the Prime Minister has flagged he's prepared to water down the power of His proposed environmental Watchdog in a bid to get new legislation through Parliament the new EPA could be stripped of its decision-making role and work only as a compliance Watchdog labor is hoping to secure the Coalition support to get the changes through the Senate before the election if labor does a dirty deal with the Liberals to further weaken our already weak environment and climate laws labor will lose any shred of Environ and credibility it still thinks it has if there is a dirty deal the Liberals the next man will have to be involved in some way the shadow environment Minister Jonathan dunam who I'm sure is thrilled with that introduction thank you for your time uh this potential deal if you like or watering down is is this a key element to you is this a concession that would make you more likely to support the legislation well Tom certainly making laws the best they possibly can be was the Central aim of what we've been trying to do uh and I would point out that there's a long way to go before the Coalition was in a position to say they were prepared to do a deal on these flawed laws um and the reason for that is we were promised we'd have new environmental laws replacing the existing ones in by the end of last year we don't and instead all we're talking about here is a new bureaucracy labor called it a tough Co cop on the beat but they're now apparently willing to water it down to really just be nothing more than to name and logo change it rather makes a mockery of their agenda here but look there were a lot of problems we highlighted and we'll work through the issues they've come back to us with but a lot of work to do in order for any deal to be done where where's it at I mean are you in Earnest conversations actually trying to get on the same page or for now is it sort of sound bites from across the country oh it's probably a bit of both Tom I mean uh we we have spent many hours over many months drafting amendments to these laws provided them to government we've worked with stakeholders who have expressed extreme concerns about what was proposed so we've in good faith attempted to make this the best possible outcome but uh as I said there is a long way to go and you've got a minister making decisions using laws well outside of what we're discussing here which are killing off projects anyway so it all sort of becomes a bit of a joke get that in a moment but when when you say a bit of both have you like have you met personally with Tanya PC and you're going through things or you bit before no no I've met with Tenya directly we had a good Frank conversation around where we were at and the issues we had um and of course I know the Australian greens are very keen to do a deal as well this is about a government taking this responsibility seriously not just getting a bill through the parliament to say they've chalked up a win in the environment portfolio as it stands today the bill has no friends no one's willing to support it and that is on the government as a general rule it's an interesting concession this one because I know politicians love to say oh get it out of the hands of bureaucracy but they generally make independent decisions they're not trying to win over voters is what I'm saying politicians are trying to win over voters that's just the reality and that can Lear lend itself to short-termism you want a minor Pro because it means jobs now and people vote for them longer term might be an environmental issue but not as you know that might not be as as urgent a seeming issue do you understand why why it can't just be in the hands of a minister well I I tend to think also that politicians who are elected at a federal level every three years and government's turfed out off the back of bad policy and bad decisions as we've seen fairly frequently uh you cannot I don't think Outsource completely to someone who gets paid every Fortnight regardless of what they do and how well they do it someone who could well be an activist as well with no capacity to be removed from their position which is what the current laws uh outline I think that is very dangerous um and the environment protection authority that the government have proposed is all about environment Environmental Protection it doesn't actually weigh in economic and social considerations to decision making proc just on that on the gold mine that's that's got a lot of attention that's um at least at this stage being rejected by by the minister do you maintain it's that the procet that's broken here that the priority that the coalition says is going to one group in this particular decision one uh local indigenous group well how could good process turn out a result where the state planning Authority the State Environmental Protection Authority the state Minister and labor Premier all agree that this project should get up you've got the orange ABD and land Council and warer Elder Roy RC all saying this process is broken because it didn't actually place wait where it needed to instead the minister has cited with 18 people who claim to have authority indigenous authority over this area and frankly incorrectly so uh it it beggar belief that we've had a mind go through all State Federal Environmental approvals including ones relating to Aboriginal cultural heritage and now we have a minister knock it on the head on that basis alone the process we did have the orange the so the local group the wery traditional owners Central West Aboriginal Corporation we did have them about a year ago say they were confused why the orange land Council changed his position from neutral to support so that's not quite clear what happened there we also had this same group um oppose a go-kart track now that was stopped at the last minute from going ahead by Susan Lee so doesn't this show that these concerns do come up and ministers do act Coalition ones labor ones as well so a couple of things the orange aigin land Council had their concerns managed they participated in the process uh spoke to the proponents and had all of their concerns addressed which is why they are now happy to see this m go ahead in terms of the go-kart track well uh there was a signature I understand of 10,000 locals who were opposed to it and of course I don't think the go-kart track had the economic outcomes that a billion dollar gold mine with 800 jobs was going to provide and that's where so if it's big enough and enough jobs you can ride rough shot over concerns around anything to do with the landholders if it's big enough is that what you're saying well at the moment we have a small group of nearly unidentifiable indigenous Australians writing rough shot over the wills and wishes of the rest of the country who need jobs and economic activity the act the minister has relied on is so open-ended and has so much discretion packed into it she hasn't given us any clear answers around why she's done this um I actually think this law needs to change and that's something we'll do uh if we form government at the next election they need addressing and tightening up and can I say the decision needs to be reversed that's our view Jonathan danam appreciate your time thank you thanks Tom