Bleeding Green Interviews: John McIntyre

[Applause] all right as fans it's Jared kroer Raider 284 here you're listen to episode number three of the bleeding green podcast series okay well this is the third interview in the bleeding Green interview series um it's my enormous pleasure today to be interviewing John McIntyre uh hardly needs an introduction to anyone in this well he doesn't to anyone in this town uh much less across Australia and certainly rug rugby league uh uh headquarters the McIntyre name is uh is a legendary name in the club I only have to be right here where we're actually doing this interview I'm looking up at John's father Les uh to his right um and I'm also looking across at John himself uh as he's producing uh or at least has worked towards a signature uh which you would argue was the most important signature of any player in the club uh now we'll get to those things uh but I'm going to go a long way back John so first of all welcome uh terrific to have you um of course a living Encyclopedia of raider history and uh and that's why you're here we can roll on through you'll be producing stories uh that no one else will be producing uh and indeed able to go back further than uh than anyone else so let's start so the first thing is just again for the for the the purposes of people are tuning in and wanting to know some of the detail I think I'm right in saying you were born in 1943 no 1940 1940 okay close enough 1940 and I could do the maths I can do the maths on that as we work our way forward that being the case first of all and let's take it from there born in queenan born in quenan yes okay and 23rd of July 23rd of July okay and of course I mean an important time obviously World War II had begun um queenan um very much a a bush town then still um but also a town that had had many decades many decades of of terrific football rugby Rugby League The Story Goes On question for you um what were your what what junior teams did you play for only one the blues qu quinon Blues from what age quen been BL is from about five five years of age Quan Blues were started in about 1928 at a meeting of the uh que warles Rugby Club at the Vic Vic Hotel opposite where the Le Club is now that's now the Riverside Plaza and those uh the guys the players and the committee decided to change over to rugby league because of the same issue that the rugby league game started away from got away from rugby back in 198 you know workers compensation issues and so on Y and since that time there's been some absolutely marvelous rugby league teams out of queenan Blues the most legendary probably is uh the 1946 team if you have a look in there in the early pages of the uh uh the lat the other one The Unofficial history book U where we where they talk about how a fellow George McIntyre who was dad's dad's brother Captain's flat he was a pro Runner he caught the ball from a kick off at North born noal ran downfield and P infield the uh the book says poya but it was actually Paula and happened to be the uh eldest brother of uh my darling wife and's family okay yeah okay w w paa okay yeah but the 1946 Queen B Blues team I mean often talked about question do you have any uh do you have any memory of that team is that is that uh only very vaguely I all I did was later on in life I happen to strike an article in this Sydney Morning Herald which featured caricatures of those players and Y I I got the bromide thanks to Roy Masters from The Herald at the time uh he sent me the the brod which I copied and sent that to the families the surviving families of all of the members of that team yeah sadly the latest member to pass away was Terry free right who was murdered in Red Hill okay tragedy yeah yeah no it was I mean it's interesting that you know that whole background as we know this this plays into the Raider story for obvious reasons to everyone um but I'm interested I guess in in in before 1982 before the sort of that that key period in the late 1970s leading up to 1982 in the beginning of the club um what was and we also and and having interviewed Marian ferer and and young Don um and talk about the background to to to to Don senior's uh extraordinary role crucial role in the in the beginning of the Raiders we know that your father um had his role and I'd like to actually investigate that a little further but before we get there how and given the kind of busy individual that your father was in various areas that we've that we've heard about how interested was he in in in the junior football in yours and in uh in the blues oh very much so um very much so uh in fact the the first rug the local Junior competition was started up uh with a subcommittee that that included Bill Sullivan who was a he was a coaching queenan Blues before he went to the queenan Kangaroos and that competition was called the blossom carnival and I think you've got now something like three and a half thousand players but initially uh you know like you go back through the performances with Don ferer senior as the coach the Monero division was the team to beat in country football and um also Amco cup and so on through the late 70s and that was probably the the precursor to uh discussions to take place about entering the uh the Sydney competition right right and how did that if we go forward I mean well let's say just a little bit more about your father before we move into the con of I guess the key period in that later 70s period he was a man of many parts as we know that's been talked about sort of in in almost legendary terms one way or another but in terms of his um engagement with the queenan community he liked he he he enjoyed did he not a number of sports not J his rugby league tell us a little bit about that well he was a licensed bookmaker of course that one of the things and uh didn't mind a punt I don't think didn't m a punt himself oh later on later on when when I took aage license and uh he became just a happy racehorse owner and in fact he's very he's one and no his very first uh investment in the race horse was formed by a bought by a Syndicate of um old boys from queen V blues and the horse raced as queened in blue that is that right and uh it's very start very first star in the race in about 1972 it run fourth in a two-year-old race at Canterbury with a champion called Ming Dynasty finishing a neck in front of him is that right yeah that horse had chronic leg problems but we took him sent him to uh to Brisbane for to have winter in in Brisbane and as a coincidence the Freedman did much the same sort of thing with the Melbourne cup wi just over yeah right yeah and so there you go there you go so with that interest that he had that you had just um give us a little bit of the detail in terms of what happens in the later 7s in the early 80s whereby and and just if you wouldn't mind a little bit of time on your father at the point at which you felt presumably you were talking to him that he was beginning to Twig to this being a possibility that is to say a camera team going to the Sydney competition which obviously involves you because at that stage certainly in the 70 you're in the Army tell us a little bit about the engagement there between Father and Son I wasn't in the I was you moved to the public service I was in the public service and had my I in fact what had happened in in the initial discussions it was all about a submission from quenan with a combination of quinon Blues and Quon kangaroos right and Kevin hre's right Kevin Humes uh very wisely suggested to Dad that across the border you've got 200,000 people it'd be crazy to put in a submission leaving out for Country Town yeah outside of the ACT y yeah so with the sort of assistance of late board member Dr Jeff Corell who was a research fellow at I know remember Jeff very well indeed uh he he convened a uh uh a survey in about 1980 uh with people man on the street throughout the Cana District the whole the group eight area and the first question was do you follow a winter sport if the answer was no they went to the next individual right so at the end of that Ser survey they had something like about 65,000 uh respondents and 90% of whom would either follow a canra team or perhaps one of the other teams like St George or something like that uh and and until the day that writers played s or the new team played St George they would bar for the Raiders all the time but this one they switch camps and barri for for St George or or whoever else yeah so yeah so then if we fast forward to the sort of the discussions at the uh General committee meeting where they had Ros Kelly Fred daily as their along us for for support and the representative Campbell town claimed that Cana would have problems with the uh the 4ot teams flying into to canra because of fogs I was sitting up in a a conference at U at brassy house senior senior Public Service conference and uh I got a message uh from my father to ask how many times in the during the last five Winters has can airport been closed and um fortunately I had at my disposal all the senior people from civil aviation and uh those people we come up with a figure of 38 times but the airport was always open by 11:00 a.m. right okay so right uh 11:00 a.m. you could play the lower grades sure next door yep and still play the first grade game at at 3:00 you know so um yeah so that and of course uh at that time they uh made the commitment to pay the transport cost for the visiting teams to come to canra because their their view was that when canra went to team went to Sydney that they would have limited number of supporters which was very much the case at the time yeah so um we finished up B mine with connections probably between a member of our board at that time Gordon MC Lucas and other members they had a long association with each other b m thankfully were the one club that riged on that need and play their own way right so um yeah so there's always been that friendly rivalry yeah uh between the Raiders and that that's lasted throughout the 40 odd years of the history yeah reaching reaching an early High Point in 1989 but we'll get to that we'll get to that in in time but um Let me let let me ask just so we get to that the the key period leading up to 1982 and and I know that that you know people tuning into this all the Raad of fans would be very interested at what point given that your um you know your your distinguished career in the public service post the Army um at what point did you have a discussion with your father and I'm very interested in that discussion about the possibility of leaving the public service and in fact joining this fledgling new outfit um virtually when he came home from from Sydney after the general committee meeting but let me say that the conversation lasted about 2 minutes from which side well on either side but I told him I said I think I think I've got the qualifications to be able to set up that football team and for one of my criteria at that time is that having 10 years before that a bit over a decade before that in Vietnam where I was responsible for the life and Welfare of 38 young men and that convinced me that you know obviously a lot of the players would have to come from inter state they wouldn't have the support of extended family and we addressed that right from the very start and proudly that is still there yeah that is the culture of the club it's part of the Raiders DNA we I couldn't I couldn't agree more everyone knows this and we will come to that cuz I want to sort of get it at a sort of a later stage because exactly as you say that was established right from the outset it was something that's that's really been a real a real anchor for the club all the way through right up to the present that sort of and I I want to tease that out a little more but just so you put that to your dad was he immediately thinking right I'm my son's the man for the job well his his response was that I was Stone Raven mad right to get involved I assume yeah yeah well and also to take a very very significant drop in salary sure yeah sure from the public service because not to mention the security let's let's deal with a few of these things well yeah that's exactly right but um but no were you ever in okay you put that to him did you have any doubts did you have any doubts in terms of coming on board yourself independent of your father no right no right just thinking you I could do it and uh as it as time went on the passion grew yeah yeah yeah yeah all right well let's let's let's pick that up now we know that in fact this was a football Rich area was it important was that the the fact that you're talking the region the fact that you're talking certain schools we just go back a bit yeah go well one of the fortunate things of leading up to that General committee meeting is that Newcastle were OB viously the Preferred Choice to include is the 14th team yeah if I'm not wrong they were an original weren't they in in 1908 I think they were but go they were yeah but uh but Newcastle had the benefit of having a uh Al Les McIntyre uh under the I think his name was Mo Wilson right you could check that yep but he called he called a meeting at the Rosella's home ground straight across the road from the the Western Newcastle Leagues Club and they had 3,000 people there and I said to Dad this BL is campaigning for a no vote right to get that number yeah right yeah yeah it wasn't overwhelming yeah yeah okay had Newcastle put in the submission one of the deaths that I developed over a period of time was it 1988 when Newcastle went in I don't know that we would have in a position of been yeah to afford it yeah right to to to beat them out yeah no exactly right because what happened down the track yeah was really just the chickens coming home to roost yeah yeah yeah so we know the background in terms of of clearly Don Senor um uh extraordinary role with the queenan blues uh great success we know in fact Monero football was such a Powerhouse for for for years if not and and and indeed decades so there's a kind of a if you like the the background to this the sort of the the the the the platform for it but in terms of going forward we know that those early years were always going to be problematic um inevitably the team was not going to hit great success and we might we'll get to that at a moment because it was certainly disproportionate success but still you're obviously struggling from the outset you know just ask canala in terms of winning Premier ships when you come in you know this was going to be difficult so those early years what were the biggest problems that you faced a secretary in those in those early years other than obviously the recruitment of the players what were the problems that you were confronting probably the the main problem that we were confronted with in the the first certainly first first three years was we were confronted with a thir input rle yeah little bit a little bit about that for people watching this yeah you were only only allowed to have in your your role of roster of 55 players which was your total in all three grades you were only allowed in there 13 players who were not local Juniors or met through some other qualifying rule like over 21 and not graded with their home Club those Fells were free agents at that time but there weren't a lot certainly in the first year or so and L on behal once we had players we were looking forward to the fourth year uh 86 looking forward to be able to sign some extra players because those 13 Imports were still there and they were now locals yeah yeah but lo and behold they did away with the 13 import rle so we were back to square one yeah yeah yeah you know and doubly disadvantaged one of the things that I've always been disappointed about is that the new clubs later on were not confronted with anything like those hurdles now there were I mean potentially that was going to be insurmountable so what what it comes down to I was we know this in football generally but certainly in a situation like this one this unique situation was Talent identification in the context of the new club the restrictions that were that were existing how did Don senior um as coach and yourself what was the way in which players were identified was that mostly Don who had a reputation back through the years and decades of talent identification and traveling what how did you go about identifying the kind of players that you wanted to bring early and obviously not be paying too much money you've got to get them be under the in a sense you know independent of other clubs that are looking around with dough how did you go about that the the the the the sort of almost the tactics of that period Well we we'd have regular meetings uh in the boardroom uh uh with the the three grade coaches and well the one thing we wouldn't be talking about this if if Don ferer had hadn't been the coach at that time there was no way now his his connections yeah going back through his playing days and which was new southw and Queensland in both new southw and particularly in quen and um and of course then later on as as Australian coach but but he he'd already had uh a couple of years with uh Eastern suburbs when the leag club burnt down in 1972 uh and then when Da came back uh he he brought some players from uh The Roosters or the Eastern suburbs as they were called them uh with him and uh but he's in fluence was really was a not just Australia W um itally it was internationally as well and um the probably the only probably a disappointment was our very first signing was supposed to be a fer name Bruce Walker from Manley yep remember him called Goldie right and I'm sitting up in my office The Day After Dawn had been to Sydney and uh he walked in and he said uh G's right he's coming on board and I said yeah that's good where's the contract he said no he said we just shook hands anyway he said um if you got ao's number I said what are you going to do he said I'm going to ring AO I said Don I wouldn't be doing that the following day we pick up the paper and Goldies extended his time with what he Aro got word yeah yeah yeah well he was told yeah yeah so that was the end of that one was yeah and my only criticism Liv on at that time and and in future was he was too trustworthy and it's very much old school that isn't it and we even I mean that that continued Still For Years and decades beyond the handshake the handshake deal it's no longer but it certainly was up till say the turn of the century it um probably more importantly uh the handshake was still well and truly alive and well until the commission agents became involved y yeah y but we had our first representative player it's about 1984 with John Hardy front rower I got a phone call from a mate to say that Jack Gibson and Dennis Fitzgerald were having a cup of coffee with John Hardy at at mascot so this was around about 4:00 in the afternoon when I got home the first thing I did is I run Dennis with Gerald and said Dennis and tell you had a bit had a cup of coffee with Jack Hardy and he said yeah that's right and I said well he's actually got a contract extended with for for us to stay with the writers he said well you better talk to Jack about that and I said well if I can't get through to Jack I just want to remind you of a of a case to two cases the names I know Greg Hood was one and where the handshake was was honored and the wonderful Jack Gibson when the conversation that I had with him he said off if you got a You' got a handshake with him is right all none of that yeah oh that's that's a good story yeah yeah and of course speaking of old school I mean Jack Gibson's you know I mean epitomized didn't he really the kind of thing that the footballers themselves loved you know you had honesty and you had decency and you know and the handshake which is yeah it was something very special through those years for sure well we we I had hadly probably in his my time with the Raiders and his time either with whichever Club he was with would have been no more than say once or twice a year here like um as it turned out we had one thing in common was the love of the Queens land Outback yeah okay and uh he and I were about the only two officials who didn't go to rugby league officials who didn't go to the kangaroo tour when Don was was the coach in 1986 right I met up with Jack at the little place called Burk Town up on the gulf and he'd been all around the cattle stations going through their log books and their pay records to get research so he could put a diary down about the time that he spent with say Victoria Downs or whatever yeah okay okay so that yeah there you go so let's um I mean I guess just to to before we push on to you know the the the most significant signing in the club and that of course is malinga uh at the end of 1985 and we will get to that and certainly I'm reminded even as I look at in the boardrooms wall um but before we do get to that who do you think and I'm sure again people would be very interested who do you think were the key players in those first years for what they gave the club the key players and what was it from from your point of view that they provided maybe maybe just I mean there were a number of them we know but mentioned two or three that you felt made a special contribution and for what reason well from the very outset very hard to go past David Grant and and Jay Hoffman and John mclair right right John McLoud was given the nickname George Nas and that was because the crowd acknowledged the fact that you always got 60 minutes out of him oh excellent but uh yeah after that uh Ronnie GTO uh Ronnie GTO tells this the story about when he and Julie were they were driving past Lake George on their way up and he said Julie what do you think and he said they both agreed that I we'll give it a go for six months and see they're still here yeah you know yeah uh the other key one of course was Terry rean and go back to Jack sonning Terry Reagan he said what are they doing starting a zoo up there Glenn I interviewed Glenn Lazarus only a little while the the Brick with eyes and he had some very amusing things to say about Terry Regan but but one of them was to say that that when he was in the middle and when he was tackling he was he was going at it you know this is he didn't take a backward step oh no yeah no he was something I played Cricket against him I do know that he was pretty bad on the cricket field I can't even imagine what he was like on the footy field but yeah I mean Lazar said exactly that of how important he was amongst others to give the you know cuz he he really did go at it you know when he was on he gave you flat speaking of 60 Minutes whatever he was on for wasn't 60 minutes but he was going flat chat from the start to the Finish yeah yeah no very significant well let's move it along of course to to to what becomes an absolutely key moment for the for the for the for the club uh for the region the future of the club uh is the signing of malinga can you just tell us a little bit about the negotiations that occurred just for your memory and and and of course culminating in that signature but you know what were a couple of things that led up to that uh well the the fact that uh you know this was 1985 and Dawn had been appointed the Australian coach and that that that in itself lifts the profile most definitely not just on fer bit of of the club yeah and possible players coming in you know that that sort of Attraction absolutely and uh I remember we were see it a we getting flogged by Canterbury and uh the late Peter Moore the bull fog sidled up to me and he's a very good Sidler uh he said Johnny you need a class player at that time I commissioned to filler name Louie Newman to go to South Africa and we were chasing a legendary rugby player dannie Gerber right I remember the name Danny Gerber was was a goal kicking um Center and um as it turned out dannie Gober was on 55,000 Krueger around a year he was a PE instructor for the armed forces and he was living in a company house and had company cars and so well well we can't match that right right uh so then of course uh don brought up uh Malcolm Norman maninger and um uh discussions went over a period of time and um one advantage we had at that time was that um Mel's wife at that time came from a little whing town in the south island of New Zealand which was on the on the western side and uh the climate there was not all that flash so we had that that going for you in our favor yeah yeah but the biggest thing that sort of probably clinched the deal in the at the end of the day was that um I'd called M uh and said look it's a very very difficult decision uh moving down here and uh just take your time um time heal heals all wounds and and uh next thing I heard that he'd got a phone call from uh the boss at Manley and uh giving him until 9:00 tomorrow morning to make his decision and he said you've made it for me thank you yeah yeah it's at that time Ian heads uh was the editor of the uh Rugby League week right and also at that time you had the the color separations took about 10 days right it's not like you not like now you do it on your phone but uh yeah so there was a photograph of M in a manly jumper as well as a photographer and a Raiders jumper okay yeah I must go looking for that issue yeah that's historic yeah yeah so yeah that close that that and of course it was but I mean it's interesting and you know courtesy of you telling me that story and and I put it in the book but Aro who you know was known for not necessarily taking prisoners but that he pushed hard that was the very thing that uh that that right at the end you know shifted shifted M so he M Signs and one of the things that surprised me not withstanding that that I came to camber in 1985 with the family um and was going to you know even crean iner which I'm I'm pleased to say that you didn't jump I didn't jump on the bandwagon because he been signed because in fact when we arrived he had not but that being the case it really attracted me to go to seeit oval because I remembered and speaking of archon Manley brookil oval where I played a bit and certainly as a as a junior playing between the sort of big games but Brookville oval back then in the 1950s 1960s um very much resemble Seaford oval uh in the early 1980s there were similari and I just thought I I felt I felt at home and here's the thing they arrive Jr as we know that I mean Mal and of course he brings the Queen the other queenslanders of great significance on board but what a lot of Raider fans even those that go back a long way forget that 1986 which potentially was going to be the first very significant year was not a particularly successful one indeed you'd almost argue quite the opposite do you have any memories of that and do you any thoughts on on you know what um the suggestion perhaps and just to throw that out there was that that Don senior's coaching and given we're talking about handshakes and a and the background of League the Don's particular approach to coaching was reaching it not a used by date but but rugby league was changing was 1986 a year when that impacted on the Raiders and one is thinking of course that that that go forward you know fast forward one year um and Wayne Bennett comes on board and they team they team teach they team coach what are your thoughts on 1986 and 1987 yeah the um obviously 86 when Mal did come back and play he had that monstrous great big plaster on but um you it was versus Manley where he broke his arm on the on the goalpost y absolutely don't we remember it well so much of the time at that time was discussions with orthopedic surgeons about how can we repair uh so that he can resume his playing career and yeah we we we looked at a ballet dancer from Russia as you do has with a had a car accident and he had horrific knee injuries and what was you know there were uh we and Tiny cans was the specialist at that time and we looked at all of these various little things that U yeah and then obviously uh do you think that injury was the the main you know that not nothing to do with sort of coaching changes cuz they we know in 1986 and that's that's a part of the public record that a few of the players were not particular which included Mal it must be said that feeling that there was that that the the the the the approach that some some the the the attitude that some were taking was that there wasn't a lot of skills coaching it was a lot of sort of almost that the fitness coaching was that ever an issue or you didn't feel it was uh well I I was sitting in the car prior to training one night and the two lower grade coaches were having a chat and darkness they didn't see me I put the window down and listened to it and the following dial rang I spoke with Don and said you got a bit of a problem with you with your staff leave that for you to to fix up and uh at the leach Club the following day I was at smoke out time I said if you got the number for that BL Wayne Bennett from Brisbane and so I rang Wayne up and uh sort of taken the liberty of U booking you on a flight to canra tomorrow morning I want to talk to you about and we'd already extended Don's contract by year at that time yeah uh and he was the incumbent Australian coach at that stage was at that time yeah yeah so uh and my words were at that time for a coach a football team for the rest of your life right because I read in American football where you know some You Know Jack Gibson was of the view the three years was certainly long enough for a club a coach to spend with any club yep uh that's gone with Jack that as we all know now you know uh anyway we sort of with the honor um honoring Don's contract we decided that we'd have a duel coaching arrangement for 1987 and uh and what about let's you know again and people have got so much access to sort of reading about you know the the the fact of of course the club going to that first Grand Final did that exceed your expectations season 1987 uh sort of yes and no but at least you had a 90% fit male um with the yep the plaster cast y y but um the uh we'd sort of gone through the ri you know the the drama of the stock Brokers came around because the fact of the matter was that Wally Lewis wouldn't sign with the bronos unless Wayne Bennett was coach and that I don't think that ever got into the public forum um yeah so we we'd agreed to do that and then of course I start talking about uh a new coach to replace yeah were you disappointed with Wayne's decision at the time obviously yes but understandably when you knew as we did and certainly I did because he lived in F right couple hundred meters away from my place and um you know with um two severely disabled y children at that time and you know we we had we had uh early in his time in ' 87 we had a dinner in our dining room at my our house in faten and during that time the two disabled children were in up in our normal living room whereas the rest of us were down at the dining table and so on and he would take it turns with his wife then about who which one after yeah and when when he was coaching the Queensland residence team so he was away from home and this was in 87 uh without any extended family support here in canra yeah Wayne's wife uh flew down one of her sisters right or another R and so on you know or or a close friend and that was the case throughout that time so that family style was was difficult for them you had to be aware of it right yeah right so you were confronted of course with with a decision to make uh there was way he was going back to going back to brisbon um and you had to be on the lookout and especially given the nature of the season of course a a very successful season not quite to the to the top of the mound but pretty darn close and obviously credibility gained massively through that year if in and if if in fact it needed it in terms of the previous years cuz it's interesting we won't go any further with that but I mean those early years were definitely in a sense disproportionately successful basically in terms of what what was the Realms of the possible but let's go to 1987 and you've got that de that you know Wayne Wayne's making that decision and and and for the reasons that you've outlined um what was the thinking in terms of uh where the next next coach would come from and uh and who talked about it and and what were the key elements in the decision that was made well I didn't talk talk to anybody not even not even bad okay me tell us a bit more what I was doing okay and what but what so in in the early days in the early days right yeah but so I mean they were the board were prepared to leave that to me okay okay what attracted you about the uh about Tim Sheen uh and how did you arrive the decision you know what were you certainly certainly his youth was one young important factor at that time he was only in his I think it was probably only about his second year as coach that's right I think yeah yeah yeah yeah as a full-time absolutely prior to that he'd been playing front row for pen um and I mean a you know a Tradesman likee footballer as we know very M you know the kind that make it in rugby league no star thing I can say and I don't think I gave it to you before very likely to had Alan Fitz given from dapto at that time if he'd have said yes I probably wouldn't have had the discussions with Tim sh oh is that right okay and happily Alan f f given still still good mates yeah right he was um he was born in Gin right yeah yep uh born in gber and he played his footy at depto and he was manager of the dapt Leagues Club right yeah right and uh he decided that he couldn't afford to take that but he wouldn't be running the Queen Bean Leagues Club but he'd be getting a a coach's salary for at that time was probably enough for most to stand alone but he was on both both sides of the ler at depto so so when uh when you had those the first meeting with Tim je are you in did you go up to Sydney or did he come down here no I um had um I had a discussion with Tim I had a discussion with Tim uh down at um little place little town just before you get into penth I can't remember the name of it near angl Dam yeah yeah and we we spoke about that and then I talked to him about uh bringing his wife up to uh up to canra to uh to meet people up here and so we had lunch at the burns Mill in quenan and while Tim and I were out on The Veranda talking footy matters Anita was my wife Anita which with um doing a bit of SM smoing and said how many children have you got and uh Tim's wife said um well I've got two from a previous marriage and he's got two from a previous marriage and we've got one of house she said well you remark was you're very close to being able to say hey Tim we got a problem your kids and my kids are fighting with our [Laughter] kids this was the words of the suban from the for the yeah absolutely yeah yeah so then the next thing that happened he said well all right I've got to I've got to talk to um that's right John what were they the kids and I should know this but I don't approximately what were the ages of kids can't remember yeah yeah yeah no no go I think one of the lads is still here in Cano yeah okay I can confirm that because definitely that's a yes so yeah but God um but uh I uh I organized to meet uh meet Tim at the bar Pub in the Coffee Lounge next next next door and uh agreed to terms and everything like that but we were to hold an announcement until he went back to penth to tell Roger count right did you have to As a matter of interest just on that very quickly did you have to convince him of how you know the opportunity that was there or was he recognizing that opportunity I think he could he could he acknowledged that yeah he acknowledged we're on the way up yeah and um you know with the players that we had on board we on the way up um we the following day I get a phone call about 7:00 in the morning about4 7 and it's Zorba from the big Sports breakfast okay and he said Peter Peters for those who don't know but go yeah yeah so Peter says um I got a phone call yesterday the afternoon from an inmate from B Mile and he was mowing the lawn out the front of the Gile and he went to the public F box and told me he said that gray-headed fellow from Camp Raiders is having the longest cup of coffee with the front row from penth so I said zor can you sit on it for a couple of days until I give Tim an opportunity to square off with Roger promise I promise I'll give it to you exclusive yeah right which we did do okay okay yeah happily still got a mateship with uh with Peter Peters yeah yeah now he's I mean he's one of the you know real kind of not quite a legend of the game in in playing terms OB be that he as we know a very fine player but certainly in terms of his contribution to the code and all sorts of he's a very interesting fellow that's the amazing thing of going through the finals in 1987 was I'd meet him uh after the game for a beer before I come home and thing we came to the conclusion that the only way was going to improve the team was by winning the comp right right cuz they come off second and absolutely absolutely yeah yeah and let's touch on that now we've got a few more minutes then we'll take a break uh but let's get our way to 1989 so given that Tim signs uh it proves to be you know a revelation for the club for the code for the region for all the reasons that everyone knows 1989 1988 sorry um is not well I'll say marginally disappointing because of 1987 but we know I don't think we have to go over what occurred in 1988 so why don't we move forward to to 1989 what was your feeling um uh at the beginning of that year did do you feel that a premise ship was close getting closer where were you coming from in terms of the team I knew it was close you know in fact we were roted out of 87 with the abuse by Manley of the headb rule remember it well tell us a tot bit about that then and um at the CEO's meeting a couple of days after the uh 87 Grand Final uh qu asked for comments about the uh the headban rule because it was the first year that they'd had had the headban rle uh he said canver obviously have been affected by it so we'll ask uh CE John McIntyre to uh give us a rundown and I said in terms of um what we now called occupational health and safety uh wonderful rule looking after the the future welfare of of players and but instead of having an MD a medical doctor on the sideline you'd be better off with a vet there and he said why a vet I said cuz a vet doesn't have ask its patient what's wrong with it yeah yeah that's what it was yeah the manly sideline officials were waving in front of our sideline staff yeah a letter which supposedly had your sou Wales rugby league letterhead uh saying that that was okay right but if if you're using the bloody headpin whys a BL comes off with a you know if you if you've got you say you've got blurred vision as far as an MD is concerned you've got blurred vision until he sees an eye specialist yeah yep and and that was the trick yeah people can go back and have a look at you know at at at what occurred for themselves with that but um well well they turned it it was was a very very hot day it was something like it today they probably wouldn't play the game because it was about 35 36 out on the field 3:00 in the afternoon and yeah Rex mossup sort of made that that point but they turned it into a a 17 Man team versus a 1man team working within the the legal uh replacement rules y y framework that existed no absolutely yeah and I mean I don't I don't say per se you can say the one that got away but it was going to be closer most definitely and I mean that was you know that was that was shady dealing but not for the first time with Manny but we don't we don't have to go there um you know that's a part of History let's move and just before we take a break so you get to season 1989 and you felt that um success was close that the club was getting closer to a Premiership did you feel at that point as such that the that the that the the playing Personnel was there that it was that we had enough to to get there in that in that year 1989 well plenty of people would argue that um we probably had the best certainly two and possibly three best players on the planet at that time and that's without singling out obviously M's one of them yeah yeah but without singling out you had potentially Bradley Clyde y potentially Lori DIY yeah potentially Ricky Stewart potentially Gary beler yeah yeah chica Ferguson and yeah and and and others as we know coming from various no absolutely not to mention Gary coin sure sure cuz I mean it's almost we had also had the uh yeah we had the brick with our at yeah yeah yeah know most definitely yes and that and and it's interesting to say that with with with Lazar with lri dalily with Ricky Stewart that just as and one has to say in that that glorious period for the brumes football team when it was this wonderful mix of outside players and and and and absolutely brilliant locals that mix the Raiders had in that year and of course when you one you know when I was interested when I was writing the history to to read those games through 1989 to see those young players coming of age as it were and then of course you know the rest of why don't we why don't we cause one little thing just Ur to me one thing if we go back a fair way when I talking about those meetings in the boardroom with the with the coaching panel okay there was one where a semifinal of in the tumba rugby league and one of Coach F's mates told us about a fell named Wayne Wayne Jensen playing for one of the Tober teams so we've organized for fell out to uh record do a video recording of the game and send it down to us so I've I've re received it in the over night Del fast or whatever and I organized for an afternoon for uh the uh the coaching staff come into the boardroom put the video up the fellow's wife had got the channels mixed up and I got the direct color star of lady d and Prince Charles waiting we've learned a lot about technology since since that time all right well listen why don't we take a break uh we're at 1989 plenty to come we'll do that in the second hour thanks John okay well Jr um a second part of this and really looking forward to this as well um when we when we started the interview you mentioned about the the significance of the culture of this club from the very beginning from the from 1982 onwards in terms of shaping itself as in lots of ways a family Club a club that did look after the players a club that wanted to look after the players wives families do you think anything has changed over the years uh it's probably improved from that from those early days tell us a little right right from the very start like um okay we go back to November 81 when the players came from uh all over the place to go through one month of berky's mad hour you know while this was happening my wife charted a mini bus to take the players wives the V the the incoming from Interstate y wives and uh and partners to we Jasper to the we Jasper General Store whereby the ladies from the young YWCA right were taking measurements to have ladies and gentlemen fitted out with SH sheep skin coats oh there you go okay to prepare them for yep 82 winter the oncoming winter the oncoming winter so that it was beautiful to see the wives girlfriends sitting up in the grand stand at C AAL the warmth with their sheep skin coat one comment that was made by one of the wives was you I never able to wonder why we wear the sheep skin inside out why don't the Sheep it's far warmer that way you know like and then of course uh during a break in the season or leading up to the winter and they also chared a bus to take the wives and girlfriends up to Parish and have a day on the snow cuz about 90% of them had never seen snow in their lives yeah yeah yeah those sorts of things were a family thing but but there was always for because if you move say from manly to St George or param or whatever you stayed normally at your your normal residence whereas the visit the incoming Fellers we had to look at the house at them not murdering their money by paying rent yeah but put that money you get a full-time job put your footy money into buying a house and and quite a number of them did that do interestingly just just on this in case we don't get to it if you fast forward all the way to 2023 do you think actually the situ for for this club given the particular kinds of challenges but also the advantages has has it become tougher say since the late 1980s early 1990s has it tougher now to attract the younger players do you think that's become you know the degree of difficulty has gone up or not well the The Missing Link and it has been for quite a long time malman was the one that the player that everybody wanted to play absolutely the younger Brigade their ambition was to one day play alongside that P I think I think Ricky Stewart's actually said hasn't he that not just that but he said when you were running out with M but you know behind Mel you felt secure I thought that was pretty good you know yeah yeah yeah um so that you're feeling yeah the the the not just the banner player the the the kind of player that it was yeah um is we we haven't got it this moment yeah but so your selling points now are are lifestyle um geographically on sort of traffic-wise we're probably just as close to the beach as some of those players that live in the outskirts of pen speak to me I'll say I'll say and you don't have to go in traffic you know for 2 hours to get there either you know they're actually driving no that's true and we I mean given that it's well from my door out on the North side to down it's 24245 well I'm telling you a high percentage of players will uh talk up the the lifestyle in canra yeah and of course not just the club but you've got examples like um uh couple of years ago um what was a player's name that um he's he's now come gone I think he's back with West tigers um the 58 that from England that went to England and played no no no no no 5'8 what not Williams do you mean George Williams no no no no 58 no 5'8 no he was English English no he was he wasid he play oh Cesar Caesar uh there was a lady dressed up on on Match day he was come going ahe in the Bruce Stadium to uh you know to play for the Raiders and there's a lady at his Suburban shopping center bus stop he pulled over and gave that lady uh and her children a to uh GI Stadium it's a really good point because see that goes to so they indulging with the community yeah and and and look at the association with men's link yeah where you've got players of all ages and sizes talking about you've got a mental health problem talk about it you know and they are doing a good job and it's interesting because on that very point and you're saying that it cuts both ways that is to say the culture the club that goes back to the to the very first year and on top of that you've got the kind of priority that you uh back in the day and for so long but all the way through are looking for the right kinds of individuals in other words individuals who respond to that culture well when we're in quenan with associations with the men's link and uh and the the shelter with our our our great mate father Flynn yeah yeah yeah another one that we should cover is um our our U on board Patron uh now uh Pastor uh father Woods father Woods tell us from 1986 tell us tell us a little bit about in fact the yeah we might do the other we might about the man who's been Victor Viking we perhaps this is the right time but tell us a bit first of all about father woods and of course his story in the context of 1989 is particularly interesting oh yeah well it's just was something that knowledge with the knowledge the fact that um there are personal problems that a player could be confronted with particularly the fellows from out of town that didn't have extended family to for support here they weren't going to come to the CEO they weren't going to come and consult with the coach over these personal highly personal problems so um come up with the idea of uh having a a pastor that and wasn't it the didn't and that idea you hadap mid 1980s like doesn't it go back to 8585 85 86 and wasn't he a isn't he a cetti's boy as well he may well have been I think he was but anyway yeah yeah but as you say that kind of pastoral care has been you know I I mean I must say the only thing but no league club does this I'd love it from I suppose my background to to for there to be a little bit more work uh in terms of Education sort of post post football but no football club in rugby leag or indeed anywhere does that well but but it's another it's another aspect but certainly in terms of past care that's supposed to been an absolute standout for the club we in that time I don't know that there's ever been any discussion with father with monor Woods U about whether he has had approaches from players I know that we we've had to on some sad occasions like the uh the the passing of of Gary belch's son yeah Michael was born in quenan M we had a service at the Raiders headquarters at uce Stadium right on the day of the service um oh okay in Brisbane right yeah yeah right those those little special little things that yeah no absolutely absolutely and I suppose speaking of I mean it's special in an entirely different way but um and in terms of the continuity of the club one probably has to put in a more than an honorable mention for Victor the Viking AKA Tony Woods who goes back all that time but is still as active I'm lucky enough at the meninga meninga um medal dinner to be over the last several years sitting next to him which is and not just sitting next to him which is always an education but the continuity and then on top of that if he isn't the most enthusiastic chap in the room or person in the room I'll give it away as he was most recently the most recent you know was he he felt that the he he felt that there wasn't enough noise there wasn't enough tone in the room so he was doing his damnest to to lifted but tell us a little bit about that relationship that go it was was amazing because he went over my head but that didn't matter cuz that head was dead oh is that right oh yes yes to be the he said I yeah un well you the thing that we haven't dis we had earlier discussions about the coming up with the name Raiders and the and the color formation and so on he was the come one that come up with the idea of Victor the Viking and um he sold that to Les and um the rest is the rest is history as they say the classics he's still there okay and we I I should have I would have touched and and I certainly did in the book because of the discussions that you and I had about this but people would certainly be interested just tell us a little bit but then we'll we'll jump forward into the 1990s a little bit about the the what was occurring around the naming of the team to come into the competition and the colors your your um involvement in that there was not too sure about the the naming I think it was more the fact that um uh I think that my understanding was the name Raiders came from uh from Don Don fer sen okay and the I mean it certainly appears to be a sort of top down rugby league authorities down but what about the what about the colors the colors there was a there was a competition set up for uh for supporters to come in with suggestions about the the colors and uh a lady who happened to be the wife of the late Don Eli put forward the submission under her maiden name right and uh when the committee chose those colors they decided that uh yeah we'd start to hear about insider trading at that time so U uh they disqualified Mrs elf from from collecting the prize but her colors proudly I still warn that way there you go I know that um what a I think Kevin hre with the lime green he was called fness fairies it was it was nowaday you nowadays you got to be you know under the realm of political correctness you've got to be careful you got to be careful you got to be careful what you say but it's uh yeah it was a very distinctive color as we know so let's just go forward in time we we at 1989 Grand Final what was um the way in which the momentum built in that year and as we know finally gets through because they were important buildup games in the other the semi-finals but to get to the Grand Final and it was uh uh one might even say given we' just been watching an India Australia cricket series that uh all of India had that team home uh in the recent uh uh 50 over 50 over final um it's fair to say and you you remember it well and I must say one way or another because I was overseas in that whole year but hearing from the family that this was just a fat comple this was going to be Bain the banner year they were going to win the competition Now history tells us that they did not what do you feel with a key elements of that Grand Final Victory what are your memories of that Grand Final Victory I'd rather go back to uh have getting to that Grand Final tell us more tell us more probably the one one disagreement wasn't so much a disagreement one disappointment that I had uh was that um back in when the Raiders played Canterbury at Perth at the Wacker y Ivan henck created a try we scored I think it was M that scored and we were able to if we don't win that game yeah and then the next absolutely series of games we don't make we don't make the five and yet in the 89 Grand Final Ivan didn't get a taste Kevy wers went on instead of Ivan and Kelly walers was going to the Broncos the next year yeah you know so what that that was a disappointment to me but in the buildup to that game I sat alongside um uh Bob McCarthy South Sydney uh during that time up in the U the Lord M's suite at the at the cricket ground no was at the SFS wasn't it yes uh yes yeah at the SFS and with five minutes to go well mine were in front I should to Bob McCarthy I said I'll go down and make the make the time I said if you ever seen an more unlucky team and he said yeah he said us against Bal Main in 1969 yeah which I remember yeah so we don't we cherish those moments yeah but it was one of those things that you could see all the luck at the the be in the first half all the luck went against 100% against us yeah and um yeah yeah yeah there was a an amount of confidence in the dressing room about an ability to win the game without it going to extra time then of course when I arriv down at the tunnel I walk out the front and I see Lorry daily throw this basketball pass and then Checker Fergus he yeah yeah yeah weave weaves his way through and and scored that you with the conversion that level magical yeah yeah and then then M with his toe pooke and you think you know that like and and goodness knows he he missed kicks but he never missed pressure kicks no no but you go back into the game like the the ankle tap on um yeah on the redheaded yeah yeah yeah absolutely yeah and that was just just an ankle tap too that was you know as you I mean of such things as we know always great things happen when you get that that moment of luck I mean Ricky Stewart's always talking about it coaches do you've got to have a little bit of the rubber the green and and and right and ultimately we did though it didn't look like that was going to happen and then and you know a lot of people about B mine supporters in particular were critical of what Warren Ry taking uh blocker off blocker and yeah but the fact of the matter was that during during the game they were missing tackles yeah they got and they put on tacklers to shore it up as yeah and um if if they have stayed on WE Fe confident that it wouldn't have gone into extra time clearly in front yeah now that confidence was in the room yeah yeah no I mean it just you know it was such fun for me to write about that that year and indeed that that game because of almost mythical kind of elements to it which are which we we we all of us know and all radio supporters know I have but and and gim we know so there's 1989 we get our first premise ship uh and and follow up with a a really solid year in 1990 and then ultimately with all the reasons we know uh there's the Gap that occurs and we finally get to 1994 I have a question for you so there's three premierships which team do you think was the best Raider team of those three years and why well I I reckon the best Raiders team of all time was not in any of those years 93 I reckon it was 98 oh okay okay 888 88 where we played in both of our playoff games with we got beaten by a point yeah yeah yeah now 93 we lost Ricky well that's what I was going to say they sticky play you know that moment cuz it wasn't and even in that game we won by about 60 points but we didn't win another game and that was yeah I mean my my son who follows the game very religiously feels that the best team the Raiders have ever put in the padic was the team of 93 but that of course you know included Ricky Stewart which uh yeah so okay I remember when he when he had that blood dread Dreadful injury uh I was standing behind behind dad and Hank and they were the patrons right time and uh Les looked at it and he said well that's our season never more true words said yeah I'll say I'll say I was close to the action too when it occurred but be be there me okay so there's there's those three grand finals and for we we know the onset of Super League again that I've written about that but with with the deepest of reservations in the coming years first of all just just refresh my memory and and and those uh looking at the interview what year did you finish your secretary 91 in ' 91 in ' 91 in fact yeah Bernie Fraser signed the letter right demanding my resignation on the 22nd of September 91 and I think that was the day before or the Friday before the Grand Final is that right okay there you go there you go and when I rang I i' I rang the New South Wales rugby league head office and uh said my my tickets uh for the Grand Final haven't arrived and this admin girl said um uh you're not the CEO anymore I said said you got to be kidding me yeah yeah my goodness so I rank qu got got some yeah yeah yeah um let's again I mean we could certainly work through the '90s but they've been well covered you know in now if it stick with 91 yeah yeah yeah tell us more that was another one where that was Gus G was coach of u p yep and Mark gu was sent to the inen and at that time we were leading by 10 points instead of Mark guy going into the dressing room which is where he was supposed to he was standing in the race with with Phil G pointing out our wounded troops they're right yeah there you go yeah we've spoken about we've spoken about that at at public forums mostly in penth of course yeah yeah where I've been given the pleasure of getting up to sort of try and square The Ledger if you like sure but um sure you know that was just one of those things yeah that happens from time to time yeah most definitely why just you say okay you know 8991 the what occurs between then and '94 is interesting again I suppose well undoubtedly one has to go to the quality of Tim Sheen or start there um as coach but the players that were held on did you feel you know does that that 94 team do you think that 94 team was every bit as good if not you know perhaps you know some might argue better than the 89 and 90 teams uh it just not a fan of comparing those they were still they were still a great team yeah yeah but if anything the opposition wasn't as strong yeah as they were back in those days yep it was point isn't it yeah yeah there were games games that in the previous three or four years could go either way very few of those blowout games I think we were involved in one of them when we what we do beat beat the Roosters by 60 points yeah yeah yeah absolutely so I mean as as to to to to sort of shift shifted on a little again the later 90s have been well covered for you know in various books in in including mine but if we go forward to the early years of the 2000s so you looking at that 200123 that is so important to the the kind of not not so much the reemergence of the club but the the the the the the reestablishment of stability can you tell us a little bit about that were you were you ever at any in any doubt that the Raiders would survive and ultimately move on you know and and and tell us about a little bit about your role in that well one of the reasons that I was confident the Raiders would would um can continue on and and might I say Thrive not necessarily on the football field sure sure yeah because when that all happened and my phrases when the hit the fan uh from 1991 advised to me from close mates and folks that are respecting their ability of the game and administration and so on is to stay on uh as chairman of quean Leagues Club and also as um CEO of uh Quon United the ultimate controlling body of the of the whole group and from that time uh from 91 I learned the valuable cor corporate lesson is to not place too much trust in in many people and uh because you know the fact of the matter was over that previous period of time the whole group was let down by people who were can remain nameless they're not involved with the club anymore but um and to concentrate on establishing growing our business The Core Business not just the footy but for the benefit of F0 yeah and as a result of that when the Super League opportunity came on board with the arrangement made between Les and Ken KY where the queenan leagues club's total commitment was limited to a million dollar a year uh on footy but that footy wasn't towards the green machine that for that was towards Junior League yeah right yeah right and from that time the Junior League has thrived and so is our Core Business in getting rid of the debt yep and we've went debt free for over 20 years now you know um because back in that time when the hit the fan in 1991 the debt was still the debt that was hangover from the fire the rebuild of the queen Le Club from 1991 right right hence my when interviewed by Zorba on 2ky where I said I can't understand what all the fusses about about the predicament of the Raiders is where the total in of debt is not as great as the interest bill that a club not very far away from where you sit Studio yeah right right right and if you I don't know where You' have seen today's Telegraph no I haven't penth is still talking about 100 million must they're talking about they're saying net assets of 400 million Cate now one of the classics of all time was um the filler who the English second row that came to canbury they didn't have a salary cap but there was an a grade limit on you know $20,000 or something like that per year um he was the the the fellow that coached uh witness when we played in the 89 uh you Championship that after the Grand Final Long Longwood orwood Lo Lockwood Lockwood yeah well Brian Lockwood was part of what uh Canterbury had shown up in their financial Records Was U uh first class return aairs for uh Lockwood and his wife and two children and when we played witness lwood was still a single man is that right is that right Goodness Me oh dear yeah that was the Frog yeah yeah yeah no it I mean it it certainly continues to be something that that that interests us all because this is in terms of that as you say arm length third party that's that's at this moment it's out of control in the same way that something's got to be done about the player agents but that's another story let's go to the the the the period um let's just go forward a little further um in in those years from 20012 through to 20 let's say 10 uh where several of those years were were pretty darn successful one thinks for example that young team that had a young Terry czi um that uh you know there were I mean there were years when the Raiders were again successful Beyond any expectation but that being the case let's just say a little bit about the coaching um the Raiders have always had real stab in the coaching um and as we know one of those coaches at the time I'm talking about 2010 was was uh Dave ferer one of the greats of the club uh and I know you're on record is saying that one of the saddest things was to see uh him being moved along from the Raiders um I'm interested in your thoughts on that is it um and perhaps even the the possibility one reads I've read a couple of times more recently of Dave ferer having a a further role in the the club which raises the larger issue of the club there's a real family atmosphere that exists in the club and do you think that that has been one of the real strengths of it and one thinks of the McIntyre the fers and so the list goes on yeah well um the most significant thing is part of our di dni is loyalty and you know in the history of the Raiders I can't recall any past player that's ever been in any way critical of the club either either it's management or it's coaching not one uh in fact it's it's it's the opposite they're just so complimentary there are so many players out there that are just so proud particularly when we we win a game yeah to say well I was a part of that yeah yeah yeah and those sorts of things and uh you know obviously you've got on record that I that was uh no place for me as chairman of the Raiders once um a longtime family friend uh you cuz those associations with those longtime family friends is what is responsible for the passion yeah yeah not just the game itself yeah but the people who were in when I was writing that you know and and and young Don having to go out you know talk to his his brother and they were down the coast you you know you you you've talk to to me about that that how difficult that was but it seemed to me absolutely and I'm not not objective in this undoubtedly invol you know kind of subjective because of the love of the club but it was handled with considerable dignity at the time um and that was you know just another element of yeah of of of of what you'd expect from the club it must be said but look and it's an Associated one and we're coming to sort of drawing to a close when I was lucky enough to um to interview both Mar and ferer um Mom and and Don Jr very recently um we talked about a whole range of things and she it was very interesting for me because I played a grand final against Tara back in the day for uh in in group 13 but uh and given the having a pretty good knowledge of tumber what I didn't know was that Marian was a tumber rumber girl um and so hearing about that but more than that was to hear that she began compiling her scrapbooks and I know that they're meticulous cuz she was kind enough to let me access some of them when I was doing the history of the club she's got scrapbooks that began with tumber rber in 1960 she has been keeping scrapbooks since 1960 all the way through to 2023 and she still does them now and they're as scrupulous as ever I'm going to suggest given the interest that uh your intervention was so vital when you and I you might remember and I've touched on at the beginning of the book had a chat about history and whether there was uh you know we should do it um and you were so uh encouraging and and so positive about it and and and and the history occurred it seems to me the one thing that that that is at this stage um missing is to build on the history as it were the official history that exists into the broader history of the club um that is to say those elements of the club that still haven't quite had the attention they deserve and I'm thinking for example about um I'll say in the broadest sense memorabilia because since we've got and it's pretty obvious to all the people looking at this this interview you as the living encyclopedia but you're not a young man anymore yeah that these are the kinds of things that the club's got to give attention to in addition to having for example the older players in I think there is such a rich history that it's to be hoped from my point of view that there's a little bit more attention to broadening that history in the immediate future um and of course I'm hoping that you're going to play an integral role in that for at least the next few years but it is worth when Marian said that to me I was really struck by it because she said said there's they're actually out in her garage you know and and and you and I both know that some of that material that's in the quinan Leagues Club still is not in the best shape because it hasn't been properly attended to so it is something that it's to be hoped that that the club will give a little bit of increased attention to and of course the late and great alen Hawk was another huge Enthusiast um in those in those terms as well and I think it would be another part of his legacy because when when I did history you were the F you know you were so encouraging but he what with you and hawy uh it was the Dream Team for me uh in terms of taking it forward for which for which I do thank you um but it probably raises I suppose finally the issue that I did want to touch on because I did with Marian and that is given the absolute centrality of the McIntyre in the Raider story it's something that that I think in the last you know over the next uh hopefully number of years you give attention to in terms of the kinds of things that should be a part of the physical Legacy of the club because I think that's the one thing that hasn't been done well and you only have to look at the queen win leagues and I don't blame anyone you know I'm interested sort of from the historian point of view but that idea that um uh the history of the club can be more than just writing a history it can actually be be talking about some aspects of the background that tell you more about a John McIntyre they tell you more about Al McIntyre they tell you more about a Ricky Stewart tell you more about a m maninger and it is to be hoped that the that the club can give that attention in the coming years got any thoughts on that yeah personally uh my situation is uh at the present time uh when I'm fast uh aggregating a uh a group of great grandchildren to be more than the grandchildren that I've got so that's been a concentration but the other thing course is that we go back to queenan leag Leagues Club we are in the process of um in the next few months of finalizing plans on a complete sort of rebuild of the place where we're going to spend about 40 we're going to spend about 40 odd million dollar but and because of with the U my recommendation quite some time back to make Simon Hawkins our group general manager and that he he and myself and uh Brian Holly concentrate on investments um in that article today uh Cameron from penth talk about how the Panthers only depend on the leag club for $10 million you know the you know what the Raiders depend on the qu leag club for so right yeah yeah yeah but uh but yeah so those sorts of things you know that look one of the difficulties was created back in the time when all of the memorabilia uh the stuff that you're talking about that's down at the Club yeah uh they had a campaign with the assistants of the queenan AJ and the Cana times to have uh team photos and all that sort of stuff all come into the leak Club where they come in and they now in bloody boxes don't I know it know with the difficulty is 90% of them have got no captions I couldn't agree more I people flooded absolutely you know as you know one thing you're talking about David ferer okay they talk about family and that sort of thing there's one thing uh we haven't touched on is the writer Rich sure this young Manch tell us a this young man W there's a wonderful journalist with the CER times named Ian Warden and in the Sunday C to times after the Raiders had played their very first home game at coval Ian Warden wrote this article that talked about very one about three lines on the actual game where the uh Marauders from West and Sydney uh were too strong for the camber Raiders who did play with infinite pluck but he said that that the the interesting thing was at halftime the assembled throng was entertained by Nim fets just beyond puberty garbed in costumes tailored from the curtains of the Quan and one couldn't help but wonder whether their mothers knew that they were out okay Monday morning at 9:30 I've got a delegation of mothers oh from the Raider okay they want me to take them out to the camp times headquarters and Lynch Ian Warden Ian Warden I've sat down with it and I've held back sort of not laughing and everything I'm said ladies and Kelly's mom was one she was the choreographer right okay right I said it's all tongue and cheek don't worry about it yeah which is the way he writes as we know well he's still there he's absolutely he's still writing the same way yeah yeah you know always the word word for word yeah that's the assemble song was entertained by Nim fetch just beyond public oh dear it's okay it's it's interesting even as you say that I suppose it pertains to what I'm saying about history that I was lucky enough in being so inspired as we all were by the run in 1987 to actually mention to the camera times and I'd never written I was writing on republicanism and American history Australian history and I'd never written a sport piece ever yeah and I said to the editor whoever it was then that that I wouldn't mind writing something I said well go ahead and send it to us which I duy which I duly did and and was was just before the Grand Final but it talked about culture it basically talked about the impact of the rers on the community that was it and I was disappointed on the Saturday grandf on the Sunday that it uh when I looked at the sport Pages it wasn't there what I didn't realize as I discovered on the bog that afternoon when I was having having a read of the camera times the the next the the um whatever the one of the other sections in the in the broad sheet was they' done the whole page and they had the Raider horns around it so that was that was the beginning for me but it was also the beginning of an interest more than an interest of passion for for the culture for the you know the culture of the club and I mean I think that's that's the one if there's one element that can go further it's actually attending even more passionately yeah to to the retention of the history cuz now there's a historical record John you know you're you're living proof of that you know what I mean we are we now talking 40 years and growing and it's not just that as I tried to do in the book it's 40 years plus because of the queen you know the the story of the mcar the Queen Bean Blues it goes back decades before that so that's what we're hoping to see happen but that's that can only be stimulated by this series of interviews and and never more so than your own now did you want to was there anything you can think of that hasn't been touched on that you'd like to before we wind no perhaps one thing that um uh uh it's not with us anymore he's gone to the Cowboys but if Terry campi doesn't have that injury back in was it 2010 that we were going to go close to winning the Premiership that I tell you how how how close that is for my in my memory being in the stands on the other side of the members that's where the hens like to go and certainly I do watching him in that year before the injury he was in command as we you know God knows on one leg almost literally he still continued to play football but watching him at the height of his powers when we were putting teams away big that that year but the way in which the sort of manufacturing of the backline which we still don't quite have in the in the present team reminded me of course of 94 but especially 89 when that space that you see from the best teams at the moment we're going to challenge but that that that way in which he he was able to work with space out is brilliant probably the like closest to him now is Nathan clear yeah yeah the way that he singlehandedly can control a game Campo was quicker he was you know than C was quicker he was so I mean absolutely I I couldn't agree more with that because it was just such a tragedy well at the time that Matt Elliot was coaching but they brought in some bloody half back from manly Warford or something like the name wasn't anybody yeah yeah M offord yeah no bloody good terrible but um disaster Camp I was plan Reserve grade for Queen it was planed for Queen B Blu at the time and I had to virtually grab Mount Elliott by this road and that was it was interesting because that very year that team had young BL too like there was there was a there was a sense of 89 in that in in that team and uh and of course and it doesn't come along e easily and especially when you don't have you know I mean to to put a kind of group like that together which is clearly the aim at the moment well he was probably the closest that we've had as the fellow that blacks wanted to play alongside yeah yeah definitely definitely okay anything else or you all fine well John McIntyre uh obviously it's always an education for me talking to you as it is whenever you speak to people about the history of the club uh it's terrific to have that on the record uh and hopefully we'll do this again some time in the immediate future Go Green Machine go the green machine cber Raiders respect and honor the traditional custodians of the land and pay our respects to their Elders past present and future we acknowledge the stories traditions and living cultures of Aboriginal and torist St island of peoples on the land we meet gather and play [Music] on this project was supported with funding made available by the ACT government under the ACT Heritage grants program