TG 1678: Brazil's Supreme Court Justice Bans Twitter (X); Western Media Rejoice

hello and welcome to the gagle but we Challenge and if necessary destroy media narratives I'm George samuy with me today of course is co-founder of the Gaggle Peter LEL so Peter last week um we talked at some length about the case of pav durov um who was arrested about just about a week ago in France and now um is essentially being indicted in France subsequent to his um arrest he has to stay in France um awaiting the outcome of this investigation um and uh basically he's on bail unable to leave the country and we really don't know whether France will pursue criminal charges against him uh or not but he can't leave the country um so that's that's the case of durov and Telegram in the meantime um this assault against free speech and against um uh the uh platforms uh providing for uh free speech is continuing at a nice clip elsewhere um Elon Musk is pro maybe even in more in the crosshairs than um durov because musk has a much greater Global profile than durov has um and we've talked about how musk was threatened just a couple of weeks ago by TI Breton the EU commissioner who warned him that if you violate EU laws with your interview with Donald Trump just that interview that he's going to post on um Twitter or X um you were in violation of EU laws and we're going to hit you 6% of global Revenue that's that's a lot of money for a company like uh Twitter um and of course the British uh have been targeting uh musk but the latest um confrontation with musk has come in Brazil this is part of a long ongoing fight between um Twitter and um this strange Supreme Court Justice in Brazil alesandro moras um who has been threatening uh Twitter for some time and um he basically shut it down that's it Twitter has just simply been shut down in Brazil it is no longer um accessible and moras when he shut it down said that any scumbag any Brazilian scumbag who tries to use VPN to to get onto uh Twitter will be hit with a I think something like an I can't remember the exact number I mean we'll look at it 9,000 EUR a day or $9,000 a day um and and but people are apparently defying him and say yeah I'm still going to use VPN to get onto Twitter and bolsonaro is still President right bolsonaro no exactly the bad guy he was the bad guy everyone whom the bad guy he was the dictator the the dictator so let's just take a look at at at some of the stories and what's also interesting which we can maybe talk about is how the media are um the Western media are responding to um the plight of musk and of course they're responding to it with Glee and uh and uh looking for hey can we can we have more please so here we have musa's ex is banned in Brazil after disinformation row disinformation now disinformation this is this is the allegation that is made about X you know it there is no such thing as disinformation people just throw this around it's a newly invented term and it's just something that you you uh turn around and against somebody's like you know like I know like sexism you know nobody exactly knows what sexism is but you can just use it and then as a weapon against anyone you don't like X formerly Twitter has been banned in Brazil after failing to meet a deadline set by a Supreme Court Judge to name a new legal representative in the country but now very important this this business of the new legal representative um you know because in before musk had named a legal representative whom this judge then immediately threatened to arrest uh and in fact um after she left the country um he seized her bank account so um so understandably musk isn't very keen on naming another legal representative who could just simply be arrested and thrown into prison so Alexandra de moras ordered the immediate and complete suspension of the social media platform until it complies with all court orders and pay existing fines the rout began in April with the judge ordering the suspension of dozens of X accounts for allegedly spreading disinformation so he hasn't you know musk hasn't committed any crime other than he has refused to suspend um accounts on the orders of a judge you know some judge decides you have to suspend these accounts because and why why must I must I suspend them well because they're spreading disinformation um reacting to the decision ex owner Elon Musk said free speech is the Bedrock of democracy and an unelected pseudo judge in Brazil is destroying it for political purposes I bet that went down well yes the judge really appreciates that kind of um comment um pseudo judge justice moras has ordered that ex accounts accused of spreading disinformation many supporters of the former rightwing president uh bson Arrow must be blocked while they are under investigation they must be blocked you have to block accounts they're not allowed they you know they're under investigation so they're not they're not allowed to communicate they're not allowed to say speak while they're under investig not even while they're under they're on trial or anything like that they're under investigation so then they should not be allowed to communicate he said the company's legal Representatives would be held liable if any accounts were reactivated so you must you know you must um appoint a legal representative where's the due process here yeah no there not no due process it's just one judge he's just a ruling ruling From the Bench um X has been threatened with fines for refusing to comply with this order with the company and Mr musk joining critics in Brazil in accusing the judge as being leftwing this is a this is I think I think this is CNN so there's a little more to it than that they're not just saying this judge this judge is a tyrant uh not just that he's leftwing um and then Justice Moray has given companies such as Apple and Google a five-day deadline to remove x uh from its application stores and block its use on IOS and Android systems he added that people's or businesses using means such as vpns to access information to access the platform could be fine so that's £6,700 so it's you know that's a nice chunk of change um but I think it's it's a day I don't think it's just by that it could be F that's I think 6,700 a day so now they're G they're going to start mon monitoring uh monitoring vpns okay good that's right according to the judge's order a ban will be in effect until X names a new legal representative in the country and pays and pays fines for violating Brazilian law in a previous post from one of its official accounts X had it had said it would not comply with the demands so that's it no more no no X in um in Brazil meanwhile the bank accounts of Mr musk's satellite internet firm Starling have been frozen in Brazil following an earlier order by the country's link have to do with anything exactly that's exactly it I mean you're just going up to staring just because it's owned by musk but it has nothing to do with uh Twitter staling um responded with a post on X which said that the order is based on an unfounded determination that Starling should be responsible for the fines levied unconstitutionally against X which is sounds a common sense position Justice moras gained prominence after his decision to restrict social media Platforms in the country gained prominence oh I you know this is prob he's basically been in the business of restricting social media Platforms in the country he's also investigating Mr bolsonaro and his supporters for their roles in an alleged attempted coup on the 8th of January last year then it says X is not the first social media company to come under pressure from authorities in Brazil last year telegram was temporarily banned over its failure to cooperate with requests to block certain profiles and we have a pattern here okay there is a pattern this very very interesting it's a you know meta's messaging service WhatsApp also faced temporary bans in 2015 and 2016 for refusing to comply with police requests for user data and again as you said earlier and where's bolsonaro and all this wasn't I mean none of this has anything to do with bolsonaro he was supposed but one of the things that's really missing here and maybe it will eventually come up I don't know but I mean isn't legal decisions based on existing law I mean what are the laws that exactly that's that's exactly very very interesting what what law judge is interpreting the law right I mean so what are the laws that's right exactly we don't get any of that here that's right that's right but that's that's the point musk is making but here you know you just it doesn't matter you know these are just decisions that this judge makes and there's no legal procedure because you you know the normally you have a legal procedure if you say well this is I think a completely incorrect application of the law then you would go put forward your argument and then and then you have courts would have a hearings on that here he's just basically saying you got to comply with my uh decrees or else we're just going to you know take away your money block access to your I know Western journalism is very lazy they hate doing any kind of work here but I mean this would be an opportunity can you can you show us the PDF the legal decision based on Brazilian law I mean this pretty big deal here okay um Telegram and X are very popular in Brazil okay so I mean this is turning into a human rights issue here when it comes to I I know that you know I think it's only the United States that has the First Amendment about speech but countries have similar laws um not approaching what the first amendment is but I mean all of these countries have speech laws that's right and you have to then exactly show what law are you violating just simply saying well these accounts are spreading disinformation that that that doesn't tell me what law is being violated here I mean just because you don't like these accounts so so I I hope this judge is is uh shutting down or threat threaten the shutdown of most government websites around the world okay that's right um so and then here's a CNN Brazil begins to block acts as Elon musk's Feud with judge deepens notice again it's about musk musk is the is has a feud with musk yeah exactly it's musk so he's it's musk who's being unreasonable and you think you know you're a media Outlet you should be very wary of some judge some crazy judge ruling from the bench and just shutting down uh media Outlets um and then here we have anyone trying to access X in Brazil was blocked on Saturday after the country enforced a court ordered suspension of Elon musk's social media site over the past 24 hours Brazilians including president Lula have been bidding farewell to x with some posting links to their profiles on other social media platforms attempts to access the sites on on a web browser through or through the app on Saturday were met with an error message the blockage comes after Brazil supreme court on Friday ordered the suspension of explination why because musk refused to name a legal representative in the country I bet you Glenn ral's using on a bpn yeah I'm I'm sure I'm absolutely sure yeah and he's saying yeah all right come and get me you know come and you know you know yeah um Brazilian Law requires companies uh operating in the jurisdiction to have legal representation well yeah but you're not supposed to threaten your legal represent you can't threaten your lawyer with imprisonment then you then that kind of Vates having legal representation but X formerly known as Twitter shut down its Brazilian representative office on August 17th after Justice Alexandra the moras threatened to Pro Ute its local Representatives over its reluctance to comply with orders to block users so he orders that you have to block these users I just don't like these users because they're supporters of bolsonaro um and and you saying you know he threatens to prosecute you know tw Twitter Twitter X local Representatives because they don't want to block um these users it further escalates months long Feud over Free Speech farri accounts always get that in the farri accounts and misinformation the Supreme Court previously issued orders to block multiple X accounts as part of Brazil's sweeping investigation into the into the spread of misinformation online and hate speech aimed at undermining the country's democracy notice how this is CNN how they just put these things down never any real questions about out here you know don't you think that there's something a little worrying when governments start start talking in this vague way about misinformation and hate speech and undermining a country's democracy and in the name of all these vagaries they plan to shut down U pe people's accounts and people's websites presumably CNN has a Brazilian account yeah yes well that's right but for forunate they're in good odor and no one's going to um threaten to shut them down and um and then here we have demor warned musk on Wednesday night that X could be blocked in Brazil if he failed to comply with the order to name a representative and established a 24-hour deadline the same representative that could be arrested exactly that's right yeah yeah that's right so I'm I'm kind of reluctant to name a representative because you know he or she is going to be shoved immediately into prison and their bank accounts shut down and their bank accounts Frozen uh he said the platform would remain blocked until it complies musk has criticized de moras accusing him of musling free speech in the country accusing I imagine that's such an outrageous accusation you're musling free speech I I I I I'm I'm protecting speech I'm I'm I'm here to protect Free Speech Brazil Brazilian president Lula said Friday that musk must comply with the country's laws so you know so you can see how how Lula cherishes um uh Freedom any and every citizen from any part of the world who has investments in Brazil is subject to the Brazilian Constitution and Brazilian laws and as you say what laws I I still haven't seen that law that um morah is um applying he also pushed back against some of musk's comments saying he can't go around insulting presidents insulting deputies insulting the Senate insulting the chamber insulting the Supreme Court who does he think he is he's just just a guy expressing his opinion suck it up get used to it he can't go around insulting president why why not where does it say you can't go around insulting why not I love you know talk about mask falling off you know when Lula talks like this uh you can't go around insulting president insulting deputies in insult not you know not attacking them or anything just insulting her I feel insulted you can't go do that if you're in the public eye get used to it you get insulted you're going to get insulted yeah the president added that guy has to accept the rules of this country and if this country made a decision through the Supreme Court he has to comply if it applies to me it applies to him him yeah but that's the whole point I mean who's that who's the law here it sounds like the judge is the law exactly just one judge who just ruling From the Bench he's just simply saying oh I'm I'm applying the law and I'm just basically bringing free speech to an end the feud widened on Friday when the Supreme Court denied an appeal by satellite internet company Starling also owned by musk to unfreeze its Financial accounts the financial accounts of Starling an internet service provider which the tech billionaire also owns through SpaceX were blocked in the country Thursday to ensure payment of fines imposed as part of a legal disputes involving X so he's he he's already hit musle these fines and then he's basically Frozen the account of Starling which of course has nothing to do with um uh with X um again it seems very strange how you can do this I mean these things have to be done through some legal procedure whereby Starling can be held liable um for any fines incurred by this is like this is taking a hostage yes yeah that's right styling is used by more than 250,000 people in Brazil the service which does not require any cable connection is particularly popular in the Amazon rainforest and remote rural Loc locations used by academics tourism operators and public offices in the region as well as Brazil yeah that's called creating a Level Playing Field that's why it's such a remarkable piece of technology right the the weakest of of uh Among Us have access we have equal access just like rich people okay wow you know this is supposed to be a leftwing government okay that's right that I think it's a very good point and that generally is the the key issue involved with the internet Because the Internet is a is a great leveler it's a you know that that's what's important here the attack is here on the internet because it is a leveler it it it allows Ordinary People to have access to information that in the past was only limited to a very small group of people had access now information is available to everyone so natur of course that that that alarms um powerful people everywhere we can't have people having access to information during starling's appeal the company argued that the com that the company is not a part of the case against X and that the order to freeze its accounts violates its basic property rights this is CNN right this is CNN yes where's there you know uh according to expert you know I mean I mean can you can you give us you know someone's legal opinion like yeah this kind of insane okay that's right exactly it's just you know straight across the line this you know this is a um it's not part of the case you know this is outrageous okay can you get some can we get some B meat on these bones here that's right exactly that's exactly right it is absolutely outrageous Friday's ruling on stalling does not immediately impact the company though the company warned in a statement that it prevents stalling from conducting Financial transactions in the country the order is based on an unfounded determination that Starling should be responsible for the fines levied unconstitutionally against X the internet provider said in the statement on X yes people in Brazil didn't hear that right yes late on um Thursday musk said styling service will remain active for free as the company cannot receive payments due to the judicial order who looks good in all this George definitely not Lula um and definitely not moras many remote schools and hospitals de depend on Space X's styling musk wrote on X and then and then here we go the how this Brazilian judge this go this goes back to what happened in April and we talked about that back in April how one Brazilian judge could suspend Elon musk's X and this is again moras threatened to suspend social media Giant X Nationwide if M doesn't uh swiftly comply with one of his orders and then again earlier this month ex removed its legal representative from Brazil on the grounds that the de Mor had threatened her with arrest so yeah I mean you kind of I I have to have a lawyer but the moment you bring a lawyer this judge is just going to have this lawyer immed seized and thrown in prison um on Wednesday night uh de moras gave the platform 24 hours to appoint a new representative or face a shut down until his order is met the moriah's order is based on Brazilian law requiring foreign companies to have legal representation to operate in the country yeah but what if the country doesn't allow that to happen exactly um I I have to say I I've never I've never come across the idea that you can actually threaten the lawyer you know that just you know because essentially you're punishing his client and so you take you take it out on the lawyer this Mafia beh yeah exactly yeah um and um and then he has um lone Brazilian judges shut down meta's WhatsApp the nation's most widely used messaging app several times in 2015 2016 due to the company's refusal to comply with police requests for user data and then in 2022 deoras threatened the messaging app telegram with a nationwide shutdown arguing that it had repeatedly ignored Brazilian authorities request to block profiles and provide information again block you know this is this deoras you know he's he's been kind of busy for some time block profiles and provide information and weren't we all upset about when Russia was doing this I seem to remember you know we had all these human rights organizations chorus of indignation over Russia and telegram still works here and and X still works here um for political reasons um uh X was U found to be a unfriendly um platform but there's no it's not illegal to have a VPN and that's how everyone access crisis resolved yeah uh um he ordered telegram also to appoint a local representative the company ultimately complied and stayed online and then and then musk Elon Musk will be investigated over fake news and obstruction in Brazil after supreme court order again notice how they don't see a pattern here George I see a pattern here yeah notice how there's no quotes around fake news no quotes around obstruction you know they just they just put put that there as if um and then here a crusading oh he's a crusading Brazilian Supreme Court Justice thank ah it's a crusader you know burning with the Zeal of idealism the Supreme Court justice has included Elon Musk as a Target in an ongoing investigation over the dissemination of fake news and has opened a separate investigation into the US business executive for alleged obstruction in his decision uh justice Alexandra de moras noted that musk on Saturday began waging a public disinformation campaign imagine that regarding the top Court's actions and that mus continued the following day most notably with comments that his social media company X would cease to comply with the Court's orders to block certain accounts um and it says Musk had accused demoras of suppressing free speech and violating Brazil's Constitution and noted on X that users could seek to bypass any shutdown of the of the social media platform by using VPN or so but again you notice how the the US government isn't going in to bat for X you know here's this is you know this American company no no one's basically doing anything um really good point really good point and and the media is not going to B no no I mean exactly we'll come to that you know there the media's attitude to all this musk will be investigating for alleged intentional criminal instrumentalization of X as part of an investigation into a network of people known as digital militias who allegedly spread defamatory fake news and threats against Supreme Court Justices according to the text of decision this looks like a RICO investigation it says but notice alleged intentional instrumentalization you're trying to I'm trying to figure out what does that mean X as part of an investigation into a network of people known as digital militias what what exactly are digital militias I mean I mean you can have be a militia you know carrying a gun and so on but a digital militia you're sitting at home you know on your couch uh typing away um who allegedly spread defamatory fake news so that's that's that crime they was spreading defamatory fake News why why is it diff I mean is fake defamatory is is if there is another form of fake news I mean non defamatory non defamatory I want but maybe this is that defamatory non-fake news you know you can have inter oh that's a good one yeah nice variant George exactly um um the new investigation will look into where the musk engaged in obstruction criminal organization and um incitement so that you know there a nice nice few things to investigate musk on so they're generating a digital mug shot here that's right that's right I have to say if if I'm a musk I really wouldn't do too much traveling um I mean you know maybe go to Asia but I wouldn't go to Europe I don't know George I mean I I would take the long game here okay if the authorities want to shut down uh ex Twitter in Brazil well go right ahead let's see who who let's weigh out this game I I I I think it's going to come back and bite the authorities okay I really do well we'll see let's see um and then the flagrant conduct of obstruction of Brazilian justice incitement of crime the public threat of Disobedience of court orders and future lack of cooperation from the platform are facts that disrespect the sovereignity of Brazil demor all other news reports Ser is that they're willing to send in a lawyer I mean it's parlay he he that's that that's from what we've come done so far that's that's that's not possible right now right no ex exactly um and then you know Brazil's political rights are again oh as long characterized demor as overstepping his bounds to clamp down on free speech and engage in political persecution yeah but you don't have to be someone on the political right to say that exactly there's enough there's enough evidence here to suggest that that's a pretty correct uh diagnosis in the digital militia investigation lawmakers from George do you know what a digital militia is no I have no idea I mean it sounds to I don't know what it is either okay go ahead yeah I it sounds to me like people sitting on at their keyboard typing things that um powerful people don't like to see uh posted I mean that that's all I can think of as a digital militia um you know hey I don't I didn't care for that Facebook post of yours so you're part of a digital militia um lawmakers from bolsonaro circles have been imprisoned and his supporters homes raided so again let's read that in the digital militia investigation lawmakers from bolsonaro's Circle have been imprisoned this is part just a simply digital militia investigation no there's no violence or anything like that it's just people writing writing their opinions so this bolsonaro circle have been in prison and his supporters homes raided um and then then B himself became a target of the investigation in 2021 so again you could you can see how this this whole idea that you're saying things that we don't like is is leading to people getting imprisoned their homes raided um and and worse I mean this de Mor has no intention of stopping that um and then the Justice in March 2022 ordered the shutdown of telegram uh on the grounds that platform repeatedly ignored requests from Brazilian authorities including a police request to block profiles and provide information linked to this blogger an ally of bolsonaro's accused of spreading falsehoods again spreading falsehoods what you know what you the Santos account is one of those blocked on X in Brazil less than 48 hours after issuing his order in 2022 de Mori said telegram had complied and permitted it to resume operation so again very interesting I mean it seems the telegram has been quite Cooperative uh which then raises the question so what was the issue why did wise durov um under arrest y well I mean now that you mentioned it I mean it seems quite obvious to me now that uh the um uh the bail setting bail and allowing him to I suppose reside in a a very cushy environment in Paris y what he's used to is this is time for negotiation oh I think so absolutely which would be you know historically um relevant considering how he's dealt with authorities around the world no I I think that's I think absolutely I think that's the goal and I think the French are going to flatter him and you know macron you know he's he's had he's had good relations in the past with macron and I think macron was going to you know apply him you know with all sorts of goodies you yeah I got to you know think you know maybe move move to France um demor Defenders have said his decision although extraordinary are legally sound and necessary to purge social media of fake news as well as to extinguish threats to Brazilian democracy well that's what his Defender is bound to say um and then so this is from the financial times and I you know look at this pavl durov and the limits of free speech so this this face of this this is not pavl durov's face this is some Financial Times journalists face and he says telegram has failed to this guy just looking at this guy's mug he has a lot of limits himself but I think telegram has failed to distinguish between the demands of autocratic regimes and the legitimate Democratic requests just just before we go on you know let's so these legitimate Democratic requests involved the all the covid nonsense you know removing all the posts um which uh questioned the Orthodoxy on uh covid most most of those postings were actually now turned out to be uh correct that it it involved the removal of posts about Hunter Biden's laptop that's um been correct um and uh and then of course all the questions about about the election so it's interesting he he dubs this as legitimate Democratic what what was legitimate about them and these are in quote unquote legitimate Democratic societies legitimate Democratic societies and then he goes on civil society organizations and law enforcement agencies have grown increasingly concerned about the nefarious uses of telegram which they argue has become the new dark web in particular the the French judicial authorities are investigating the platform for diffusing material about child sexual abuse and enabling criminal networks um and then and then he goes on in so doing telegram does not appear to distinguish between threatening demands of autocratic regimes and legitimate requests of law enforcement authorities in Democratic countries but that's not true that look telegram has said trouble all over the world irrespective of regime type well then that but that's that's the thing you say well you see what he's saying is that yeah I mean when when you defy Russia then you know we're going to support you you going to say right you know right on you know yeah absolutely you must defy Putin but when we demand that you take down this post or that post give us this information then there's a legitimate request of the democratic authorities uh even though you know and this is from we get it from Zuckerberg himself that those were completely illegitimate uh requests and the judge in Brazil is Not democratically Elected he's not Democratic exactly Not democratically Elected um nor has it fully explained its mysterious Banning and unbanning by the Russian authorities and its subsequent popularity among officials you know notice this guy obviously knows nothing about telegram anyway no no no but I I I always love this kind of the insinuation you're kind of insinuating uh something well the mysterious Banning and uh unbanning look Telegram and when he was when he had um D of had his uh scuffle with the Russian authorities they cut a deal right okay that's the obvious conclusion here so I don't know what it has to do with regime type democracy ocracy I have I have no idea no he hasn't does have anything but he's you know but the point here and this is one of the sort of this Western journalism thing is that well when we impose restrictions when we send you to prison those are legitimate then you know those are legitimate restrictions on on free speech when they do it then you know we're all in high dgon and and demand uh immediate release so but we do fine you know when we imprison Julian Assange that's fine that that that's you know that's in order to protect um societies but they cannot be allowed to do it um and then this says the service is also less secure than it seems telegram does not offer users endtoend encryption on all their messages by default as WhatsApp and Signal do I disagree with that I'm sorry yeah I I I'm kind of puzzled about that because then then what's all the fuss about I mean if it's if it's less secure than they are um I I don't understand um the somewhat infantile stance of libertarian absolutist is that there should be no limits on Free Speech but a free Society is not just about freedom of expression it also revolves around the observance of laws and the protection of other precious human rights which we then determine you know like what you know like what those precious human rights are I would did they get a quote from Scott Ritter on this one quite yeah exactly rer and and and the rest yeah um or Richard murst and andri Sims would probably like to Demitri Sims exactly um anyway so then democracies may be messy but they are the best mechanisms we know for a judic this is this kind of thrown on on and on um anyway then we have Robert Reich you remember Robert Reich he was the um the um labor secretary under Bill Clinton and then he he was also a um a rusher Gator big big rusher Gator and um here says Elon Musk is out of control here's how to reain him in re him in so this is so this is this is how you know this is an argument for how governments should reign in um a this person was providing and a platform a platform that he himself he doesn't control the SPF is just a platform for free speech he may be the richest man in the world but that doesn't mean we're powerless to stop him and and then go Elon Musk rapidly transforming his enormous wealth um into a huge source of unaccountable political power that's now backing Trump and other authoritarian so that's is said it is and and that's what's so interesting because he right has he ever written the same thing about George Saros who you know who also uses his vast Fortune to um uh B and and does it far more than musk does uh in order to uh support his favorite political candidates not to mention all a lot of other billionaires um who who use their money uh like in indeed Zuckerberg himself so mus owns X he publicly endorsed Donald Trump last month before that musk helped to form a prot trump super political action committee meanwhile the former US president has revived his presence on the X platform what is this what exactly what so why are we do why are we doing this George well no but because you got to watch what he then does here because he actually advocates proving against musk I'm I'm I'm pulling your leg I know he says according to a new report from the center for countering digital hate this is another one of these kind of disinformation outfits lavishly funded by governments you know you know that you they they always say these things and you imagine some idealist kids you know sitting in some you know dingy little office somewhere no no these are lavishly funded organizations um like you know the um the um was it the uh the one the which was the center for um strategic dialogue the yeah which is another one information Warfare musk himself has posted 50 false election claims on X so far this year Well are they false exactly you just say these things they're false I mean I mean I I don't I haven't seen all 50 of them but I mean they're actually more po posst as questions right exactly exactly I mean it's like but they always do this thing this false thing you know he's falsely said um evidence is mounting that Russia and other foreign agents are using X to disrupt this year's presidential race presumably in favor of trump I thought that the CIA said Iran is interfering in this election but Iran is actually working against Trump they they actually thought Iran may even be trying to assassinate Trump so you know they you got to get get your story straight um and musk has done little to stop them I mean so we this is a perfect segue to reintroduce Russia gate too exactly exactly absolutely exactly um besides I I think um ATI is um um I don't think art is not allowed on Twitter it it it has a presence but not directly as right I mean I think that some people on RTI have have have presence but ATI itself yeah well I'm on it okay you're on it I simonan is on it but ATI itself is not on it um meanwhile musk is supporting right-wing causes around the world in the UK far right thugs burned looted and terrorized minority communities as musks X spread in misinformation about a deadly attack on SCH what about what Facebook did in the 2020 election yeah what about what Facebook did with Co what about face and Russia game I mean come on this that that's that's that's the that's so important that that the you know that false fake news about Russia gate which Reich was very much involved in that you know that was read for years and years and years and did an Untold damage um and then he goes Elon Musk calls himself a free speech absolutist but has accepted over 80% of censorship requests from authoritarian governments and then two days before the Turkish elections he blocked accounts critical of the president so but this is very strange because what musk does musk you know tries to work within the laws of the country he said I I respect the laws of the country his point with with in Brazil was that he he's not acting in accordance with Brazilian laws so you know yeah if if you know if he wants to go on being in Turkey then you know he has to comply with the with Turkish laws um that's you know that's musk's position he's he doesn't want to defy the laws of any country um where X is uh available but you have to have then the law you have to actually show what the law is not just uh you know make it up yeah but see this is the slur has accepted over 80% of sens censorship requests from authoritarian government no the point is is that that um X has is willing to engage with individual governments based on their laws okay you don't have to throw authoritarian in there at all that's neither here nor there the fact is is that he wants to send a legal representative to Brazil to work this out but but but don't want to at least come halfway to talk yeah but yeah but you can't you can't then threaten the the legal representative with prison so I just got a message on X um Elon from Elon Musk here is the message here at least the top part Reich is excuse me one more time Reich is such a sweee the article that George and I are talking about right now in real time okay keep going that's good in real time good um and then um and his friendly relations with authoritarians are we talking about mque or Trump I mean it's it's always you know his friendly relations with authoritarians often seem to coincide with beneficial treatment of his businesses shortly after musk suggested handing Taiwan over to the Chinese government Tesla got a tax break from the Chinese government that is so dumb um he did it's so musk has had a very friendly relations with China for years and years and years I mean that that's where he he you know he produces um his uh his electric vehicles and um and you know and he said on Taiwan they talk a position you can agree or disagree but it's basically a position which is a kind of a common sensical uh position it doesn't make sense to go to war over Taiwan and on top shortly after most suggested handing Taiwan over to the Chinese government well Taiwan is already part of China it's part of Taiwan and it's not he doesn't have he doesn't own he doesn't own Taiwan I can't say well here here you can have Taiwan you know it's mine but you can have it I mean it's a suggested handing Taiwan who who who owns Taiwan I mean Taiwan doesn't actually belong to you so you can just talk about handing something over as you said it's actually part of China soly the United States doesn't own it and Elon mus doesn't own it um he may be the richest man in the world he may own one of the world's most influential social but blah you know here are six ways to reign in musk and this is probably what he was saying he's such a sweee um one boycott Tesla consumers shouldn't be making him shouldn't be making him even richer and able to do even more harm a Tesla boycott may already have begun and then recent poll said onethird of Britains are less likely to buy a Tesla um because of well maybe onethird of Britains are less likely to buy a Tesla because they're being impoverished but we'll leave that as exactly I mean I I don't know how many the brittons are actually in any position to buy a Tesla advertisers should boycott x a coalition of major advertisers has organized such a boycott musk is suing them under antitrust law we tried peace two for two years now it's War he said referring to advertisers who criticize him and ex um but this this was of course all all went back to that whole fraudulent thing uh that Media Matters for America which wag this campaign to try to get the advertisers to boycott X by by manipulating they they manipulated the algorithm to suggest that somehow Nazi tweets were appearing next to their ads it was it was a fraud uh Regulators around the world should threaten musk with arrest if he doesn't stop disseminating lies and hate on X well that's what that's why he's such a sweee Regulators around the world should threaten musk with arrest if he doesn't stop disseminating lies and Hate Global Regulators may be on the way to doing this as evidenced by the 24th of August arrest of durov who founded you know telegram with the French authorities which French authorities have found complicit in hate crimes and dis I haven't found anything of the sort I mean they this is an allegation I when when when did they establish that it's complicit or anything like musk durov has styled himself as a free speech absolutist he hasn't no he hasn't exactly hasn't yeah yeah that's right um in the United States the FTC should demand that musk take down lies that are likely to endanger individual and if he does not sue him under the the F Well I guess um Fox News nnbc CNN The Wall Street Journal the New York Times they're all going to be banned pretty soon for disseminating lies that's right right I mean you know again this coming from a repugnant Russia gazer who went on for year after year for him to talk start talking about lies musk Free Speech right under the first amendments don't take precedence over the public interest are they are the public oh we we deter what the public interest two months ago the US Supreme Court said federal agencies May pressure social media platforms they didn't say that it's not that's not what the Supreme Court said they said he had no standing just ruled on the issue of standing but they never said soal that federal agencies May pressure social media platforms to take down misinformation um the case failed but it's on the basis of standing not because they ruled that that's fine you can do this um a technical win for the public good technical because the court based its ruling on the plaintiff's lack of standing to Su you've undermined your own argument but but what you just said in the par now he has five has five points everyone and then the US government and we taxpayers have additional power over musk if we are willing to use it the US should terminate its contracts with him starting with musk space a again but notice the the the the vehement the the the anger that he's uh directing at musk what has musk done he's basically you know you you you don't like it that he's given a platform to people that you don't agree with he supporting Trump well he's entitled to that you know you what about all the billionaires who are on your side you know you got you know enough of those who are supporting Democrats in 2021 the United States entered into a 1.8 billion classified contract with SpaceX and blah blah the funds are now an important part of SpaceX revenue and um and the some the Pentagon is also contracted with SpaceX styling broadband service to pay for internet lists despite yeah well I guess you know they should cut that contract and maybe give it to boing see how that works out everybody okay I mean this is just such so spiteful okay very yeah that's right um and then then it goes on you know about all you know about all all the things that SpaceX gets from Pentagon um in deciding upon which private sector entities to contract with the US government is supposed to consider the contractor's reliability musk's Mercurial impulsive temperament makes him and the companies he heads unreliable that's not a Criterion whether something is reliable or not whether he's Mercurial or not I mean does he deliver on time does he deliver quality product uh that's you know does he you know meet the budget requirements that's what reliability not not be Mercurial temperament wow I've never been called Mercurial murrio that's a nice word um and then uh and then why is the US government allowing musks satellites and rocket launchers to become crucial to the nation security when he's shown utter disregard for the public interest you know again why give musk more economic power when he repeatedly abuses it and demonstrates contempt for the public good so he's making all kinds of wild wild assertions for which has provided no evidence but the the most amazing thing here again George and I have chronicled this since um mus took over Twitter and I I disagree with many of the decisions he's made but overall in Toto I think he's showing an amazing regard for the public interest right that's right there's no question I mean if you compare today's Twitter whatever the its flaws um with the Twitter before he took it over that that Twitter which was so eagerly cooperating with US government agencies I mean it was it it spent all of its time in meetings with FBI and CIA officials now here's another rusher Gator remember her Carol cadwalder um she actually lost a a lawsuit because she um had made a a claim about this this guy in Britain I think Aaron banks that he was working with Putin to um for brexit on behalf of brexit and she she made that allegation then then he sued her and she lost that case even though but the judge you know told told her oh you don't have to pay damages which was very nice for her um but basically she was an absolutely Ardent rusher Gator who actually was taken to court and lost in court and uh don't Rejoice yet Elon Musk and his Tech Bros in arms are winning the global will battle for truth the Banning of X in Brazil and the arrest of telegram boss pav durov won't stop their lies it was breaking news to Alert news alert to lift the spirits and make the hearts sing a tech billionaire arrested as he stepped off his private jet and detained by the French authorities happy days I wonder how often she flies on a private jet think she looks like she by the looks of her she has money um because one the UK police have been charging individuals who incited violence online during The Summer's riots the man who helped to fuel its Flames he didn't help fuel any goddamn Flames has simply tweeted his way through it it turned out because you can't have it all that the man arrested and subsequently charged in France this week was not Elon it was his bro arms father durov and Elon alike who founded the encrypted uh messaging app telegram um though for casual Observer it can be hard to tell where durov ends and musk begins what a hitpiece wow yeah yeah yeah yeah last week you know saw perhaps the the first major showdown between the pseudo Crypt libertarianism they both his spouse and the old-fashioned resolutely analog concept known as the nation state oh give me a break this is nothing to do with the nation state you know when when Victor Orban assorts the nation state people like Carol CAD waler go absolutely crazy this is nothing to do with nation state but but somehow this is a kind of they're trying to do a fake populism both she and right did you notice that Camala Harris said that in her convention speech she talked about the the the uh the Virtues Of The Nation St I thought it was really disingenuous I mean keep yeah that that's right but you know somehow against these all these uh the these the tech oligarch but the tech oligarchs are actually providing people with a service you know you you got a free service you got a you've got a platform to communicate most of the tech um billionaires are on in the left's pocket okay that's right the exact exactly exactly it's that's why they they pick I mean durov isn't even political in any way and musk incidentally musk used to be a liberal this is very recent that he's made this political change um but musk said he supported well not just obam's uh but he supported Biden in 2020 um and um and for anyone who has spent any time pondering The Intergalactic levels of entitlement among the Tech bro bro Archy and the until now total impunity they faced the arrest and subsequent charging of durov was a singular moment and again you know we have to just keep in mind these are people who spent years in column after column lying about Russia you know n none of which ever sort of is brought up against them and and anyway then he goes on about that and then um musk believes in free speech the same way that he believes in free Teslas free for him very expensive for everyone else why why is it very expensive for everyone else I mean it it's free I mean you you use it I mean I I you know I I don't pay for Twitter in between a stream of tweets on how free speech is the beg Rock of democracy and censorship is a certainty if Dems win was another one in which he gloated about a ruling in his Lial case against Media Matters for America yeah now that's that he he you know he want a round so that means the lawsuit goes on and then this isn't a civilizational battle for free speech for the future of free speech and durov isn't a hero the charges against him include the decidedly unutur istic crime of money laundering and his less than heroic failure to supress the sexual images of children um it's actually a civil izational battle for the truth well I would agree with that yes exactly yeah yeah and and Carol Codwell she's a she's a really she's in the Battle For Truth what we need to face up to is that this is a battle that musk is winning his truth is simply louder faster disseminating further his algorithms are spreading his metaphorical seed spawning an entire generation of mini musks and would be musks who Dream of Electric cyber trucks so that but what this is this passes for journalism this pass for Jour but you know what I just wanted to show is that so musk is under attack from this crazy judge with you know applying some law in his own mind um then we have durov you know being coerced by the French government um and the media are kind of clapping their hands with Glee you know great you know this is this is this there's Carol Cardwell she's a columnist at the guardian Reich also a columnist of the guardian and we talked to that guy at the financial times they're happy with this yeah but neither none of them will mention um Zuckerberg's letter to Jim Jord that's right ex exactly all the points that Zuckerberg made there and said yeah I kind of kind of shouldn't have done uh what I did he's he's really afraid yes he's really afraid because look you know it's isn't it really kind of curious that all of these clowns want the state want the the they want to use the state right to start clamping down on Free Speech platforms well what happens if the there's a change in power in the state okay and the state will make it a priority to protect Freedom oh yeah yeah that's right that's that that that's exactly because the state doesn't do that right now we've been I mean just about every time for the last month that George and I have convened we've talked about speech issues okay because it's grossly under attack right now and it there's no sign it's going to let up anytime soon but you know they want they want the the state to be used to clamp down on free speech and they're terrified the state might change its mind with someone in power like Trump right yeah no I absolutely I mean all all of this really you know stems from the fact that they they suddenly they they lost out on Free Speech they were convinced that somehow they'll be able to control speech um and you know because they're so smart and you know speech is really you know that's something they're good at and everything so that but what happened you know hey you got Obama That's not fantastic you know they you know we social media you know we got Obama you know they were they were rejoicing about social media about how because Obama's supporters and then then we had the Arab Spring oh fantastic you know got rid of all these people in the Arab Spring and it was the the the the loss to brexit and then to Trump in in quick succession that's got caused this this this hysteria um about social media you know we can't we can't allow people just to start you know speaking freely then we can't do that they're gonna make wrong decisions that's right the problem with these people is they lost the the the time at least as a western tenant is that if you don't like bad speech counter it with good speech okay people have nothing good to say no at all no that mean because even when when they liked social media for Obama they only liked it because they they thought they couldn't control it they will it'll always be in under their control so this is fantastic we use social media and we're always going to be in control and we're going to have you know Obama's Bots you know they're going to be telling us how great Obama is and uh and then suddenly they realized yeah you know other people are going to use speech and uh and the outcomes will not be things that well and going back to the starlink other peoples are going to use speech yeah those that don't have the means of the Rich and Powerful they want to use speech this is the see they didn't count on this they didn't count on the the the weakest and most frail and threatened people of our society that they too can get on Twitter and they too can get on starlink and they can be uh participate in the conversation that wasn't they didn't count no no no that was never that was never part of the plan and uh and that and that's what causes this alarm that somehow you've democratized the internet you've democratized speech you've democra yeah yeah exactly you know all sorts of people are now able to speak communicate exchange ideas we can't have that um we that's and that's basically what they're saying I mean behind all the all this carol card Waller and others that's what they're saying we cannot have people going going on these social media platforms and exchanging ideas who the hell do they think they are you know I mean you know they they have to do as they're told you know just accept you know you know that we know better than they do I I am the truth as that um what's the that New Zealand prime minister the Jessica Bou saying I am science I am science exactly that's it and end of discussion I am science and who are you you're nobody I don't know where this is going George um I I got a feeling a real strong gut feeling it's going to get a lot lot worse it with the hope that there there might be some kind of Crescendo as realizing the dystopia that these people are create but since these people are making the decision and considering their road record of the last half century I don't know I don't have much hope that it's going to end well but one thing I do know for sure it's going to get a lot worse I think it absolutely because you know Alex Jones that's the Paradigm you know you know oh we got you know that's a oneof you know he was just too radical and extremist and all that but no then you get somebody that you deem to be um far left and then far right what you're doing is that you're you're trying this um uh um relativism you know that we're we're protecting speech from both sides and all that and now they're going into people's homes they're taking passports so way and what is the the the the establishment's response they either yawn or they say they deserve it and then you have these ridiculous journalists cheering it on so that and that's that was a key because what they did with Jones was was was The crucial point because most of didn't know much about Jones but you say like you know the guy you know he's a real extremist he's a conspiracy theorist you know we'll we'll we'll deplatform him I mean it doesn't matter does I mean we're just deplatforming some some crazy guy you know who's an extremist well all right yeah why not you know just deep platform him that's not going to have any repercussions well it is because you know there's goingon to be the next guy they're not just going to stop with Alex Jones but that was the point you have to get that thing get that first step in and then you get you D platform a sitting president of the exactly exactly absolutely these people are so reckless they are they they're so Messianic they're they're a threat to the existence of of humanity and I I didn't say that um lightly I mean this is again if if um there is if you don't have um the media standing up and at least being evenhanded about this you know instead they're they're always with power right and they've chosen sides and their side is against all the rest of us that's right no it's always a chosen sides because they want to maintain that dominance of uh you know of the information space that they used to have you know even 20 years ago you know you basically you know you had the networks you know you had cable you had the the uh the big newspapers that's it they control what the information that people got and now suddenly when people getting information and ideas all from all sorts of different places they're not happy about that CNN does not want that that's you know you know that's why hence they come up with these new coinages like disinformation fake news uh conspiracy theory you know so so somehow to delegitimize any other uh media Outlet just like when they uh when Bobby Kennedy was uh speaking after he dropped out or suspended his uh presidential Ambitions and endorse Trump what did they do they cut him that's right exactly that's exactly what they did you don't hear it then it doesn't exist huh absolutely right if you don't hear it doesn't exist yeah all right everybody that's our Sunday wrap tomorrow we do a live stream we'll have the U Germany's uh uh three regional election results in hand I have two today and I think there's another there's the the third one will be in a couple of weeks yeah okay well but two in key ones and um I'm anticipating a very good result George and I will just like do Mor on it I think we're on the money I'm pretty much on the money here um and it's implications and what's uh uh and why we should be looking at it even more as one of my professors told me when I was in graduate school said German politics it's boring and that's a good thing well German politics are no longer boring we a good thing or a bad thing all right George uh this is gagle with Peter and George we're on local so please go to the Gaggle locals.com and I hand it back to George exactly so please join us 10:00 a.m. eastern time tomorrow for our live stream it's always a lot of fun come with lots of questions and comments and observations we really like um addressing those and you know particularly when they're ready ready and waiting uh for us so we've got something to uh sink our teeth into and then speaking of sinking teeth he wants to start sinking his teeth into my neck for you know inadequate topping up of the tip jar so you don't want to mess with ch you don't want to mess with the chah yeah got strong Jaws you know he may be small but these Jaws are very strong um you know uh we're very grateful for all of your help friendship and support the more you're able to donate the more of these videos we can make the more we can improve on the technology and above all we can just sort of calm him down and get get stop get these ideas into his head about sinking Jaws in it's not nice so remember if you like the Gaggle please like share and subscribe see you soon bye