Eli Holstein vs Nate Yarnell QB Battle, Kent State Preview w/Stephen Thompson of the Post-Gazette

hello and welcome back to the loyal Sun show that's at the loyal Suns on all of your social medias follow us here and follow us there for Pitts Sport's content you will not want to miss if you love that football is fully back and hate the word or this is the place for you the loyal Sun show a safe sunshiny place for your pit Athletics fix gentlemen it is August 26th 2024 a Monday in several days it will be Saturday do you know what Saturday is it's the opener it's the day we get to go tailgate and drink beers in a parking lot at 7:30 a.m. God that makes me jealous but we all get to watch pit football after that time passes and beers are consumed and or not consumed true so we'll all be enjoying pit football at various capacities in various mental States uh but that voice that you heard bemoaning uh his required sobriety on Saturday is the post gazette's very own Stephen Thompson Stephen how are you today I'm good um I'm very good um I spent last weekend at the beach um visiting some family and now I get to ponder this revolutionary offense that pit is going to run with two quarterbacks um and you know this defense that's gonna have five defensive tackles at once apparently um this is this is an exciting time pit is really changing the game of football right before our eyes wow you sound uh really enthused very optimistic yeah I you know in all I am in all honesty like I am going to I'm going to show up at aure Stadium on Saturday I'm going to see that that Stadium dressed up in blue and gold and I'm gonna be really excited um like I always am because uh like I don't know it's just cool you only get 12 game days a year I hope I didn't sound too you know sarcastic or or like I was bemoaning going to a game on Saturday because uh I like doing this I mean this is like you know whenever I complain about my job I have to remember that like I watch football and basketball for a living like I have it better than than a lot of people um so I I I don't mean to sound uh sound bitter at all I I am genuinely very excited but man trying to parse some of the things on the step chart are do give me a headache sometimes I know we were looking forward to this for a while now because there was a lot of questions you hear some rumors from camp and you're like well what are they actually going to tell us and then it happens and we have more questions than answers and Pat ardui does not like answering questions questions so um what was it like for you down there today were you expecting uh some secrecy behind the quarterback position and elsewhere um I I think as far as the quarterbacks I did expect there to be an or um I I didn't expect them to kind of give us anything um but I thought they would know who their guy was so when Nardi said that they're gonna play both Nate Yarnell and Eli Holstein I was pretty surprised um I you know I felt like I had a bunch of questions paired trying to like pry into like you know I thought Pat was going to kind of give us the impression that like oh we're gonna we're gonna see who's going to be the starter in practice and he did kind of lead with that but eventually then he says well both guys are going to play and that kind of threw me for a loop a little bit uh because I think it's generally kind of weird to walk into a season without a number one guy um I think just from like a leadership perspective a confidence perspective like when so much other stuff is weird and when so much other stuff is changing um you have new offensive coordinator and entirely different offensive staff you've got uh a few new starters all around um like I feel like you would want a sure thing whether that's that's Eli holin Holstein or Nate jarnell you want the guy in the middle of the Huddle to be to be certain about who he is and what his position is uh on the team and think you want everyone else to be kind of certain about that um but I think it became clear over the course of that press conference that you know this is this is an exhibition game in pan ard's mind this is a scrimmage this is a this is the preseason that they don't get um I think all of the ores reflect that um I think the fact that they are playing a Kent State team that um you know it's probably the worst team in the FBS this year except for like Kennesaw State who's making the leap from FCS this year um like you know if you're an S&P plus guy from Bill Conley at ESPN um that's like football kenpom um they finished 133rd out of 133 teams in S&P plus last year they're 130th going into this season like I so they got better yes they did they improved they improved this improved Ken State team um but you know they're still not very good and I think pit um pit kind of expects to roll over them to to get a win um so I think they I think this is going to be a lot of experimenting and I think they're going to use this game to figure a lot of a lot of things a lot of things out and they they have to um so because clearly there's there are few sure things like anywhere on the step chart I think like you know you know the linebackers are who they are the safeties are who they are the corners seem pretty set the offensive line is generally pretty set as well Gavin's your tight end but like everything else is kind of up in the air like from quarterback running back wide receiver defensive tackle defensive end like down to like kickoff for Turner and punt returner which also like is Kenny Johnson and Desmond Reed as your kickoff in pun returners like when last year in a much slower offense he took bub means off kickoff return because he was afraid of tiring him out so like I don't think that's gonna stick either like so I think there's a lot of things that they need to sort through and I think the fact that they tabbed Kent State for this opener at home is Not an Accident um I think this is a soft Landing for for a new offense and a new coaching staff and a lot of new starters and a lot of new players uh into the 2020 24 season I'm not too fearful of Kent State although I know I shouldn't say that without knocking on every piece of wood I can find being a pit fan I've I've experienced games against FCS teams that have gone very very poorly uh but like the rotating quarterbacks thing even if you think you can walk over Kent State with either of those guys playing taking taking their reps neither of them have to get in a rhythm the big issue I have with it is we're breaking in a brand new offense and we're staring down the barrel at ciny and West Virginia the next two games and I the way I feel is if you think one of those guys is the better quarterback we need to get them as many reps as possible so we can work out some of those KS some of the procedural issues uh and so before we go to Cincinnati and have five pre- snap penalties by the guy who maybe only played Four drives the previous week so do we actually think it's still up for debate whoever plays better is going to win the job or is there somebody with a pretty good inside track because it seems like Holstein oh he did say Holstein caught up to him does that mean holstein's the guy because he looked better over the past few weeks well I I think caught up is interesting because that kind of means they're at the same level right now to me um and then you kind of throw in the fact that Nate jarnell has actually like played college football before um I think that would kind of give him the edge in in my book like I you know I think everyone kind of generally right that like Eli Holstein obviously he was a four-star guy played at Alabama and everything like that um probably has the higher ceiling I don't think that's unfair to say um but I I think you just look at the broader context you look at a head coach who went three and on last year who was breaking in a new offense who things don't go well this year if things look like they did last year is going to be on the hot seat going into next year I I'd be pretty surprised if he doesn't roll with the guy that he knows um the guy that he recruited the guy that he us um then again you know he kind of threw a curveball at us and hired a guy to run a uptempo spread offense um this off season so maybe he's just putting all his trust into Cade and the guy that Cade recruited in Eli Holstein I I don't really know um I I think I know what I would pick but then again I'm not in practice every day watching these guys every day I I still feel like jarnell has the inside track I feel like the fact that he was he has been the declared starter really up until now like even as recent as last week like when we or maybe two weeks ago when I asked Nardi about the quarterbacks he was like yeah Nate's our starter for now um like he it is very recent I think when you know when Pat says he caught up to yarno like that's a pretty recent phenomenon I think um he was making progress and showing things but the the the whole caught up thing that that was today that happened that was the today is the first time that we've actually heard that from from Pat so question is I think the reason for going with two quarterbacks you hope somebody is the clear winner someone looks good someone doesn't look as good or maybe you have a guy that you want to start but you want him to win the job officially in real game action so if he does that the decision's easy what happens if they both go out there and are pretty unimpressive against Kent State we're in the same position both guys probably aren't feeling good about themselves no one got into a rhythm and nardu is going to wait until the first snap to announce a starter next week maybe who knows and that accomplishes nothing yeah I feel like that's your worst case scenario um I mean then I guess you just take it you kind of take it into Cincinnati week you see game plans better or picks up the game plan better I guess um I I don't know I think they have things that they there's like a general checklist of what you want like you want a guy who takes care of the ball um you want a guy who can get the ball to The Playmakers and everything like that um so I I don't know I I I think you should I think that's a very valid concern like especially that like you know is it GNA be you know jarnell gets two two or three series and then holon comes in does he get a quarter does he get a half like I think how they split up the Reps too like the the the organization of this rotation you know is it just straight one guy starts one guy finishes the game or one guy start he comes out and then he comes back in like I I think that's a very interesting thing to watch as well because we're they're gonna you're gonna be able to make a lot of excuses for either guy I think um like if you're a big believer in Hol Ste and he comes in cold Off the Bench and only gets you know a quarter whatever before he he goes back to the bench you're going to be able to say well yeah of course he sucked he didn't have you know wasn't able to get into a rhythm he didn't you know have as many reps with the first team or whatever and you know if jarnell gets pulled early you say well he didn't have a full game you know he didn't you know this that and the other like you're gonna be able to make a lot of excuses for either guy if uh if if it comes down to that and at that point I feel like nard is just going to go with his gut quite honestly like at that point what else would you like if both guys don't look very good against Ken State what else do you have to go on you know yeah David loves hearing that Nardi going with his gut yeah yeah no he he's he's definitely earned a lot of uh trust and Goodwill among pit faithful uh especially quarterbacks yeah right right they've he's definitely done really well with quarterbacks outside of the one guy who is kind of gift wrapped to him from God uh and just had a a lights out senior year because of the offensive coordinator that Nardi hated um but that's that's neither here nor there uh I will say my first reaction when I saw saw the news that there was the ore between the quarterbacks and that they'd be uh they'd be trading series possibly against Kent State I said I said my only prediction for the outcome of this is that it is mishandled in some capacity and costs us at least a game this year so so you know I think it's suffice to say um I'm not seeing sunshine and rainbows right now David will be taking Cincinnati first half money line absolutely yeah was ask which which game money which game does it does it cost them not not Kent State not Kent State but um I don't know I well let me ask you do you think that this is do you think that the plan is to like this is the one try out and then he wants to make a decision or even some of the the quote almost sounded like he was planning to pick a starter this week during practice and then just let them both play anyway because we're playing Ken state so I I couldn't tell is is this the final audition this game or is it the preparation leading up to it how long do you think we could see this drag out because that'll decide if I'm putting if I'm putting money on Cincinnati or West Virginia well I think if practice had kind of any bearing on this we would have we would have a started right now um I think he's really waiting to see what these guys do in stadium against another opponent so I think it's really all going to come down to what they do on Saturday um I would not expect them to drag it out into Cincinnati I think For Better or Worse they're GNA they're going to pick a guy to play the whole game against Cincinnati um or you know play until the wheels fall off I guess um yeah I I just I I can't imagine that they would you know have gone through four weeks of training camp plus however many weeks of spring practices and then say we just need one more week of practice before we figure out who the guy is I think this is really all about their game performance um so yeah Saturday is kind of big for for not no reason but I don't know like someone asked us like is this me and Carter like for on our mailbag thing like is this the right decision you know like is this the right way to handle this and the only thing I can kind of come up with is like if you don't if you don't know who your guy is then yeah probably like if you if you haven't reached a conclusion yet then this is really the only thing you can do I guess well so that's that's a really good point um and you know I obviously had a little bit of a negative outlook on the way they've decided to go about it because of uh all the trust that I lost in Nardi in the last year but squid you had a really good point that kind of brought me over to the other side and I I think you know Stephen kind of started hinting towards it at the end there yeah we've talked about this on the pod in previous weeks the two quarterback system never is really beneficial in the long run you can only think of handful of times or it ever actually worked or wasn't like a clearcut this guy was so much better why did we waste our time giving the other guy any reps even Nate Peterman and Chad voic for pit sake but if you look back at last year narzi picked one guy and he was so bad and we played that guy for so long the second the other guy played he was already better and we were like wow why didn't we see that earlier so maybe because last year was so bad and Nardo's decision if it was his and I don't know if he wants to deflect that the Frank cetti still was so bad now we will be able to see with our own eyes too if Eli Holstein is amazing and Nate Yarnell is bad there's no way he'll play the guy who played bad against Kent State and we'll see with our eyes too it's like well Pat it's this or nothing yeah me like he can't like afford to I mean I think like I I think you saw how um think you saw how poor like the beginning of last season went and that just kind of set the tone for the rest of the year like it was hard to recover from that so I there was a quote from earlier in the year I can't remember how exactly he worded it but um you know Pat said he has gone over with with Cade Bell um like how long the leash is going to be for the guy who does become the starter and uh what the kind of criter IA for pulling a guy is going to be um they have a plan for um what's what's going to happen if the guy they pick isn't the guy um at least you know at least that's what they said to us I don't know what that that plan entails I don't know what exactly that means but they are they have at least thought about it um it isn't going to be it isn't going to be you know three weeks aren't going to pass before they start to think oh [ __ ] maybe we should pull this guy um I think they are there's going to be a quicker trigger especially because like I think I don't know I I think if you had walked into a season knowing who your guy was at least coming out of camp that would have uh I think that would have inclined me to kind of give a guy a longer leash like you know I was so certain about this guy going all the way through camp like he looked like the guy for so long if you're still uncertain at this point I I don't think they're gonna have a problem not cycling through guys but saying look we weren't certain about you from the jump we gave some Faith early but you're not living up to the standard we can't really afford to do this you're out whoever else the next guy is in so I I I don't know we're trying to examine the psychology of like Pat ardui right now as it comes to quarterback Vision I think is not not easy to do and we're never actually gonna be inside his head about it but we think about hiring an intern who does that they back check in his press conferences sort of like the politics now you have all these fact Checkers we're gon have a patzi fact Checker and we're gonna have someone that tries toal figure it out they're gonna try to analyze what he's thinking at all times what his next move will be yeah you need like a body language specialist you need like a Psychology major you can you can they can work together to to figure out uh figure out what patner doy means when he says I don't think anybody would take that job it sounds absolutely miserable but in theory if we could do that it would be very hilarious I wish we had had the power to put Community notes on uh a couple of you know pit beat reporters tweets today that were just direct quotes of Pat and ardi like hey we've we've never uh shorten the Playbook against a lesser opponent for a strategic advantage and the community notes would just say yes the [ __ ] you have well this so we like talk a little bit about this before before we start recording but like okay so he definitely did that in 2016 against fanova with Penn State on the horizon would anyone be pissed at him if he did do that like he employed some gamesmanship to win a massive game against your biggest rival like would would anyone get mad at him for doing that like I I don't think so like what's the point of like fibbing about that I I don't get it uh I would I would say that um the the Rhode Island game and the wford game yeah you could be justified in getting mad at him about that I mean like was that offense gonna be good if they opened it up against wford or I mean that so you know I I get it I he did carry a lot of that 2022 offense but like that offense was going to be him or nothing no matter what I think at the time we thought it could have been but in hindsight it was just bad the whole time and it just never hurts to get a couple more reps in with your guys I mean obviously nothing was going to make Phil a replacement level quarterback last year but you got to imagine you know if it doesn't if letting him throw it a little bit against wford doesn't at least improve his uh his mentals a little bit it at least lets us know a couple weeks earlier like oh he can't make these passes against wford who's that French Canadian kid on the bench yeah maybe I don't know like he I feel like we saw that against West Virginia and it still took three more weeks for them to pull him so I I don't know I'm putting the foot down right here we're done we're done talking about Phil for the rest of this episode for the remainder um I have a sneaking suspicion this won't be the last week we're discussing the two quarterbacks that's I'll leave it at that but uh do we have any any other pieces of the depth chart that really jumped out at you guys today because first one for me honestly I know we've been hearing about him but seeing the or next to Rodney Hammond's name with Desmond Reed uh it seems like Desmond Reed's gonna be you know we've heard about he's electric he he was productive at Western Carolina but it seems like he really really is going to be a vital part of this offense or at least is they're planning to make it that yeah I mean I feel like he's the guy um I don't know how high this the guy the guy over Rodney I I think like if they you know they're going to rotate through guys a bunch um but if I was a betting man I'd say among running backs Desmond Reed will have the most touches by a fairly wide margin I can't really put a name a number on that um like I I just don't you know I I have a hunch that this coaching staff isn't particularly high on Rodney um I think why I I don't know I can't really tell you like I think Rodney's good but also like you know just you know there was just a moment with like Andre Powell last year where like you know people ask him like Hey why isn't Ronney getting more touches like he's been listed to top of the depth chart all year uh you know it feels like he's kind of a Bruiser where the more the more touches he gets the more he can wear down a defense and Andre Powell was basically like you know is that really true like when when has Rodney ever rushed for like 100 yards or something and and someone was like well the Syracuse game last year or this year like it was a few weeks after that and like there was West Virginia two years ago where he had you know um ra like 100 total yards maybe a lot of those were receiving or something like that but had 100 yards in the Sun Bowl too we like yeah there's like this example and that example and this other example of like Rodney like playing pretty well when he gets most of the touches and so I don't know I like I think R's also been banged up a little bit too over these past couple years which hasn't helped but like I don't know I I think they they just they talk about Desmond Reed in a way that they have never talked about Rodney um at least since I've been covering the team So based off that I I feel like and just that combined with the speed explosive playability that as much as I love Rodney he does not have the kind of speed that Desmond Reed has um and he also doesn't have the familiarity with the offense um like K Bell brought brought Desmond here for a reason um so I that's that just all leads me to believe that if they you know had to roll with run running back if they're you know if it's a two-minute drill and the game is on the line I think they're gonna have Desmond Reed in there over Rodney Hammond I'm gonna throw up and I mean that doesn't even say anything about Rodney like that's the thing I I don't even think that means Rodney's bad I just I um I I have not been able to square Rodney and his usage in this offense with how good he is at least in my head like what I've seen I feel like I've seen on the field like I just I feel like I've questioned myself at every turn about like like I think Rodney's good but like am I is there something I'm not see like I don't I don't know I get confused about it all the time I still think Rodney's good but I think they like Desmond Reed a lot more sometimes get caught in that too like I assume well the coaches I imagine all the good things I saw Rodney Hammond do these figments of my imagination when he had 140 allpurpose yards in the brawl two years ago or when he closed out the Clemson game as a true freshman or when he scored a touchdown the ACC Championship as a true freshman did I imagine most of the these things sorry squid well I was going to say the same thing I think we see it in the games and think oh that guy's great he's gonna do great things if you can stay healthy but I get caught in the middle like well if the coaches aren't playing him is there a reason or is it the wrong choice and I don't know anymore we obviously talked about Vincent Davis's usage quite a bit and are worried that this will become that all over again where we're giving Davis 12 carries and he finishes the game with like 24 yards and he's just getting stuffed every play because he's very undersized and he's being used in a very wrong way so I'm okay with there being an ore they seem to be compliments pretty well Desmond Reed seems like a great receiving back as well and who knows in Kade Bell's offense how much that'll come into play but it's all about the situations like Rodney Hammond even the Boston College game that was the second to last game of the season he looked great he bust off a big run that's yeah he was he was what 120 something yards like yeah 140 yeah like he was he was great I I think the taling thing is like like you said situationally like you know when they're on the goal line is who's getting those carries is it I mean you know when it's it's third and one from the one like is Rodney getting those carries or is like Daniel Carter getting those carries you know if we flash back to D Davis you know like getting those carries like I think that'll be a that'll be a big time sorry no you're good that's a good point too if we flash back to the quadri Allison and Darren HDO I felt like they managed that perfectly there'd be games where Allison wouldn't really get going he was the starter but they'd be like you know what this is a Darren Hall game and they'd give Darren Hall the bul of the Reps in the second half and he'd have himself a day but ever since then it just seems like as fans like why is this guy getting so many carries right now and we thought maybe if Pal's gone uh new offense figure it out they play the right the quote right guy maybe Desmond Reed is really good and be explosive running back for us but to give up on Rodney Hammond seems crazy i' agree I would agree so I mean this might be a decent point to segue to cuz I know what I want to see on Saturday in terms of the running back situation I'd like to see uh Rodney ham and get a majority of the carries and touches I'd like to see what Desmond Reed can bring to the offense but I do want to talk a little bit about looking forward to Saturday what are the things that we need to see or want to see what do we want to see what do we need to see in order to make us feel a little bit better about where this team can go in 2024 uh are we going to take a step back to what we thought was a floor raised by Pat and ardui for this pit program uh or or are we going to see more of the same from 2023 so Stephen I mean you kick it off for us what what's one one or two things that you want to see on Saturday from this 2024 version of the pit Panthers yeah I'd say first you like and this is kind of basic but you want to see the operational stuff um like go smoothly like you don't want to see false starts you don't want to see 12 men on the field you don't want to see illegal formations um things like that um we heard that was a problem at one point in Camp um just guys kind of leaving too early in a scrimmage just uh that kind of operational stuff like you want to you know the right substitutions and everything with like a new offense and a new coaching staff and um some new players and everything like that you want to see that stuff go smoothly um and then but that is kind of a layup quite honestly um I'd say the other one is get Gavin barthal you five catches get him five catches um I don't care how many targets it takes but like this is one where you should kind of be able to force feed him the ball a little bit and you know I was going to say you know get some big plays out of it but I'd just rather rather see that they like like you know like I don't really care if you're Force feeding Gavin you know I think that that in the past that might have been like a problem but I think that against this opponent in this setting just like show that you're serious I guess about it you know we've heard a lot of talk a lot of lip service paid to get in gabing the ball um and I would just like I would like to see I think it would give a lot of people confidence if if that did not just look like lip service uh this c a bell could get himself annointed to the Saint Hood after his first week in Pittsburgh if he does exactly what you just said yeah like and I like it's not just you know it'll unlock some good for them like I don't think it's going to I don't think it's going to be like pulling teeth for them like they they should want to do that that is that is smart he is one of your best players like just just do it just do it uh like it shouldn't be as complicated as anyone has made it seem over the past uh two years um and just and if this offense is what it thinks it is or what it say what everyone says it is it should be easy but I I'm not going to believe it until I see it because we have heard you know time and time again yeah we need to get Gavin the ball you know like it's like the it's like the guy in the hot dog suits like we're trying to find the guy who did this all like it's you guys are in control of this like I I don't know I think Gavin barthol is a good player um and I think if you get in the ball good things are gonna happen I think I that is that is probably the first thing on my mind when I'm looking at at what we want to see from from this offense specifically on Saturday hey they say that's the quarterback's best friend we've got two quarterbacks that are looking to get comfortable out there no better way than to give it to your freak athlete 65 tight end well I mean one of my favorite I guess you call it a stat from last year but uh you know Gavin was out for the last two games that Nate started his Boston College and Duke and Carter Johnson who I you know fine player um but he is not Gavin Bartholomew and he I think maybe over the like including the garbage time of Notre Dame had like damn near 200 receiving yards in like three games with Nate Yarnell at quarterback I'm just saying I am just saying Nate Nate likes his tight ends some tight ends had some success uh he had like two like nearly 200 yards in those last two games it was like 140 yards I want to say and a touchdown he had a touchdown against Duke um so you know it is certainly possible and I think uh Nate Yarnell certainly thinks tight ends are his best friend I'm sure Carter appreciates how you put phrase that but like yeah like all due respect he transferred to Florida A&M not didn't exactly uh spurn us for the SEC so I I think that's a fair fair take on on his abilities do you think there's any truth to the rumors that Signet was just the only person in that building that didn't see it with Gavin CU what i' always heard was that he just wasn't very ey on him and it reflected in his Personnel usage well I don't know I mean so like obviously I'm not you know not privy to those conversations I I you know Frank and I don't Frank and I don't talk anymore um so I can't really ask him but he uh I remember uh it was early in the season last year someone asked Pat like you know it seems like Gavin was off the field I think it might have been after the Cincinnati game um or maybe the North Carolina game Cincinnati because he was off the field on the key drive after having 77 yards the drive before yeah on like two catches or something like that um but someone asked him like why is he off the field on so many third Downs um like is he taking himself off they you guys pulling him off the field and Pat said if if Gavin can stay out there for all however many plays you play if he's out if he can stay out there for 100% of the snaps he will be out there for 100% of the snaps um so you know maybe Frank just didn't see it with him I think it's usually the position coaches who kind of call substitutions and things of that nature um but you know I guess I can't really say for sure um I suppose it makes sense um but I also think it's possible that like you know that the quarterback play didn't exactly lend itself to I would put it more on the quarterback play than any you know like wouldn't been a like there was never an or next to you know we talked about the ORS earlier like there was never an or next to Gavin and Carter Johnson's name I don't think if I remember incorrectly on any depth chart and I think that would have been an indicator that like that Frank wasn't really messing with him um I don't know M maybe I I guess I can't I I apologize I can't really say for sure but I I think we'll find out a little bit based on uh how much Cade Bell decides to use him so yeah sure yeah yeah and I mean it I don't know like I said there was a lot of like there was a lot of lip service like I one of the most painful like press conferences we had to do last year was one where you know we talked to Frank I think we talked him maybe twice like during the regular season last year and it was I don't know Signet press conferences were always weird because you would ask him a question and then every answer would start with man we're so blessed to play this great game of football and it's like all right well that's not really what I asked that's um but you know there was one day where like all the questions asked him were about were about Gavin and he's like yeah man like we really got to get him the ball don't we it's like yeah like so what are you gonna do about it like I so I guess that's plausible that he just kind of played paid some lip service to it and never really saw it um I don't think he's the only one that kind of you know hears all the hype about Gavin and says okay well it's never had a season with more than 360 yards maybe um so I I don't you know if Frank does did feel that way he probably wasn't the only one but um I would I would be pretty surprised if like I don't know like we in the limited targets that he did get everyone else was able to see how athletic Gavin was and and what he was able to do with the ball in his hands I I would just have a really hard time believing that that Frank saw that and thought nah don't need it I think it I I would put it more on the quarterback play than you know substitutions or anything that any attitudes that Frank had towards him yeah and a lot of teams this offseason noticed as well so sorry we're happy to have him back and hopefully more than just lip service this year yeah definitely I don't think we've even uh maybe shortly earlier but obviously all the attention is going to be on the offense between the two quarterbacks who looks better um but and quite frankly Kent State I think they scored 19 touchdowns all of 2023 so I don't know how much we'll really learn from this defense on Saturday uh but I do want to talk a little bit about the defense because as as painful and as annoying as this quarterback competition Slash new offense is probably going to be for the next couple of weeks I actually am fairly bullish on the defense I I think they can be pretty good um I think the safeties are really good Corners I'm a little worried about young linebackers worried about their inexperience but excited about their athleticism but come Saturday the the unit that I think we need to see step up a lot is that dline particularly defensive ends um Nate matlack probably going to be the top dog there now wearing number two yeah so what do you think we can expect I would love to see them just dominate a Kent State team that should be pretty bad I know this isn't going to be Pat Jones and Rashad Weaver getting after the quarterback but I mean is there a chance that this unit is pretty good again because last year they all in all pretty pretty disappointing yeah last year they were not very good um I don't think you know I don't think the offense did the many favors but yeah like they were the worst run defense in of Pat ard's tenure um at pit and that's kind of where you don't do that the whole scheme kind of falls apart I think like there's a trickle down effect to the rest of the defense um I I think the theme of the defense for this year is like they replaced a lot of they lost a lot of experience but they got more talented um so I think I think it's it's I'm I'm bullish on them too I'll say that like I like I like the talent that they have at defensive line I think they're really deep like I don't think the fact that you see five or six defensive tackles listed as probable starters is an indication that these guys all stink and they can't find a starter I think they're like just a bunch of pretty good players there um like Francis Brew I think is is a star in the making um I think Anthony Johnson was gonna be pretty productive this year as an older guy um Isaiah Neil like gonna be a pass R specialist I really like him like I think about last year like they put in you know Devin Danielson and Tyler Bentley and David Green were bigger dudes like they were closer to 300 lbs um and like just generally slow um and I I think about the best defensive tackles from the Nardi era and it's like kijah cany and Jaylen tman who their whole thing was they're undersized but quicker um and I think pit knows how to work with guys like that I think those guys play to the scheme a little bit better um so I'm I'm bullish on them too it's it's more of a shot in the dark just because so few of these guys have real experience um but they are decidedly more talented up front um I think Nate matle I'm I'm buying a lot of stock him um he wasn't very productive at Kansas State but in a defense that I don't think played to his skills very well that's kind of why he transferred here um I had Jimmy Scott as kind of a breakout candidate going to this year he's the other starting defensive end I I'm pretty high in the defense and I think it's going to start with this defensive line being a lot better especially against the Run um and then you know you go from there like I love their linebackers like under their position that yeah they lost a lot of experience losing Solomon Shield to by the way is going to start at Texas A&M starting linebacker Solomon Shields um looking at their dub chart right now but um but like that's not the case for a lot of the guys that left the program last year we were talking about no no it is not um but like you know Kyle Lewis I think is is gonna be awesome like he he's such a good player and he's such a good athlete like I think he's gonna be really good um getting keeping some experience with Brandon George there but like just the level of athletes that they have at linebacker I think are really awesome too like that'll help the Run excuse me the run defense as well like UPF front they are just so much more athletic and I think that's a much better fit for this defense than um you know guys like a David green and a Devin Danielson and Tyler Brantley who like do not at all want to minimize like their contributions to this team like I think you know especially green and um and Danielson like those guys were not in significant portions of the 2021s and 2022 teams um but I just don't think like his starters and his full-time guys they were particularly great fits for this defense and I the guys they have now I think fit the profile of what pit wants to do much much better than what they had before so that's part of why I'm I'm higher in the defensive line and and like I said if they can if they can just be not nearly like if they can just not be the worst Rush defense in the ACC there's going to be a trickle down effect into the secondary and into the second level where they're able to rush the pass through a little bit more um they're able to to force teams to put the ball in the air and then um I think you know PJ O'Brien's gonna have a bunch of picks again this year um even you know like I said Kyle Lewis might have a bunch as well um Rasheen biles is like a crazy athlete I feel like you can pencil him in for like I guess I'm not gonna make any statistical predictions but like he's gonna be a real good like Edge rusher um coming off the coming off the side as an outside linebacker like there's going to be more opportunities for those big plays those Splash plays like sacks and tackles for loss and interceptions that um kind of the Hallmark of the pit defense like that's yeah they're going to give up some big plays I think because those Corners are so inexperienced um especially early on but you know you can get a pick every once in a while if you can get a bunch of sacks as well it'll all even out and and you'll be fine it feels like it could be a little bit of addition by subtraction because there were some veterans on that defense last year that uh Nardi was very committed to he developed he had seen the potential in them and he wanted to stick with that and they uh they might have not been the most talented players at their positions or have the most potential and maybe you know that's just because the guys that are coming up now had another year to develop and maybe they wouldn't have outperformed Kamar or Hayes or any of the defensive tackles last year but you know hearing hearing people like you people like Chris Peak so I guess specifically journalists talk about yeah yeah no the these linebackers are going to be freaky you know these young defensive tackles are are coming in hot uh it's very encouraging and it it does make me feel that even though on paper we might have gotten worse at a lot of position groups we might have Unearthed some gems on that depth chart I think so and I think the other thing is you're GNA have like we're not going to learn this weekend if like defensive tackles if for real or not like you know they could sack Kent State nine times and it really doesn't matter um so give it some time have some fun like have fun when they're you know making havoc in K State's backfield this weekend but uh reserve some judgment until Cincinnati and especially West Virginia um I'm very interested to see how these guys stack up there because those are obviously much bigger challenges but I'm I'm excited I I'm excited about youth that they have there and probably the reason why just you know if you can hold on this year if you can kind of squeak by and if you can get the whatever you know six wins or whatever you need to to keep hat off the hot seat I think you can have something really special especially on the defense on the defensive side of the ball going into 25 which is really what I mean like I I don't think I'm gonna shock anyone when I say like Pit's not competing for a national championship this year but like you are you are building for you are building for 2025 and um agree there's a lot to there's a lot to like if you think about it that way if you frame it that way can we can we interest you in giving us a record prediction uh we typically suggest journalists promise US 10 wins but you know you you take that however you'd like you know I can I can lie to you if he makes you feel better please Pat us lied to us enough today you can give us your honest thoughts well so look this this schedule is not very daunting um like I so what their win totals number was at like five and a half I think um last I checked there are at least five games that I think they should win on this schedule and this is pit so maybe they they're probably going to lose a game that they should win but they're also gonna win a game that they probably shouldn't looking at you Louisville and SMU um I I think that they are GNA win in even six games and it's gonna feel really good um you know like it's it's going to feel like things have stabilized going back to a bowl game is going to do wonders for this team um but you know the schedule doesn't look great like I'm not counting Syracuse as like a likely win but who knows what they're going to look like with a new coach um I'm not counting Louisville as a sure win but I I don't really know like they're bringing in another like seventh year transfer quarterback like yeah they lost a lot of talent too so you know who knows maybe Louisville isn't as good as I think they are they've never won at North Carolina and they got to travel to North Carolina this year but you know maybe that's one where they pull a rabbit out of a hat with North Carolina losing all the talent that they did and their quarterback situation seems pretty iffy this year so that's one that they could win as well like there is a path to maybe eight wins um I think at a Max but I am G to stick with six wins get back to a bull and you look forward to 2025 with some optimism you're GNA know who your quarterback is if that happens um I mean honestly either way you're going to know who your quarterback is at the end of this year I feel like um I guess like I don't know I guess like can't count out the fact that that maybe both holste and YN out stop but I I feel like you know if my prediction is right they get to six wins you're gonna know who your quarterback is by the end of the year and that's going to give you a ton of confidence with all the guys that you can potentially have returning um going into 2025 and you you might be able to compete for something bigger uh a year from now yeah next year we have Holstein jarnell and Nico whatever his last name was from Tennessee in the QB room battling out for the starting job is that a for do you have inside info is that a is that a report or uh I'm just putting the seeds now so I can say I was there first whenever it happens yeah Tennessee is not going to be able to pay his 8 million nil contract out but pit will we go well you know just the power of friendship is really gon to matter a lot you know exactly so Stephen you said a lot of great things very informative the one thing I disagree with is that if pit comes out Saturday and real really gives it to Ken State I will get overly excited I will disregard that Ken state is maybe the worst country and as you should as you should throw logic out the window that's what that's what Saturday's all about I mean like I you like who cares if you like overreact and like you know they aren't as good as they look against Kent State against Cincinnati like that does not matter that that is a that is a September 7th problem not an August 31st problem yes so go you have my permission to go nut squid you you can really enjoy it live it up Des been read for Heisman we'll be tweeting it Saturday night it's already in the drafts Stephen thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your insights and I don't know if he said congratulations on the new role with the post cazette you are new Noah uh a title that comes with uh many many gifts many Boons and we are very excited uh to to have you in that role and um you best be coming by the tailgate for the necessary one beer before you get up to the Press Box I will make sure to do it I appreciate you guys for having me on this was fun um hopefully we can do it again sometime are you or someone you know looking for work in a Recession Proof industry are you someone that's interested in things like having Health Care having a 401k immediate PTO acral an employee assistance program or referral payouts our newest sponsor Hadad accelerated delivery and Amazon delivery partner is looking for safety-minded and dependable drivers to join their delivery service team be a part of a company that will encourage self ownership and award bonuses based on exceptional safe and delivery efforts this is the ideal gig for individuals seeking full-time work or students interest in making some pretty good money during breaks if you are someone you know is safety focused hardworking organized efficient and team oriented text HD to 464 646 to apply I understand that that is an impossible string of letters and numbers so here it is again that's h a d d to 464 646 for a job that's the total package get it cuz like it's deliveries hat at accelerated delivery is the place for you and we're back for the first version of the 2024 loyal Sun sports book it's been a while fellas but we're back ready to set lines I'm ready to improve on my previous uh picks in this segment although I set the lines I am almost always in dead last uh if this is if you're a first time listener or first time listening to the sports book basically what we're going to do is we're going to create a few fake lines you can't get them anywhere else not on FanDuel DraftKings or any of those other promotional sites that don't give us any money to shout them out um and this is how we're going to preview the Kent State game so fellas are you ready are you have you gone through the lines have you done your research money set aside loyal points loyal Suns Point set aside we ready to go I'm ready to clean you guys again for a third year in a row yep we didn't actually follow up on a prize or a punishment the last couple years so this year we'll see we've got a few days to think of one if we don't if we don't establish it like right this moment it's not happening again well let's just do it let's just run into it and make it happen Okay so we're just not going to do it again loser pays [Music] for dinner drinks case of beer we could do better than that how about our followers tweet at us suggestions for loser punishment we've tried that too well we're going to try it again and we're going to get a good one and we're gonna confirm it via tweet Friday prior to the first game yeah prior to the first game okay and it'll be set in stone on Twitter SLX and there's no going back once it's up there that's how Twitter goes I want to set a loyal Sun Sportsbook line on the likelihood of this actually happening plus 200 yeah okay all right let's kick it off um to start it I think we have to start with the main topic of discussion the quarterbacks um who's going to be more productive on Saturday and the way we're going to grade that out is who will have more fantasy points so standard fantasy scoring I believe it's one point every 25 yards four points for a passing touchdown six for a rushing touchdown 10 for rushing yards etc etc who will have more fantasy points this Saturday between Nate Yarnell and Eli Holstein squid want to start us off oh I got to go first so I'm gonna zag here I think everyone's first thought is well all I've been hearing is how good of an athlete Eli Holstein is he's probably gonna get some rushing yards maybe a rushing touchdown good point but for some reason I think Nate yell is gonna start the game and I think he's G be throwing the ball a little bit more they're going to let jarnell air it out he might hit a deep shot to mfield get a lot of yards early and from the rest of the game they'll just go through the motions not a lot of opportunities for a lot of points so I'm going Nate Yarnell he's going to connect on a deep ball I agree with Squid I want Yarnell um I'm very much team Yarnell in all of this uh and if Holstein takes the job and is awesome I will just be pleasantly surprised um but aside from that I I agree with Squid's rationale because we don't know how they're going to be mixing them in if it's going to be drive and then a drive or two drives then two drives or a quarter and then but I think I think that they will give jarnell the benefit of actually starting the game and if they do a couple series if they let him get the first quarter he's going to be a position where he can throw the ball and if H's playing you know more drives later in the game it's more likely than not that they'll keep the keep the ball on the ground with him give him a uh a diminished Playbook uh and and yno will get more opportunities so I think he'll get more opportunities and I I do think he's probably the more game ready quarterback right now wow you both went you're now um I was kind of leaning that way early and this is where I get myself into trouble here zagging away from you two and then give up a ton of points um but I'm actually I'm gon to go Holstein I have also been team Yarnell throughout this whole process I think all of us have and we've kind of been driving that train um with today's development of this clearly being still wide open I think they're just giving us a soft launch for the eventual naming Eli Hol qb1 and come Saturday who knows he might get the majority of the snaps um other rational I can give for this is apparently he's more athletic I haven't seen that yet maybe he scampers for a rushing touchdown maybe that's the difference between Nate and Eli um but I'm gonna take Holstein here because I don't know thing the way things are moving the trajectory makes it seem like Eli is g to be qb1 when we're all said and done here okay prop number two uh we're going to go over under 15 and a half Touches for the baby cats now I'm sure all of you are wondering who are the baby cats David can you elaborate yeah so it's a placeholder nickname right now we're kicking around a few um but the baby cats would refer to the three Western Carolina Catamount transfers uh who despite being a little bit undersized for the FBS level all indic ations are that the offense will be run through them this year for some reason um and there's been quite a bit of consternation on the show about whether that's a good idea um and we're interested to see how it plays out now again we are not married to the baby cats um the WC3 the Catamount crew have all been thrown around we're working on it but this this is this is kind of the working title right now um and Dylan I believe correct me if I'm wrong but the line is set as 15 and a half Touches for the WC3 15 and a half is where we're set so sincere Le is not listed on the depth chart I believe he's banged up uh or injured whatever whatever term you want to use for not going to play because he's not physically able to um so that just leaves Raphael poppy Williams and Desmond Reed who our wonderful friend Stephen seems to think Desmond Reed might just be the number one running back on this team uh he's also listed as one of the kick returners Kenny Johnson He's listed as the punt returner so clearly going to be a pretty concerted effort to get him the ball uh so with that said I don't know he might get 15 touches himself and then we've seen a lot of a lot of hype around poppy Williams he got the single digit number five in the most recent update to the roster numbers uh so I'm going to go over here I I I think they're going to touch I think Desmond Reed's going to be involved early and often and then I think rapael poy Williams is going to find himself on the field often as well so we're saying kick returns count as touches is that the official ruling yes okay I'll say over as well yeah I agree with what Dylan said so I'm not gonna repeat him I think the other big difference is Nardi has alluded to Rodney Hammond in his injuries and being banged up pretty often almost anytime someone brings up Brodney he brings up how he gets hurt he just needs to stay healthy and they've been careful with him this uh Camp season so I would expect Des been Reed to I don't know if he's gonna quote unquote start the game as like the first running back out there but get the bulk and then once the game's in hand they'll go on to Derek Davis and down the line hopefully we see some of the younger guys too but yeah you know now that I say that I'm going to say I think Desmond Reed gets about 10 touches poy Williams might get two but I think we're going to see a lot of like the third and fourth and fifth string running backs like Jules gof H Derek Davis who knows maybe Grandpa Dan Carter as well so I'll go under TJ harvison yeah um I'm going over if including Punt and kick returns wasn't enough um I was shocked poppy Williams did not have an ore next to his name I was convinced it was going to be Kate mfield at wide receiver one Kenny Johnson at wide receiver two and then uh well I thought dejon Reynolds alone but at the very least you know maybe dejon Reynolds or poppy Williams to see Poppy Williams firmly in that wide receiver to position told me all I need to know about the way that they are going to be spoon feeding these Western Carolina guys the ball all right so we got is that is that Desmond Reed with you right now this is our co-host I know he made an appearance a few weeks ago uh he's been hanging out with his Mickey Mouse toy for most of the show but I think he wanted some screen time so he's up here on my lap right now um he actually told me he's going to go under for the for the Touches for the baby cats so all right so that's two for under and two for over we're we want to put line created by Dylan that's what they want in the sports book yeah that's what it's all about we'll collect the juice uh total yards for Kent State one of the worst offenses in the FBS last year uh over under 199 and a half total yards of offense for Kent State on Saturday uh I'll go first I'll go over um I I just think if you they'll get one early big play that's going to make a bunch of people in the stands pull their hair out and then get shut down most of the rest of the game but then I like to think our our defensive starters will be getting pulled relatively early and and they can move the ball on our our scout team if they want um so I'll go over we won't care at that point do you know how many yards wford had last year 198 126 and a lot of that was on uh the last Drive where they had a 75 yard touchdown pass when uh somebody tripped or it was OPI and it wasn't called something really weird happened for them to get that oh yeah our buddy called it the worst beat of all time yeah yeah yeah because we gave up a touchdown at the end of the game so I'm to say under and my reasoning is we have a lot of new faces there is some competition so these guys want to prove they're for real because they haven't had a taste of being a starter before so they're going to be going hard um maybe towards the end he gets a little ugly who knows I don't know a whole lot about Kent State but what I do know is I was looking up a preview for Kent State this year somebody actually made one of those h I did a little bit of research no one is high on them yet again who made a Kent State football preview just curious this is college football news and I this is just a screenshot so I can't scroll to the top and Shout Out whoever wrote this article and you'll hear why we aren't gonna belittle the Mac yeah so this guy make point we aren't belittling the Mac yeah he said Ken State's key player Tommy ulatowski he's the sophomore quarterback but in his little right up he says the team needs one quarterback and a leader to count on to keep the chains moving and ulatowski will likely get the first look he wasn't terrible last year he at least kept the mistakes to a minimum so their key player last year wasn't terrible that's what they said so I think we're going to literally suffocate them and they will not get 200 yards I think I'm going to go under as well although I did hear a quote this week that frightened me a bit uh I believe it was key Thompson David's boy from OU they asked him you know he's played Kent State in the Mac before and they asked him see B's already dis my man's already disagreeing with my pick here uh but so he said that the key to stopping Kent State was to stop the RPO I've watched yeah exactly that's what I was thinking uh and I've seen pck get burnt by rpos by a Mac team before but I'm still gonna go under because I think Kent State is just that bad God damn it all right so we got two unders and one over uh David this was a good prop you had it's an unfortunate one that we have to put on here but I think it was needed given all that we're going to be dealing with multiple quar backs new offense yeah yeah and I I I'm going to try not to read too much into this one uh but proed over under two and a half procedural penalties uh squid you hit on the head two different quarterbacks who have been splitting time in training camp in a new offense with a ton of new Personnel kind of testing things out on the Fly uh we're we're going to see some some false starts some illegal motions some probably not a lot of delays of game um if the motto play Fast score faster but a lot of movement related issues before the snap uh so I'm interested to hear your guys take on just how many of those we are going to see I'll say over I don't think three is like a ton even if you have a lot of continuity in the first game and we don't so I think we screw up a couple times but hopefully it's not like the first drive and we're not looking like chickens with their heads cut off too bad I'm gonna go over it's they're playing two different quarterbacks it's a brand new offense they're going over on this uh hopefully not too far over if we get away with yeah me too if we get if we get away with three I'll feel pretty good about how how the offense performed on Saturday over I agree with all of you it's inevitable um and if they go under I will be wildly impressed now we're on to a favorite uh it's a recurring one every week we'll do it every week uh eventually once we find out who the best players are will probably scale how many points you get for picking certain players like spoiler this pick is the first touchdown scorer of the game two years ago if you picked Izzy and he scored first you would get one point if you picked anyone else and they scored first you'd get like four and we'd all try to get creative and pick somebody other than Izzy but it would be Izzy every week so we'll see how the season goes and if there's a clear-cut touchdown guy but at this point I think it's going to be interesting to see who we think is GNA be the first touchdown scorer of the season season without any prior knowledge of what this offense looks like may I go first go for it Desmond Reed Stephen convinced me earlier they're they're running the offense through Desmond Reed um and you know what if he looks awesome I will take back all the things I've said about him being small or it being ill- fad to run our offense through uh three transfers from an 8 and4 FCS school but uh I think they get get Dez Reed on the board early you don't get any bonus points if you predict this part right but what method is it going to be a goal line carry reception long run uh give me a slip screen okay I'll go and this is just me trying to speak things into existence I know exactly where this is going Gavin Bartholomew yep please please let's get him an easy one early I don't care if we're down on the goal line maybe get him a little little catch in the flat easy walk-in touchdown or we can throw him a jump ball or any other method of him scoring shoot if they go wild cat with Bart that and he scores that way that's works too I want to see him with the ball in his hands and I want to see him in the end zone see if I was going to speak something into the existence I would say one of our receivers but I think we're going to get down close to the goal line and we're gonna use Rodney Hammond early and not often like I said earlier I don't think he's gonna get a whole lot of playing time but I think he will early yeah I think he's going to pound one in in typical Rodney Hammond fashion run over a defender or two get in the end zone just so we can be mad about him not being used enough more later in the season it's time it's time our first predictions of the 2024 season uh we we'll knock out both these in one give us obviously uh give us will pit cover right now we're looking at a line of 23 and a half and give us a final score prediction Squig can you kick us off here I can and I think I'm G to be taking an alternate line if I can find that on any of the real Sports books I think pit just wins 48 to nothing I think Ken state is G be bad and um we're just going to crush him I'm ready to get delusional let's get delusional squid I'm with you uh pit covers final score of I was going to say 42 to7 but you got me a little fired up squid I'm going to go uh 45 to3 Pit's going to win 45 to3 the National Guards going to come marching in and we're going to handle business against the golden flashes uh coach dues has entirely too much to prove this season and while I I do think we're still going to get a semi- truncated Playbook I think he is going to be little merciless love the optimism Nixon there you go I knew you were waiting all episode for that one thank you I think they do cover I don't think the Lin's big enough but I do think it's going to be a slower start I don't think we're going to be firing off on all cylinders early uh but I do think they ultimately do get a cover I think Vegas has a pretty good idea of what these things look like I'm going to go 317 uh we're going to be a little bummed with how they look in the first half offense isn't as explosive as we think but they're going to have some big explosive plays maybe a defensive or special teams touchdown mix in there pit ultimately covers we get the back door cover we're all pumped as we walk out of the stadium uh still a little disappointed with how how everything went how they started slow uh but ultimately a comfortable win over a Kent State team that is just poised to be be awful good teams win great teams cover all three of us Pi P to do both so I guess that means we're a great team God I just can't wait to be in a lot with a beer in my hand on Saturday morning man it's like my life has led up to this moment I mean if you needed any EV any more evidence that we are back we all just picked pit to cover 23 and half points we are so back football is back and the baby is pumped up these are all very uh Happy Happy screams by the way but uh he can't he can't really talk yet but I I'm starting to the more time I spend around him I can kind of tell what he's saying and he just what's he saying he just told me uh pit 12 and0 hit Royal sons of Pittsburgh signing off thanks for listening see you all Saturday let's have a good old day hail to pit