TG 1677: Germany's Elections In The East: German Politics Becoming Interesting Again

hello and welcome to the gagle W Challenge and if necessary destroy media narratives on George Samuell with me today of course is co-founder of the Gaggle Peter lavel so Peter in a few hours time we will know the results of uh two uh State elections in uh Germany and now these elections are being watched rather closely they're in the eastern part of Germany one in Saxony one in seringa and everyone is expecting the alternative for deutan party which we've talked about quite a lot over the years here at the gagle um to do rather well um the afd is expected to win in thuringia um but in Saxony they they they're running the Christian democrats very close so it could go could still they could still win that but as the polls have the Christian democrats beating them off um by uh 2% so but but coming in second place coming in second place so [Music] um that's a win that's a win and when we're talking about gaining 30% of the votes which is a huge uh chunk of the vote uh also expected to do well will be the um uh the the Sarah uh vag's Party The Bu Sarah vagen um and um so if he comes in third exactly the historic that's right the the Christian the the the three members of the traffic light Coalition are expected to absolutely get wiped out you know they may not even reach the 5% threshold okay well just before we get there how do you think the greens are going to do George what do you think we're gonna be talking about tomorrow you think green is going to be the dominant color that we're going to be talking I don't think green is going to be the dominant color I think you know any anything but Green tomorrow um now they there but a couple of interesting aspects to this um um which I mean first of all um after so many years from World War II German politics is starting to get interesting I mean you know we have this really really boring that's good and that's bad that's true um the problem is that these establishment parties have been so uh terrible and they've done so little to help uh the Germans and uh you know the German economy German self-esteem uh German industry all all all the ingredients that make uh you know for a happy prosperous Germany and remember deuts land um um what was it it was um uh um what was the currency it was um oh the the Demar the Demar Demar Demar nationalism remember that yeah the Demar exactly were that was so it was so strong that they they constantly had to re revalue revalue it normally you kind of devalue but they had to revalue it because they were just everyone was getting cleaned out by the uh the Germans so they had to actually keep raising uh the the value otherwise you know German industry would just be wiping and what happened was you know at the end of the day is and well into this century is that if you look if you look who had what where um were the toaster produced uh that people used in Bulgaria Germany where are The Toasters from in in in in Greece Germany ovens in Poland from Germany um not from France not from Italy right from Germany this is the point to you know the entire just Germany was able to suck it all in which was of course the aim of of German uh industry for the entire 20th century bumps in the road okay well that's that's the thing but because the Germans were such um an Advanced party in so many different areas particularly Pharmaceuticals that they dominated chemicals they dominated chemicals then of course the Auto industry as well become very very still very dominant uh worldwide in the Auto industry um so this is this is the German strength now that it it worked for a while and so they had this very boring politics you know Christian democrats rule for a few for a few years with their partner the free Democrats then they make way for the social Democrats they rule for a few years also with the free Democrats and so it went on um it was kind of like you know just different beard Brands you know I mean it was the same drink everyone it just but that's but no one really worried because it it works the formula works so you know why why why if it ain't broke you know why fix it um but clearly it's not working uh in Germany anymore and and and it's been clear now at least since um the rise of the afd which is actually quite recent I think it's only you know just a little more than 10 years since it it emerged on the scene um that the German political system has been completely um upended and now with this this party of uh Sarah vagen um you know that that's it's clearly that something very important is uh going on in Germany and particularly kind of a populism of the left and a populism of the right and as we discussed when we talked about SAR vag a few days ago there there's a there's a meeting ground uh between populist left and populist right they they exactly that's the the Horseshoe Theory which is um they they obviously both subscribe to social conservatism uh they they both uh subscribe to um a uh a foreign policy that is you know basically could say peace policy basically Germany should not be at War and immigration and immigration exactly um and so I just want to show you a few things about the uh the coverage because the coverage is clearly getting very very anxious um uh in Politico George our favor yes of course we're going to see Politico but in this case it's not in appropriate because Politico is owned by Axel Springer who's the kind of the uh the kind George and I don't we don't consult beforehand okay so not like an inside joke okay and look at this headline it's in Politico today Putin's next coup you know you could have written this headline you know let me let me think what what headline should I write today about this upcoming uh election in Germany Putin it's all about Putin elections in three East German states are likely to usher in Russ friendly parties giving the Kremlin a foothold once again a foole once again I like I love the once again I mean I guess the once again is good is that the DDR I think it must be the DDR I mean otherwise I don't I don't I don't get it I don't get it if it's not the DDR it must be the DDR but everybody the DDR was a separate country but anyway yes Putin wasn't in power when the DD exactly wasn't in him power I mean they go on endlessly that he was in he was then in the KGB but he was a very Junior officer I mean this was 1989 I mean it's hard to remember this is now uh 35 years ago so it's a long long time ago he you know it didn't really matter what he thought in 1989 nobody cared what he thought about exactly that's right um so then he goes on Vladimir Putin may be smarting over Ukraine's surprising C into Russia's coast region this month but this weekend he likely to be celebrating territorial gains farther west territorial game um in Germany this this is this is desperation it really is it really is that's right um but but it's it's a a particular kind of genre of Journalism well we don't know what to write so why don't we just write about Putin uh you know it's like you know I'm out of ideas so why don't we just sort of say Putin's very happy today you know why I no know everything's going in Putin's Direction I mean then you know so great we've got we've got an article yeah Putin derangement syndrome reliable very reliable exactly Russia friendly parties across three Eastern German states Brandenburg Saxony and thuringia are poised to score substantial gains in Regional elections in September two of which are set for Sunday now again they're always saying this Russia friendly you know they all there always again there's nothing there's not particularly friendly with Russia it's like when they say Orban Russia's best friend in Europe again however many times he repeats you know I'm no friend of Russia I don't I don't particularly like Russia none of my supporters like Russia it doesn't matter they're going to keep saying um is it Russia friendly the pro Russian it's now we got the pro Russian Al alternative for Germany has a strong chance of finishing first in all three states with the recently formed leftist Sara vagen conect Alliance surging Moscow stands to reestablish a strong foothold across a broad s of former the former East Germany at Region it dominated for decades during the Cold War and as you said region it was a country yeah exactly it was a country came mind it was also recognized people forget that from you know starting in the 1970s almost all countries in the world recognized East Germany as a state even West Germany didn't it didn't actually formally recognize it but they did have kind of de facto diplomatic relations they met reg you know the the chancellor of West Germany and the East German leader met regularly discussed all kinds of issues so it wasn't quite at the level of state-to-state relations but nonetheless he was recognized as an independent state and it's one again one of these kind of um um gray areas okay there wasn't formal recognition but there was a recognition of legitimacy and so and and that's the that's the way you move forward when when you have an impass like that and and and plus you know for for both East Germany for the DDR and West Germany it was like something that will be resolved in the future okay not in the meantime in the mean me time you know we can discuss economic relations and that was a very big deal People to People relations people exact and People to People relations yeah um and then all told the Moscow friendly parties which St friendly maybe they're they um critiques of the status quo parties right and that's the point and that you know that both of these both both the alternative for deand and the buis Sara vagen you know they are united in the idea that this is absolutely contrary to Germany's interests to be in a war with Russia that that's nothing to do with Moscow friendly not friendly to Moscow it's about yeah that this is an absolute disaster for Germany to be going down this path and that it needs to be brought to an end immediately um and I am and clearly a lot of people in Germany think that I mean that that's this isn't just some minority they want to present oh this is some minority taste no it's actually it's it's a very significant uh Germany the author or authors of this piece they kind of let the cat out of the bag how did this article start George the incursion into the ksk region right okay you know that means a lot to Russians today in 2024 you know what George he means a lot to Germans in 2024 that's right um so which straddle the far right and left of the political Spectrum are expected to capture at least 50% of the vote across the regions in one state Singa the parties are forecast to fetch as much as 65% with the afd finishing first on 30% um so so that's kind of um you know pretty pretty pretty decent performance though not all of the parties are as overtly pro-russian as the afd they have in common two narratives by the far right that NATO shares the blame for the war in Ukraine and that a peaceful solution would have been possible if only the West were serious about diplomacy those two two reasonable arguments I mean these have TR has traction because they are backed up by empirical facts back up exactly this is not an ideological push the way the world should be the way the world we'd like it to be that the fact fact of the matter is these two narratives are um based in and in facts that are knowable and are reason no you're absolutely right and that's why when they say this is pro- Russian there's nothing Pro Russian about this they're not saying well you know I really like Russia you know I I I really like the you know the Russian language Russian culture I love the Russian form of government they're not saying any of that they're just saying that this is this war is a really bad um idea um it it should never have happened and that a peaceful solution was possible very early on um Germany's mainstream governing parties at the national level the social Democrats the greens and free Democrats have been relegated to also ran status with polls forecasting a cumulated result result of about 12% in Saxon and 12% well from ear to ear oh God you the there I can't think of three political parties that four uh they deserve this most okay no that's right and then they say 27% in Brandenburg keep in mind Brandenburg that's Berlin Berlin has always been the Social Democrat stronghold that you know it's famous for for being the stronghold of Social Democrat so 27% in Brandenburg is an absolute Calamity total humiliation for the uh the social Democrats even when including Germany's largest Centrist Force the Conservative Christian democrats the combined polling of the mainstream parties doesn't exceed 50% that's the mainstream the entire mainstream doesn't exceed 50% that's an extraordinary decline for the Centrist parties that have shaped Eastern Germany's political life since uh reunification in the early 1990s West German establishment forces effectively colonized the East dispatching their own political veterans to run Saxony and other states even today more than 40% of the top tier political class in Germany's eastern states hail from the West this is very important to remember because you know the reunification was pressed by Helmut Cole and so that's why the Christian democrats did actually extremely well in in the elections immediately after the reunification because they Associated it with Helmut Cole and that's why this rejection of the Christian democrats is hurts so much because that's it they've lost their uh their standing uh in the East um and then here we have um you know none of these articles which talk about Putin actually address some of the issues that maybe people are concerned about in Germany um so so there was recently but a few days ago the stabbing by some islamist from Syria um it in singan in at at a a fair celebrating diversity imagine you have a fair celebrating diversity and then some some crazy guy stabs three people uh three people who there three liberal Germans liberal Germans who who care deeply about diversity Coalition Germany to hard weapons laws and Asylum rules after zing and stabbing coalition government hopes tough action will prevent farri victories in the forthcoming State elections so that that's the only thing they're concerned about you know the farri is going to exploit this Germany has some pretty hardcore weapons laws on the books I don't know what the point of this article is okay it's not addressing why the stabbing came about okay right that that exactly um and so Germany's fractur coalition government has announced a hard forward compromise on changes to weapons laws and Asylum rules designed to prevent islamist attacks such as last Friday's mass stabbing that left three people dead so they're not going to address immigration no no they well they basically say Asylum rules they're just panicking I mean again as with um in other countries they they don't think that this is just an out outragers they're just worried about the far right the far right is going to exploit this yeah but George Asylum rules is when if you get there migration law is to make sure people don't get there that's why I'm yeah I agree absolutely three days before Key State elections but in which each of the ruling parties risk heavy losses to the far right government ministered said the knife Rampage allegedly by a Syrian Asylum Seeker at a street festival in the western city of zingan had exposed critical weaknesses in the country's immigration and security policy you needed that to happen to realiz that's right are they serious yeah and again you know this is you know on top of many many many previous incidents so it's not it's it's not like oh this just came out of the blow and it's just a a freak of nature and this is you know there been any number of stabbings um attacks um on people people uh kind of mass kind of sexual assault on on on German women um which is why these things just explode the public anger explodes over this um the measures call for the swifter deportation of refused Asylum Seekers Swift a deportation but that's the whole point they refused and then they just continue to stay in the country I mean it doesn't matter that you know you go through the whole lengthy appell process and then you it's finally rejected but you still stay no one actually enforces the deportation order yeah come by our office in the morning okay yeah okay sure we'll do yeah um and um so measure call for Swifter deportation of refus sonom seekers and the removal of financial benefits for those who have already been registered in another EU member country so that's nice so you get you you registered some other EU member but you get you get your financial benefits in German because the German benefits are probably a lot more generous than some so if you register I don't know in Slovenia um you know your best bet is to get get your um your benefits in Germany um I guess that kind of gives a new definition to Welfare Queen yes welfare shopping um in a policy Mass Market tabloid build called bed bread and soap referring to the bare minimum Provisions that will be accorded doesn't sound like um you know it'll be bad minimum so bed bread and soap um and um and then it says the suspect in zingan who allegedly killed three and injured eight had been due to be returned to Bulgaria last year but was not at his shelter when he was about to be picked up yeah this the honor System really works doesn't it yes somebody called him we we we'll we'll be right down to pick you up to take you to Bulgaria right okay I I'll be here um lucky Bulgaria you know what what have they done to deserve you know this this person dumped on them um Asylum Seekers will also be barred from taking holidays in their countries of origin the Justice Minister soar apparently Asylum Seekers then take holidays in their countries of origin th this applies in to ukrainians ukrainians come collect their welfare and then they go back see their parents and their friends in Ukraine then come back collect keep collecting their welfare checks um they so taking their holidays the Justice Minister Marco Bushman of the center right uh free Democrats said this stood in clear contradiction to the claim their home countries are not safe huh these people are really they're on the ball this is so embarrassing I mean yeah yeah I mean I mean is what is the caliber of Justice ministers in Germany not not very high not very high apparently no um I mean basically all they have in their minds is well we have to stop the far right but they don't have any other ideas you know they're not they're not at all concerned about you know how do we improve the lives of Germans you know they just you know they they're full of this absolute nonsense in their heads of globalism and all all the rubbish that they pick up um and then suddenly something comes along that disturbs their peace like you know the the alternative for Dutchland and then they they start running around trying to figure out what are we going to do what we got to do something only in rare cases would such travel be allowed such as a family funeral but there's another but there is a problem no no no either you're an asylum Seeker or you're not exactly okay if you want to go to your funeral you're no longer an asylum seeker and don't apply again we got your number don't we don't want to see you again it's either an asylum Seeker or not you're absolutely right exactly you you can't just say you absolutely know don't have a family funeral it's like it's the same with when you you know you know you're in a um the A Witness Protection Program like the police give you a witness protection program that's it you're in the program you can't go back to your you know your your mother's funeral or anything like that you that you cut it yourself off completely because if you're seeking Asylum that means you you face the threat of death you know if you go back so you can't you can't do it um the penalty for violations would be the loss of Asylum status but then you can also appeal I imagine you you can appeal your loss of Asylum status and then during the appeal you retain your Asylum status so you know so you don't really lose anything Bushman said tens of thousands of asylum seekers in Germany could not be sent home or to the EU country where they were registered simply because they could not be located at the time of scheduled deportation and this is you going to blame this on the far right but can you imagine the you're basically saying you've completely lost control of the situation you are the Justice Minister and you're saying well tens of thousands of Asylum seekers in Germany cannot be sent home or to EU country where they were registered which is where they're supposed to be I mean if if that's where you're registered you're supposed to be in that country you're not supposed to be in Germany simply because they could not be located at the time of scheduled deportation so so what what exactly do you do here you're you're the Justice Minister and then basically these people are just making making a laughing stock out of you saying well yeah I mean I'm I've got other things to do I'm I'm having you know an omelette at the local calf um you so I'm not here when when the the deportation officers AR well I mean what is it you know you know I wasn't here because I was in another EU country picking up my benefits I'm sorry I was late okay uh um I had to take a taxi by the way you know taking the train not they didn't walk they didn't take a horse okay and I like it you know you don't know you know omelet with um with caviar and that's that's right nothing uh noting the CH charged atmosphere around migration and security issues since last week's attack Ana haiduk a minister in the economy Ministry representing the greens at the news conference said the Coalition wanted to focus on integrating foreign citizens and preventing extremism well good luck with that I mean you've been doing magnificent job with that you know I I I very rarely invoke the words of Angela Merkel because they're it's not warranted but she did say that famous speech I don't know I think it was uh something like 2012 or something like yeah something like 20124 culturalism has failed yeah you're right Anga you're right but Merkel said many many things and then and then she just went back on them I mean she you know it's like there was never any consistency in anything that uh that that she said yeah she said that and then she continued pursuing the um the multiculturalism and then in 2015 she just you know threw open the doors of Germany um to migrants um and um haiduk said the government's internal debate had been quote Guided by the principle that the basic right to Asylum in our country must be protected it it was Guided by that yeah but I mean can there be a caveat here uh has been quote Guided by the principle that the basic right of asylum in our country must be protected while at the same time recognizing the need needs of of the citizens own locally born whatever the term you want I mean can you at least balance that no no they they never do I mean that's right and that's when I mean when um analina bbok famously said that I'm not really interested in what the German people think I'm only interested in Ukraine she was just letting the cat out of the bag basically that's that's the way the greens think we don't we're not interested in what ordinary Germans think you know just they just they have as much contempt for them as kind of their equivalent in the United States or in the UK for their own people I mean what do they matter the the the stupid how do how do you say German deplorables in German you know I'm not sure they're probably some very graphic expression yeah and it probably doesn't sound nice no I don't think it does um she said it was important to push back against the general suspicion against people due to that background well you see the problem with that is that you know most of the crimes most of the particularly the sexual crimes are being committed by migrants So when you say oh we have to push back but you know the the numbers are are so Stark that most of these crimes uh and particularly these sexual crimes or sexually violent crimes are committed by migrants that's why people are very upset about it so to say well just because of that background yeah but there's a you know the they seems to be a very neat uh correlation between migrants and crimes but she said this horrible attack showed us that it is crucial to take action to bolster security H and particularly as it's you know just a few days before this election after how many millions and millions and millions of people have entered the country um uh claiming Asylum we must take action to take action list we must take action it is time to to act um and then so now we have Chancellor Schulz our friend Sergeant Schulz said it is time to start deporting Afghan Nationals Germany ger Deport again two days before an election Germany deports Afghan Nationals for the first time since 2021 as Key State elections Loom well I can see 20 those 28 people unlucky Afghans two days before an election they call my number [Laughter] why Germany has deported Afghan Nationals today back to their home country for the first time since August 2021 when the Taliban returned to power 28 people were deported Stefan Heber the German government spokesperson described the Afghan Nationals as convicted criminals the deportations came a week after a deadly knife attack in zingan where the suspect is ass Syrian citizen who had applied for Asylum and reportedly disappeared and avoided deportation Germany does not have diplomatic relations with the Taliban the move to resume the return of Afghans comes ahead of closely watched elections on Sunday in saxonia I assume what what happened Germany offered the money for the Taliban because otherwise the Taliban wouldn't take them I mean for the Taliban to take them back if I mean if that's what happened it seems that that's what happened they said okay fine we'll take the 28 Germany had to pay them a bribe otherwise most most governments will say well we don't want them what what do we want these criminals for uh we got enough criminals of our own um and so the governments usually say no so the only way they would say yes if is if you pay them a hefty bribe and that's how Germany always operates I mean like um with erdogan you know the ERD you know threatens to unleash 3 million migrants on Europe unless Germany coughs up some money so you know that that that's how they operate the fir wall against the German far right is crumbling by entrenching itself in small towns alternative for Germany is winning over SES of the countries again this is really interesting how they always use these War metaphors you know entrenching themselves you know that's right it's like they have trenches now the language just tells you everything about their whole world view that's right and and the wall the wall is crumbling so you know the aggress from the outside nearly 35 years after the Burling wall a jagged political Schism runs through the country tracing the former border between East and West Germany on the east side of the Divide theyd is surging despite its growing radicalism and persistent warnings from mainstream leaders that it is an extremist even Nazi party they was have the put this in the Nazi party um then so the D and um The Surge in support for the afd comes despite the fact that state level domestic intelligence authorities have classified the local branches of the party in both Saxon and turingia as extremist organizations aiming to undermine German democracy and again you wonder why are domestic intelligence authorities getting involved in domestic political elections well I mean I mean you know I would think that nominally speaking the intelligent Services would do an investigation and present it to the political authorities and the political authorities would say well based on this information we find these PE these to be political extremist I mean I don't understand why the intelligence Community gets to make that decision I don't I don't understand that unless it's passed down and says I want you to make I want you to determine that these people are extremists do you see what I mean right but again I don't understand what extremist means I mean it's like you know what how how how do intelligence authorities make this determination that it's extremist I mean that seems like a political decision yes to say that some somebody is an extremist not something that an intelligence agency supposed to determine well wouldn't you think that analina barbach when saying she doesn't care what the German electorate thinks I mean that's a very extreme position that's a very extrem Focus beyond that I mean she she is she with in her own word she undermined democracy in Germany so if you're going to disregard the Democratic will of the electorate then you're beyond the political system and you therefore you're a threat to it right that's right that's exactly right the crumbling firewall the leaders of Germany's mainstream parties are mindful of the fact that Adolf Hitler was initially able to rise to power at The Ballot Box and that conservatives then help then helped normalize the Nazis by partaking in Coalition governments with them first in Eastern State of thoring and later on a national level this is such an a corny stupid argument it's always trotted out about how you know hit Hitler's uh you know rise to power which absolutely of no relevance whatever um because he never you never you never really achieved any of this got to be the maximum he ever attained was 33% and his support was already in Decline he was he was he was collapsing the support was already collapsing um by the time and everyone Hitler and the Nazi party they did not uh win electorally they did not come to power through The Ballot Box no Adolf Hitler was appointed Chancellor appointed he didn't he was an elected Chancellor right he was that's right he was he was appointed Chancellor um and through through a kind of political maneuverings um but also he was you know he was basically a very violent extremist uh party they did indeed afterwards seize power but do doesn't mean every single every political party that that that gets into power is then going to seize power I mean you know oh well right now we're going to seize power when when you know what's what's the basis of thinking that the afd has any intention of using violence in order to seize power well and also if you look at the Memoirs of someone like gurbles when uh when Hitler was appointed Chancellor they were it shattered their world view they no no no we want to take power by force want to win through their democracy we don't want this is not this is never the plan to do that they were absolutely shocked that they were made the legal dictator I mean and then that reinforced just how corrupt the system was in their minds I mean it reinforced it okay but J is absolutely right I mean we I don't see the alternative for Germany a threatening to take power if they don't win their election I mean give me the evidence if you have exactly where's the evidence where's the evidence at all that they they in any way advocating violence that they've ever um engaged in violence that they're planning to Outlaw other political movements or whatever there's no evidence for it this is G oh well the Nazis did this therefore this is what they're going to do the Nazis made it clear over and over again they wanted to come to power to destroy democracy right right um it's in order to avoid a repeat of that history that mainstream parties now vow to maintain a brand M or firewall around the afd refusing to include them in coalition governments or for that matter to cooperate with the party on passing any kind of legislation so this is the the the position that so many of the mainstream parties are taking um in a number of countries I mean obviously in France as well which is we will not cooperate this is an extremist party you know we we will form a coalition government that deliberately excludes them why they think that that's comes to mind Sweden comes to mind as well exactly um but but ultimately it's it's not a successful strategy because it just leads to greater and greater anger and frustration and eventually will lead indeed lead to some kind of violent explosion if People's votes just basically don't count for anything you got 34 35% of the vote and it just doesn't count for anything um anyway it goes on the leaders of the afd however intend to knock down the firewall by making it impossible to avoid working with the party in small towns if elected repres Representatives need to cooperate with the afd to do things as mundane as repairing roads and schools their thinking goes the mainstream parties will one day be forced to work with the party on more sweeping policy issues and then um and then then it says here due to the afd's popularity in local politics across the East the firewall has in many ways already fallen between 2019 and 2023 there were more than 120 cases of cooperation in local government between the afd and mainstream parties um most often with the CDU um but I mean what what exactly is examples of that cooperation include a case in Saxony where mainstream parties in in one Town Council supported an afd motion to forbid the use of gender neutral language in advertising for the town's theater uh in another instance in theing mainstream Pary supported an afd motion to hold a vote on a leftist mayor's dismissal and then we have the usual the from a local politician the firewall at the country level no longer exists and this will only get worse I'm really scared that it's going to get even darker I sometimes look for parallels with the 1930s wow that is so original I mean I you know I sometimes look for parallels with the 193 no no one else has ever said that yeah but see the problem with using that I mean it this was this is up there with Munich right I mean this is that's right it's unfortunate that so many of these historical uh um uh myths are associated with Germany but we'll talk about that in another time but the Lo the illogic use of the it's 1932 but see if we if you have Democratic elections and you have democratic election outcomes and then you you um um dismiss them right diminish them then you actually create the conditions for 1932 see they don't get this is of argument people don't get if if if it is 1932 and you act like 1932 you're gonna get 1932 right no that that's that's exactly right and and and and the same thing applies uh when they talk like this in the in the United States oh this is like 1932 you know with Trump you know Trump is Hitler you know we're g you know therefore we have to take Trump off the ballot we have to pre you know prevent Trump from anyone voting for Trump well yeah then you know you're basically ignoring the wishes of half the electorate how have you in any way Advanced the cause of democracy on the contrary you have demolished democracy because so many people are not just going to be ignored they know you can't just ignore a large percentage of your population and say well we we don't care what you think because you are deplorables or stupid and whatever that isn't going to work uh but this is oh well Hitler you know you just you just this this mindless idea that this is how you end all discussion just you know bring up Hitler and also again I don't want to belabor the point but the way the vermar Republic was designed parliamentary in in its parliament in its rules it was inherently weak okay and it demonstrated that all through the 1920s and then with the catastrophe of the rise of the Nazis German democracy since the second world war is a fundament different characterization as a matter of fact it's a very strong democracy okay and then that's one of the things that the Germans in the postwar era up until like 15 minutes ago were extremely proud of okay and now be be because the the the powers that be and their um um incredibly poor governance driven by an ideology that just alienates people in droves you know they're willing to throw that all away well why don't you change your policies right that that's what's the problem here it's not democracy is threatened it's it's poor governance yeah no they that that's exactly right I mean and and really the um the the the dissatisfaction goes very deep I mean we obviously we touched on immigration um but there is the the issue again of the foreign policy that's that's a very that's a very serious issue a lot of lot of real dissatisfaction then there's a pol the energy policy which has really uh destroyed uh German economic competitiveness um and then of course there's the you know all the various um uh you know cultural issues which again the Germans are not not at all happy with it much much like um everyone else so you're really thinking in terms of the the you know and again there's the the issue of the the nordstream um that that's still kind of bubbling below the surface Sara vagen said we are going to have an inquiry into what happened um with nordstream and said if the German government knew ahead of time that he was going to be destroyed and that seems to be the official admission that they knew ahead of time then this is a really the biggest scandal in German history so that's that's something still down the road as to uh you know a kind of a reckoning in Germany well George I mean one of the things um that I think is very I mean this is almost to the point of being absurd so you let in millions and millions of people from Afghanistan from Libya from Syria um I'm not going to judge the character of a whole people that's an absurd thing to do but I what is absurd is to have this Dei this wokeism so you bring in the millions of people and we're gonna say we're all gonna use the same toilet together agreed okay and a man is a woman and a woman is a man you're You're Expecting these people to go along with your agenda it's pretty hard to get kind of you know 10 generations of Europeans from you know Switzerland or France or Germany to go along with that and then you're bringing an entirely alien culture and saying you know um uh what you know um good evening sir what is your sexual orientation today I me you see the ab it absolutely is absur and that's why when we're talking about that um that um that German politician earlier who said oh we need integration well how can you have integration when you have multiculturalism you have Dei and you you know you're supposed to you know respect everybody's uh you know culture and and so on well how are you going to integrate I mean you you know if you're going to integrate you say Hey you have to be like us no an Zips and butts that's that's that's what integration means otherwise yeah they're going to be they're going to say this is really you know I mean you know these sexual assaults why do these sexual assault happen well because a lot of these people come from Muslim countries they see European women in in the summer you know wearing almost no clothes they think hey these are these are basically prostitutes you know that you know we you know free we free free hand there and this completely different way of looking at things but see to compound that and of course George and I are poor sexual violence that's that needs doesn't need does not even need to be said here however to to continue my argument I mean if you know I'm just expressing myself this is my um um my view of the world and I have the freedom of sexual uh I have sexual Freedom you're saying that to people that are going to well okay then I can rap people I mean the this message is is so convoluted you're expecting people to conform to something you're say but there is no cultural we there are no Norms there are no cultural value they're all relative they're all relative my values are are for me I'm not going to impose them upon George how can I do that okay and then you get this the the same message from an immigrant from Afghanistan well well you know in our culture we abuse young boys okay I'm I'm just I'm just taking your values per se and applying them in your country yeah no that that that's exactly right and I think that's why um when they have this multiculturalism it's supposed to be yeah well basically um you know everyone has their own distinct moral uh view they have their own um cultural norms and you know no one has any right to impose um their own cultural norms on anyone else so they come to um a country like Germany as I say which is you know very you know you know it's a very much a European country a contemporary European uh country where the the Norms are very much not in a Accord with the Norms of most of the rest of the world I mean you know where where again as I said um you know you know women just walk around you know freely and um uh you know in in a uh you know you know in a in a way that we we in the west just have now take this for granted we didn't even you know wasn't even the norm 50 years ago but now we accept it as a norm they come here from Afghanistan and what do they conclude hey well this is you know we can we can just have a a good time hence the sort of the the the con the sexual assaults which which are part of now in much of Europe where again women often just say we feel threatened you know this is you know in Germany and Sweden in France women you know you can go on YouTube and how many women record um little kind of little monologues in which they say I I am afraid to go out of my house you know I'm con constantly afraid of assault yeah and and they and they um as a result they're afraid of the rise of the far right right I mean for me this is just a completely absurd I mean if if you have policies to protect your own people you probably have better standing in your in your political system but if you just don't care and you and and I mean I don't know I I guess they don't understand the Absurd humor you know the guy wasn't there when we were supposed to well that's that's right well that's that's right on but again it's it's very interesting because and when when we read these things I me just as when we talk about the UK and also about the rise of the far right and the far right far right what's remarkable is the lack of any real interest in the victims you know whether it's the victims of stabbings victims of uh killings uh bombings um and George what were what were the names of the three little girls that were killed exactly nobody knows nobody knows no that's right the only thing matter oh the far right is exploiting this you know that that's all that matters all the far right you don't care about does anybody care that those three little girls are not going to go to a dance class again that they're never going to go on a date they're never going to get married they're never going to have children right that their grandparents are not going to be able to um um be with them in the late last years of their life nobody cares about those three little girls nobody does okay but we all seem to know who the guy who was involved in it that's right exactly yeah and and the same app play you know because after all there were a number of people who went who were in the class some of whom were stabbed very seriously and you know will probably have life um you know altering injuries that they sustained as a result of the stabing these people in southp they're not going to be going to any more dance classes you know and because you know the government isn't going to say you know in future we will provide extra police for for dance classes no there's no you know no there no no extra security for future dance are those injured children going to get medical care uh to deal with their um um afflictions and and injuries for you know you have to go back to the line and National Health back to the line yeah yeah yeah exactly National Health Service sorry you know if there's a backlog at at the NHS so forget forget getting any special treatment George is absolutely right you know what about the victims of all of this okay and and but they they they want to talk about how uh we have to have an open Society we have to be tolerant and all that they never talked about the victims of that and what's even more um and depressing is that they are unwilling to change their policies to address these issues okay look look multiculturalism as it's been practiced in the west is an utter catastrophe for for basically for everybody involved except for those that are enacting the policies that live in in their polies okay that never see the effects of it okay so exactly they never see the effects of it Geor and I you know you know this far right thing I'm just up to let's let's just take it face value you know a kind of a nominal mean meaning of what far right is okay let's have a let's have a derisive one okay then why are people that way why do people feel that way they never address that issue right yeah no no no no no never never do um and again then they because if you think about the the afd it almost all of it is to do with um migrants I mean that that's basically the one that they' well why is that why is that such an extreme position because when they say hey um you know I don't think we should just be importing Millions upon millions of people who have nothing in common with us who have no interest in us are by and large are just hostile to us other they like they like the the welfare payments but they don't like anything else about uh our country why are we doing this why are you replacing the German uh population with uh people from all over the world and they asking and the moment you ask such questions that already is that is a horrific extremism you know you can't go around saying things like that well other things that you can't go around and say is it just you know basically for bodden is that East Germany the DDR was a relatively successful State okay now there was the stazi and all that okay fine I get it okay but you know these people for a pretty small piece of territory pretty small population but they ranked pretty high in industrial output on the the medals table at the Olympics I mean ex um uh um uh education I mean it you know it's one of the things I talk with my German friends about is that the DDR was not successful because it was Communist it was successful because it was German okay again German but it also goes back to something that's very important which is that that government that you know valter ulri and then Eric H they they didn't they they Protected Their Own people I mean they didn't start importing people from the rest of the world I mean and that's a very important thing you know when you when you're looking at the quality of your political leaders are you protecting the people uh over whom uh you preside or are you just allowing them to be overwhelmed um by You Know M Millions upon millions of people from the rest of world basically being replaced and that's why I think you know if you look back and now in retrospect you say well at least that's what you know you may not have liked Walter ulri but at least he protected his people well that's a lot more than Angela Merkel and Sergeant Schulz have done and and it was German George right it was something that they were very proud of all right I mean if again kind of looking at this at 30,000 fet you have a country for decades that was occupied East and West right and both of them as separate entities but of the same Nation were remarkably successful and I think that that that that's a Heritage and a legacy that is not uh lost upon people particularly in the East I mean I I I talk to people from the East they just thought would just be richer would just be rich we'll this be rich like we'll be the same people but we'll just be richer no they didn't realize that the the floodgates would be opened and the the culture and um Society they have would be fundamentally changed and that's what 2024 is all about in this election cycle in Germany at least yeah no well no I mean I think it's it's the same in the number of countries I mean we had the Europe an elections and we had French elections I think the British elections in all of these elections this issue came up um and the um the elites the uh the the authorities absolutely ran same basic plan attack the farri attack the extremists and we're going to keep power to ourselves and and these strange extremist they're going to be kept out and that's what they did I mean that's what they did in Britain that's what they did in France that's what they did in the European election oh this is good these are good results you know Ula F their line yeah she's back um you know good you know and you know macron yeah he's back but you still have the same same anger that you haven't address and is going to keep B bubbling along and until you begin to address what this widespread discontent is about well you know what they're really afraid of is these people that uh that they and hate so much they actually might be able to govern they don't want to give them that chance that's right that's right right right everybody this is the gagle with Peter and George we're on locals so please go to the go. locals.com this is Sunday it's uh the 1st of September uh we'll reconvene tomorrow for our live stream live stream 10 a.m. eastern time please join us come with all kinds of questions and comments you know we're always very welcome particular it's always nice when we begin and there already a list of questions um that we can address that's always stimulating for us so uh please join us and then on Tuesday I do the uh live stream solo now you know there's the issue of the tip jar you you know what the problems there are the you know these this these ferocious dogs very very angry taking their anger out on me um so if you have a few Bob in your pocket whip them out dunk them in the tip jock see if we can calm them down we're very grateful for all of your help friend W he's he's not in a good mood not a happy camper we're very grateful for all of your help friendship and support the more you're able to donate the more of these videos we can make the more we can improve the technology and above all going to get you know more even tempered dogs in the future which is be quite remarkable so remember if you like the Gaggle please like share and subscribe see bye