the character that she played in Beetlejuice is a teenager and so she's inherently it's not like oh my God we get to see that character again because she's so wildly I mean the closest we get to her character from the first one is getting Jenna Ortega kind of back you know kind of the the the smart aliy you know is her daughter her daughter correct okay got um they do uh I will give them credit for how they handle um actor uh Jeffrey who was the the father in uh jeffre Jeffrey Jones and if you uh know about Jeffrey Jones um say his scandalous yes there's a reason why he's not in this movie yeah but here's what I can tell you how they handle him not being in this movie is incredibly clever okay and it's it's handled very very well um like I said you know I don't I don't want to to rag on the movie cuz there are some really great ideas there and and it is fun to see Burton like like firing firing on all cylinders again but the movie it's just too much uh it's it's too much excess and it didn't there's not enough uh there's not enough meat and potatoes to make the the dessert balance out does it avoid this is what I'm curious about with with these sort of sequels that are coming years and years later does it avoid being like here are all the beats that you remember kind of it's wildly different it's wildly different from yes but it you know I feel like he didn't I'm not saying he needed to rehash the first movie but he at least needed to study why the first movie worked and you know I I think you know you not to interrupt you but I I had just read a a long profile um in the New York Times I want to say where Burton is candidly admitting like he still doesn't he still doesn't understand why the first movie worked and he and he also said maybe it was that interview or a different one that he didn't even go back and rewatch the first one to get ready for it like he's confused why it was a hit which I I think I I I don't know I almost it's a very specific thing but not going back and rewatching it I almost respect more because he made it and so I want to see him 40 years later making the be versus you know if someone was picking up the mantle you'd want them to study it and and capture it but him doing himself but I mean the most the kind of the most sort of uh condensed microcosm example of why this movie doesn't work and the misunderstanding of why the first one worked in the first place is the fact that they just use Beetlejuice too much that is that is a charactera good is he entertaining I mean he's he's yeah but it's I mean but he was good in in just 15 minutes of the first one that's all like I'm a big believer of like sometimes a character can be great but a little bit can go a long way so I got a question because like the the the box office projections for this are higher than I thought they would be and and one of the takes on that is that people who grew up with this one who are now parents are going to want to bring their kids to this one is it is there an element that this is a kids movie at all I mean it I I watch the original Beetle Juice as a kid fit the same as it the same I me here's what I'll tell you it's a little it's it has a hell of a lot more I don't want to it's PG-13 so I don't want to use the word Gore yeah but there's a lot more like death and grossness to it okay um then there is 60 to 80 million oh I saw I saw 110 you see 110 110 is long and then 145 uh worldwide damn um I I don't you know often times my argument would be well did you let your kids see the first one if so let them see this one I will say this one's a little bit uh a little bit on the Wilder side interesting um there are some elements there that I could see parents being like well I don't want their like i' let my kid watch the first one but I'm not okay with them seeing X Y and Z in this one um but it's it's fine it's all it's it's all practical effects which I have to applaud it's it's all very impressive you know stop motion yeah the sand worms look you know it's there there's there's something um there there's something that kind of warmed the cockles of my heart seeing like all the the stop motion effects like that made me that made me very happy so I want to ask you something that's spoilery so I'm going to throw this tag up now and we're going to go to a break an ad break afterwards is that right Gabe throw to an ad after this all right so this is a spoiler question if you guys want to skip forward skip forward um but the minute that they called this Beetlejuice Beetle juu I assumed they're setting up a third that would be called Beetlejuice Beetlejuice beetlejuice right is there an obvious setup for a third I won't say it's obvious but it's not I found I found the first movie to be very close-ended yeah yeah this one is left open a little bit more if anything you're almost left going wait like wait I'm sorry what what's happened what happened exactly do you think um do you think that this would be the sort of thing that Warner Brothers makes this they leave it open and then someone not Tim Burton to make I I would say no because Keaton wouldn't come back and do a Batman without Tim Burton so I can't imagine he would come back and do a Beetlejuice without Tim Burton I mean but if it's making enough money maybe you know to the point that that I think you were saying like I this is a movie that is a holiday staple like every there so many people know most people know are like you Jake that it's a every year I watch this every year I watch A Nightmare Before Christmas it's that type of holiday um's in his 70s yeah I'll never watch this one again though I'll never watch it again interesting for for which is I will say I feel like my my review is like a mixed bag like it it's whatever it's fine but to go from were you hoping to come out of this with like now I have a new double feature every year of watching back like a companion piece like like what I never expected to happen and we got out of the shining in doctor sleep oh sure yeah is sort of what because now I now I I always say you can't watch you can't watch The Shining without watching drct sleep may maybe he should have secretly made this a sequel to The Shining and yeah would have worked it so it's not Maverick because Maverick was another SE sequel that waited a really long time yeah yeah yeah and and was great yeah this one uh this ain't this ain't Maverick this ain't Beetle Juice Maverick I mean I'd rather watch Maverick than Top Gun to be honest h oh yeah hell yeah you know absolutely it's kind of It kind of I'm gonna be honest with you I'd rather watch Maverick than most movies that's true why don't we just do a Maverick podcast should do a Maverick tier list wasting our time here all right we'll be back on the other side uh of this ad break and we got a little IMDB Game lined up that is very Beetle IMDb Game: ‘Beetlejuice’ Edition Centric all right we are back and I have an IMDb game set set up for these boys if you're if you're joining us for the first time you've never heard of this game um it's pretty simple I have the IMDb pages of uh several filmmakers actors alike um and these two gentlemen are going to have to try to guess what IMDb has listed as their four known for projects um and why it's fun is that sometimes they don't make sense often times they don't make sense sometimes it's also fun when they do that's what makes it fun yeah that's it's fun because sometimes it's oh they're publicist has definitely gotten involved and sometimes it's like they don't even care at all the algorithm has gone Rogue I just don't like playing games against Jake because he tends to win it's one V one yeah yeah yeah I recommend listeners at home play along if you can let us know in the comments you won last time he did I think I I think I did on a a buzzer beater yeah he got all four right because I got the wrong I got the wrong girl yeah yes yes son of a [ __ ] all right so we're going to start things off with Tim Burton himself uh gentlemen according to IMDb what are Tim Burton's four known for projects four known for projects um a reminder this isn't just uh it's anything that would be listed on I this is a tough one TV film producing directing writing all of it is included is possible um and this is a tough one because he's kind of a true aour in the sense that kind of everything he's almost everything he's made has made some sort of Splash or impact okay I have my Four B's locked in this is Sean how you looking this is a tough one I have three of my four Sean's trying to think of a fourth movie that Tim Burton [Laughter] made uh yeah that's that's the issue hey think think of the movies of Helena bottom Carter oh you actually just gave me a good one yeah Harry Potter 3 all right I got it um uh [ __ ] um hold on wait no I wrote I wrote one but I was thinking of something different hold on okay wow um oh that's Judes judges is this Le Girl with the Dragon Tattoo it'll make sense when I when I explain it go ahead all right uh Jake you can you can go ahead and start us off what are the four projects IMDb has listed as Tim Burton known for I'm I'm going to go with Beetlejuice Sweeney Todd Edward Scissor Hands and the Corpse Bride okay I did uh Edward Scissor Hands Big Fish Batman Returns and Sweeney Todd okay which one did you change Sleepy Hollow I wrote Sleepy Hollow but I meant Sweeney Todd got it I love Sleepy Hollow happens to the best of us um all right his top four known four projects according to IMDb are Sweeney Todd yeah Edward Scissor Hands yeah Franken weenie ah I knew it was going to be one of his animated ones damn it and Corpse Bride yeah two wow Beetle ju no Batman's no Beetle Juice but again no Batman not even one or two not a single Batman [ __ ] stupid you know I almost put U because I was going to try to get spicy Kevin style I almost put PL of the Apes I would did I wait did I win that you did Jake got the point the way the scoring works is if you win the round you get a point if you get all four correct damn I got close to getting all four two points if you guys tie I just I just don't add the point because it's all the same all right up next we havez Michael Keaton geez Michael Keaton gentlemen to according to IMDb what are the four most known for projects Michael Keaton wow this is impossible this is impossible woo this is terrible I am getting somewhat spicy but geez that's uh okay all right Sean you kick us off what are the four no known four projects for Michael Keaton according to IMDb Birdman Batman Mr Mom and clean and sober do you remember in multiplicity when one of his like uh one of his like clones is like an idiot and they just go to him and he's eating pizza and he just goes I like pizza I don't know all my buddies used to say that when we were kids growing up would get pizza we'd always used to go I like pizza Jake you have the floor I'm going uh Beetle Juice Birdman Spotlight and Batman Returns interesting just edging out Herby fully loaded all right gentlemen the four known four projects were Michael Katon according the IMDb is Spotlight yeah the founder oh oh damn it Birdman yeah and Batman both tie you both tie with two no points awarded Jake still has a lead one to nothing damn I could not between Batman founder the the founder is the one that the founder seems like the outlier yeah that was surpris Spotlight M made it oh really Spotlight is great I love that movie it's terrific but I don't know if I think of him when that's it's more of an ensemble piece it is he he didn't even get an Oscar nomination for for that no no yeah that's such a douchy like quantifier like he didn't even get an nomination but you're right it's such an ensemble piece yeah I think Rachel was the only one to get an Oscar nomination for that for spotlight oh did did Ruffalo maybe Ruffalo did let's see it won two Oscars let's see what we got here it won two Oscar it only won it won best picture and only won one other that's what I'm seeing sorry this is I I actually um I I feel like this is going to anger people I uh that was the same year as the Revenant and I I would have chosen the Revenant over the Revenant did win director um but I would have chosen the Revenant over Spotlight it it won picture and writing it was nominated Ruffalo McAdams good was McCarthy was nominated for director and uh Tom M McArdle McArdle excuse me Tom uh for editing also nominated there's a movie at Venice called September 5th that has to do with um believe it's the what was the Olympic Games where the it was like it was also featured in Munich uh but it's a journalism movie and it's got Peter sarsgard in it as well too and people have been raping I like a Peter sarsgard uh journalism mood you ever see broken glass I've of yeah of course shattered glass shattered glass shatter excuse me shattered glass big fan I saw shattered glass I guess you no I was just wondering hypothetically if you'd seen any broken glass broken glass throw a rock through your freaking window Mano of nothing all right boys up next uh we have Winona Ryder Winona ryer what are the man what are the four known four projects for wiona Rider according to IMDb okay according to IMDb another career that goes that goes way back 70 projects that's all she has iconic TV iconic film all right how are we looking I'm ready I'm ready Sean is ready Jake is ready the boys are locked in yeah Jake you're going first for us I'm going Dracula good call Beetlejuice eventually someone has to have Beetlejuice in their top four so far I'm 0 for two i' I've picked Beetlejuice for all of them so far the irony of we choosing all the Beetlejuice people and no one has Beetlejuice is incredible uh stranger things and Little Women oo spicy Sean you take it away stranger things uh Heathers oh Heathers is that [ __ ] Beetle Geist and Girl Interrupted ooh okay a Sean may have taken it all right wona writers top four got an nomination known four projects according to IMB Alien Resurrection what you're kidding you're kidding come on see I'm looking at it right here I hate this game she played call 1997 I hate clear 1997 alen Resurrection uh we have mermaids come on we have Girl Interrupted hey the kid and we have Little Women hey you guys tied again you guys tied again no stranger things no Heathers W no Beetlejuice no Beetlejuice stop putting Beetlejuice I'm going to I'm going to put Beetlejuice for actors that weren't even in Beetlejuice we have we have we have some left all I'll say is I think imb's algorithm is gone Rogue today okay I I do have a random Beetlejuice question please why do they spell it differently in the movie than the title do they spell it Beetle guys it's like in in like the on his Tombstone and in the sign on the signia it's like b t l gu u i SS e or something yeah it's spelled like Beetle Geist Beetle that's the German way to say it like adal Vice or no okay it's German all right I don't know if that's the actual answer but you said such confidence when I read it Beetle Geist I think it was I think it was quite literally they just wanted it to be phonetically spelled I think I'm trying to find CU I feel like that's a piece of trivia I've heard before um and there might be more of a story behind that I think it's literally like the the phonetic nature of Beetlejuice for the audience um if only if only we could have had Tim Burton on the show to ask him that's true he goes wait it's spelled different yeah I'm sorry what [Laughter] I gotta call the art Department um do now do I now hang on a second you mean for 40 years for 35 years this is the first time hearing of this H all right you each got one so it's still Jake is up one to nothing because you each have tied the last wow two rounds we suck that's all right we got two if you want sound better if you want it to sound better I could say three to two I like I like one zero one more you've gotten you know you've tied at least every round yeah um all right up next we have Katherine oara Katherine what are Katherine oar's nine or nine four known four projects according to IMDb all right it's time to steal from Kev and get spicy spice is nice it's hey D hey Dune 2 came out this year Sean spice is still with us I uh I was just gonna ask you guys what is what is your number one of the year right now I mean spoilers that make change yeah it's it's it's a good it's a good check-in before we get into award season yeah we have we didn't do our mid we didn't do our midyear check-in I don't know honest with you I think it's Civil War is it I think I mean that's top five for me I think I think mine's still Dune I I believe mine's Civil War oh yeah mine still dinge for sure resur or Resurrection um ramulus is up there oh really yeah yeah yeah Rus is awesome I'm gonna be honestly strange darling is in my top five DN I'm excited to watch that for folks for folks at home we some of us have seen it I think maybe all of you seen it we're waiting until Kev gets back but we will be talking about strange darling at some point and perhaps down the road well there'll be more strange darling discussion but we'll leave that you know hashtag if it happens all right Jake you look like you're set I'm ready Sean still thinking this one over uh I I'll I'll write my last one down go ahead I'm ready all right Sean give us the spice what are the top four known for projects for Katherine RAR according to IMDb Home Alone 2 lost in New York oo ni spicy spicy A Mighty Wind good call shits Creek and and then I put best and show last good call all right Jakey a guest movie is probably going to be on there um I'm with shitz Creek Home Alone one The Nightmare Before Christmas and Beetle Juice it's got to work eventually come on according to IMDb her four known for known for projects oh no are Franken weenie God [ __ ] Franken weenie are you kidding me Frank and weenie is on it more than Beetlejuice yeah yeah yeah someone at IMDb loves that uh we have Penelope what Penelope what we have Best in Show hey and we have A Mighty Wind good job man I got nothing I got nothing comes back with a tie no no home alone no shits Creek no Beetlejuice no no Beetle Juice no Beetle Juice Frank and weenie though Frank and weenie all right this could be our tiebreaker we might have we might wrap it up after this one if it's still tied I'll bring us I'll bring us more we will we will finish this tie it is tied one to one okay Sean coming in clutch again this week um what are the four known for projects for Gina Davis according to [Music] IM I am or known for projects how do you guys feel about this feeling confident no I don't know if I can come up with four Gina Davis movies oh you could when you hear them when you hear them you you'll you'll well I'm sure well you know at least one of them I do Jakey how you doing how you feeling you four okay I got a little got a little spicy one of my PS little spice I can only come up with three G Davis movies that's sad May that's all you need maybe that's all you need that's sad I should know more yeah she has some deep pools why do I have a feeling we have the exact same three movies and only have three also well no I got a spicy with my fourth pick but it's probably not going to be on there so it's going to be the exact so we're going to have the same I guess hey if we tie we we'll roll into the next round um Sean I believe you are starting us off you you say you only have three I tell you what if you want I think I start off this one gos uh Beetlejuice yes delman Louise yes A League of Their Own oh [ __ ] that's the and a deeply deeply underrated cancell to soon series filmed right here in Chicago that if you've never seen for the love of God make a point and go watch it because it's better than anything we've gotten from the franchise over the last 40 years the TV series The Exorcist okay Jake one more time give me yours just to be sure I didn't miss one Beetlejuice stowman Louise A League of Their Own and The Exorcist okay leag I thought for sure that was one of your three yeah wait then what's then what's your third movie Beetlejuice thelman Louise the fly yeah that's a good call yeah that's interesting oh jior Davis is four known for it's just Beetle Juice I got three according to IM Frank and weenie or she got a special thanks in Frank and weeny um A League of Their Own yeah Thelma and Louise yes the long kiss good night oh damn it that's another one [ __ ] can I give you what her it's just kind of random but her her credit under long kissy night is uncredited producer like a better one available um and then finally the fly hey so I got two I got we got to go we got to go again we got to go again we run it back with Alec Baldwin my God Baldwin [ __ ] really I thought Gina Davis might be easier the tiebreaker oh wow and Sean to think about it if you had remembered A League of Their Own probably her most known for movie if we're being well I Louise with a certain audience you have this in League of Their Own Wow Own can't cry about it though Sean you know that you remember that part thank you thank you oh [ __ ] so many to choose from well if you'd like me to put a number on it it is 160 credits Jesus 160 did you get one I got one you going spicy I'm going a well maybe not I don't know maybe not all right I got my four all right all right Alec Baldwin's four known four projects according to IMDb Sean right Sean you're you're up this round this is to break the tie a massive one toone tie it should be paying attention to how ridiculous the choices are um and you're going with 30 Rock it's probably too obvious boss baby you ever see that Meme it's like uh this this movie's giving me boss baby it's giving me real boss baby Vibes and go credit to guy who's only seen boss baby uh malice and Glen Gary Glenn Ross okay Jake you're four Beetlejuice [Laughter] Glen Gary Glen Ross Yes 30 Rock and the deaded theed the deped Alec Baldwin's four known four projects according to on beetle juu the shadow are come on beetle juu Glen Gary Glen Ross yeah coffee for closers it's complicated okay I mean that's actually was a pretty big hit mhm sure how about the cooler I did think about the cooler because I think he got an Oscar nomination for that maybe damn it and finally finally The Departed Jake comes in to break the tie damn it damn it two to one two to one is our final score Jake congratulations you guys are tied you guys are baby no boss baby B mayy too that would have been heartbreak that would heart I just love that Sean was defeated by the dep a movie that he told so much affection for uh let me see with the cooler what' you ask he was nominated yes supporting role no 30 Rock cuz he that's because he won like 50 emys for that that's insane that's like he's the reason Steve Carell never won um for uh the office Carl never won for the office he won a gold glob but never for the Emy never the that's well you think you think um his 30 Rock role Jack is more famous than uh coffees for closers than Glen Gary Glenn Ross yeah I do I think Glen Gary Glenn Ross is known by A specific group of people but I don't know if it's the the lines from Glen Gary Glen Ross are among those that people know but they don't even know what they're from kind of like correctly if I'm wrong isn't Pino the only one who got an Oscar nomination out of that cast that might be right yeah I think correct which is crazy because I mean everyone in that cast deserves oh Jack Lemon is Jack Lemon unbelievably good at that all right well so in the meantime while you guys are waiting for Gabe to look that up no Outro Beetle Juice no Beetle ju no had Beetle Juice in their top four well imagine if we said it three times Jake that's true you said it five [ __ ] you said it about 11 times in that game uh let us know in the comments down below underneath this week's episode your favorite Tim Burton character not a movie but a character from one of Tim Burton's movies which one stands out to you the most which one do you love um we'll drop our answers in the comments as well too as we're weighing in we appreciate you guys chiming in down below uh in the meantime we'll be back next week with a brand new episode follow us on social media uh you guys know all the different places where we could find us and until next week we need somebody to shout who could be a new person shouts h i mean we still haven't had Spielberg on I I maintain that this I wish he had a new movie coming yeah yeah says he doesn't have a new movie I love that we're all sitting here thinking about who do we want I mean Ridley would be nice to have back on the show of course F do [Music] [Music] [Music]