Don't Drop the Soap | An Analysis of David Fincher's Fight Club (1999)

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you like what you hear please consider subscribing to our patreon at patreon.com we offer tiers at the $1 $5 and $20 level where the $5 tier will grant the ability to request films for future episodes this is the film of ss where movies are more than just entertainment they're in experience an experience and welcome welcome back to another episode of the film of Steins thank you for tuning in today glad you guys can make it thank you for making it I'm joined today by my club and Friend Lucy hello everyone you can join us every Monday Wednesday and Friday for brand new episodes of the filstein some recent episodes include when evil lurks The Passion of the Christ sound of Freedom mice of men the 1992 one and and What's Eating Gilbert Grape but today we are discussing the 1999 classic David ventur Fight Club well we watched it we watched Fight Club and I um I guess I'm reporting back that it's it's okay it's got the very annoying late 90s early 2000s music and shooting style there's really not a a lot we can probably add to the conversation of Fight Club and I don't know if I care enough about the movie to even begin to but I am curious about what you have to say what are some hipfire shots of Fight Club well I didn't like it I didn't like it at all I guess there were a few things I liked but overall as a as a movie it just it it didn't speak to me maybe I wasn't the target audience for this because God damn it was boring it took a while for it to get started for me like I just remember the first five minutes just being like God I hope he turns it off but then we got to the support group thing when he meets Mara and or I guess right before he meets Mara and that was that was pretty interesting and then he meets Mara and then it lost me completely pretty much I think I would have enjoyed the twist that you know he was Tyler the whole time if I would have been captivated the whole time if I would have been into the movie then I probably would have been like oh my God he's Tyler you know you know me I'm a sucker for plot twist I did like that the movie looked really dirty um it gave me the seven Vibes which I do enjoy that movie a lot so um there's that there's a a tiny little plus to this to this movie I think the performances were okay they were decent you know nobody was lacking really anywhere and um is it Edward Norton is that our main guy yes I liked his voice I think he had a nice voice for his narrating H okay but uh the story The Point the cohesiveness pretty much everything that makes a movie Just hit home was lacking what was the point I have no idea to bore me to sleep don't buy [ __ ] because if you do you're not going to feel I don't know if you hate your job quit it Go beat up some people to feel something no clue all men are secretly homosexuals I don't know there's a point there somewhere in there I know there is yeah I'm kind of stuck between the this tone of is David finer making fun of masculinity and people who think they have Society figured out more than all you know than the functioning present Society or you know David I almost said David Lynch or David Fincher's you know the rest of his filmography because he's not really a funny guy right I don't think any of his other films I haven't seen all of them I've seen most of them maybe with the exception of one or two haven't seen M but they're not funny they're kind of ultra Uber serious yeah and not in a melodramatic theatrical way either but just a I guess in a kind of crime and that maybe makes sense why he does a lot of crime films is it kind of all of his films kind of take that serious crime angle but I can't get away from the fact that this film feels like it's making fun of how gay masculinity is yeah there's definitely a lot of sexual tension yeah in many of these scenes and not just the fighting scenes yeah the closet the discovery of connecting with other men on a deep level finding emotion and feeling in that the soap the borderline rejection of hetosexual intercourse it's it's just a little oddly specifically gay man and I just I kind of wish it embraced it a tinge bit more because I feel like there would have it would have hit home a little more but it may have been also a little bit more offensive to someone I'm not sure the the masculine I guess Community the people the the the manly men the ubermen would have been a little more offended kind of the fact that they're the the secret you know kind of praising of each other's ma masculine achievements is is just kind of a funny thing I guess but so I'm I'm just a little stuck between a rock and a hard place if you will and it's probably you know nothing new that's been really said before I I haven't looked too deeply into fight club but I have seen that it's a widely studied film it's just a little odd because it's not it's not very very deep I don't think in any of anything it has to say it's very kind of on the nose and maybe a little messy at places and and it works if it is trying to be funny but its tone just totally blurs it out where I can't really quite get to the nut of it so I will say I did like a lot of it just not together so it's kind of hard to score in my mind too yeah I can see that for sure and I definitely liked the therapy AA style meetings in the very beginning the intro is very good I thought it was hard to get a grasp on where things were going but that you know can happen in a two plus hour movie you know you have a longer introduction a lot of times especially when you have a high octane movie like this it's just like what what is going on and stuff and I like the introducing of Helena's character Mara right y I think that's really fun and everything but it just when Tyler gets brought into the fold it's just doesn't hit quite right and I knew about the twist it's one of those twists that you just everyone knows about I don't know about it I'm really that's one reason I wanted you to watch this movie because you didn't you hadn't known previously you didn't and I so I it didn't hit like it could have at one point in my life or should have which I don't I think I'm pretty immune to that even if I know cuz I recognize earned setup yeah earned P individual and it's it's there here so it's like you know I can't help but they appreciate it and especially knowing it while watching it I'm looking for you know characters not knowing who Tyler really is and stuff and it's you know obviously mostly kind of projected through Helena's character when she's just like what the [ __ ] are you talking about all the time you know every time she's when every time we think she's talking to the main character I guess he's just called the narrator right yeah a lot of people were calling him jack yeah he was Jack on set that's what uh okay that was confused I I think that maybe is what it said in the script actually I think that's what David fer maybe named him or I'm not sure if it was Ed Orton or not but he's he's the everyday man which we get a little bit of a how is that the everyday man well it's the everyday kind of idealistic man in the 1970s and ' 80s it's this you know businessman he's got a 401k you know maybe he's got Decked Out Ikea hallucinations you know I'd be when I was after watching this the first thing that kind of popped in my mind was what is I wonder what David Foster wallow would have to say about this movie because he's a real character into the effects of modernity and TV and things that are kind of supposed to make you feel a certain way so I I don't know he may have written about this film I'm not actually sure in 1999 but I like a film that has something to say about consumerism you know I like a film that has something to say about fascism I like to say I like a film that has something to say about some kind of radical movie movement you know that's a pretty easy get for me you know I'm I'm like the film can be pretty lowkey under budget no name director or actors and things these things can pop up and it's definitely going to be like all right I got put that on my list kind of thing yeah that's like a monster movie for me if it's got a giant monster it's it's going on my list yeah and I I mean I'm with you too on giant monster especially if it's kind of a unique giant monster I'm like all right I'm all for giant monsters I don't care if it's Unique I don't care if it's a dinosaur I don't care if it's a T-Rex again and again and again I don't care yeah I'm good with T-Rexes you know I'm fine had my T-Rexes a good shark movie is always welcome no doubt that's very special place I'm waiting for that great Yeti Sasquatch movie you know I'm good I'm good with trolls had a great trolls movie I'm good you know I'm good with Godzilla I don't need Godzilla anymore I'm good with King Kong you know things big big apes and monkeys I'm fine you know keep them coming I I'll probably watch them too but they're kind of guilty pledgers for me too especially in the new Kong versus Godzilla where where Kong sits in that big chair all right you've got me for the rest of the series him sitting in that big chair with the people yeah that's awesome I love that it's great visual it's very video gamey or something I don't know something really satisfying about seeing that even though it's 100% CG it's like I don't I don't know what that is it's funny that's probably the best part of that movie to when they go through the Earth and everything at the very end yeah that was cool but I'm I'm really I want to it's I guess Fight Club is lives in the space my mind so these are I guess more than anything really preliminary thoughts I'm going to have to sit with this movie for a while and I might have to give it another watch at some point another year or two you know just let things kind of marinate in me and it's kind of frustrating because I want to like this movie why why do you want to like it just because of those themes I or CU Everyone likes it I mean sure and Everyone likes it you know there's a little bit of that of course I guess that's part of the thesis of the movie though is being you know falling prey to just kind of Trends I guess I guess I guess and of course you know it's just I don't know why it doesn't work of course it's it's great that you know we have someone like Brad Pit representing this person who is trying to deconstruct the the modern man and he is the perfect representation of a mo like the idealistic modern man at the time at least you know and and his hey day9s early 2000s and so it's just it's kind of funny it this I don't know it keeps building this narrative that it's supposed to be funny but it just doesn't come across like the director here David fer knows that it's funny or else he's just got a weird sense of humor it's as dry as dry comes a desert's too wet for him you know and so I don't know I'm really in a funny I I have a really I'm stuck in a really funny rut with this movie it's been a few days since we've seen it now and I just cannot get away from it and I know how influential it was in in cinema and just I don't know it feels it almost feels like a call to action movie call you to do what destroy debt companies don't let your materials consume you yeah it all we saw was an Ikea catalog mhm go fight someone let your frustrations out okay yeah it's kind of funny how the fighting that the you know the rediscovering the rediscovery of Feeling Again evolved into a terrorist group I yeah that's weird it's weird it's it's very weird and it feel again it I can't help but to feel like it's making fun of people who think they have it like people as in a a movement some kind of political group organized people who think they have it figured out better than what's already actively you know being exercised and practiced in society whatever that looks like in whatever country and and there isn't an actual Manifesto here we have just a radical self- imploding group that's just I mean I guess he even says it in the movie Edward Norton's character does where any of these groups across the country are so committed that they at any point can kind of take a life of its own and kind of transcend out of Fight Club group or whatever they call it Project Mayhem you know and so I just cannot get away that it's that's that's funny but it doesn't feel like you're that you think is funny you know what I mean yes like in Barbie it feels like Greta G thinks it's funny it's not very funny cuz I don't think she's I don't feel that well I mean I think the presence of Will frell and Ryan Gosling and margar Robbie I guess I mean really just the presence that's all you really need I think the presence of him helps hit that home on paper now in the movie it's not very funny but I think and I guess the little girl to the the high schooler I think her what she has to say is just so insane that you can't help but the at least smirk at it at least on paper you you know maybe not an execution but it feels like it's kind of along those lines that but even in the worst case with David Fincher that he's just he's so not funny that we just can't like in the soap thing are you joking me yeah maybe I am surprisingly too happy with my life to enjoy this film or maybe I enjoy my job a little too much for this film Maybe the type of mental problems I have aren't psychotic enough you know my anger I let it out when it needs to be let out whether I want to or not it just comes out and I I guess you know I try not to let materials consume every being of my life I try to keep a healthy balance I guess I'm not a hoarder what about but what about the conveniences and vices of just modernity in general I mean it is what it is it's where we are it's where we are we can't do anything about it and why would we want to what what are you going to do yeah I mean it's that's a lovely point the movie kind of Rejects and forgets that these things are they allow us to live any life we want they allow us to not have to be forced to risk Our Lives providing just food and the little bits of shelter that we could you know 15,000 years ago 20,000 years ago I love the convenience of my iPhone oh my God I would get lost going to anywhere in town I guess I'm kind of of the belief system that there it's less yes you can be a slave of certain things on your phone and the maybe the phone itself and in some lights but it's more than anything an extension of your brain at this point exactly so it's keep it keep it healthy guys keep it healthy you're spending an hour on Tik Tok maybe put the phone down yeah yeah you just struck a cord it's the movie forgets that people have free will and you don't have to go all in on it's not all or nothing it's not an All or Nothing situation although the internet will have you believe otherwise but we see people go from I I guess hating their lives to rediscovering what it is to be alive mhm and it's just again it just makes me think that it's making fun of you know extremists in a variey ways you said it if this guy made a lot of other movies like this then yeah we could follow that we could agree with that and it might be a better movie if that was the thought behind it but I don't think it is either yeah I don't know and I mean he's not you know he doesn't have to make over serious movies all the time you know Steven Spielberg made draws and Schindler's List but he also but he also made BFG in [ __ ] in Indiana Jones God damn that the worst movie ever made I tell you what talk about putting me to sleep yeah Indiana J sucks oh my God and there's some humor I guess in Aliens 3 okay it's there's some there's a t of funny there but I don't think I watched that that did I I think I only watch the first two I think the first two yeah so I don't know it's just I'm I'm such I'm I'm just so stuck on on that thought and I I got to flush that out I guess I need to read some thoughts on it to help me yeah it help you it won't make me like the movie more but it will place it a little better in my mind okay because this movie is not the only thing I think that's really exceptional about this movie is some of the dialogue mhm but that's not that's not what makes a movie you know the the performances are good but they're not they're not Leo being mentally challenged yeah they're not uh brenen Frasier in the whale or anything you know the the delivery is just not on the proper level it's on a fine great level but it's just this movie is this movie is just not for me I mean it's just it is definitely how it is I think it is what it is it's not for us yeah which I guess I feel like on paper this movie should be for me but in execution it definitely is not because you're a male with modern masculinity problems slash consumer I'm a relatively thoughtful person who likes thoughtful movies oh gotcha but maybe that's so maybe that I don't know maybe that's not that's the problem that's the problem maybe that's the problem yeah exactly another thing I wanted to bring up was what was the point of Mara to help us get the reveal um yes as far as film making goes yeah I think the point of Marlo was to help you know build the picture of rejecting women and and that this particular woman helped unlock the just right amount of repulsion for our main character to discover his homosexuality wow yeah cuz Tyler emerges right after she starts taking over his you know support group thing he's got going on yeah she was in she was in the movie way too much for that to be the only point I will say almost every time she was in it maybe every time time there was this like in retrospect at least or for you but while I was watching it cuz I already knew that he was Tyler I could see that she she was just kind of there for the confusion of but you know what are you talking about constantly like why are you saying the things you're saying yeah but it was too much it was a lot yeah it was it was more than setup and it it kind of got away from her her being the Catalyst for you know coming out of the closet there is something else to her but I'm not sure what it is and then I guess the end would imply that he was wrong about his sexuality is kind of just a phase oh yeah cuz they're holding hands watching all the explosions I probably would have liked it better if he died I think he does die I think that I think there oh I guess it's that for interpretation but I think the bombs were in that building too okay so so he will die he more than likely was about to die yeah and she was too okay okay and all the guys who were going to get medical supplies that was funny at the end there they like are you okay do you need you need help right now it's like no I'm good I did like some of the a lot of the nitty-gritty production of it all with all the guys working and stuff in the house and like there's just a lot of moving parts and it's really fun to see that on camera cuz I know how hard that is to control and to you know make that happen it's it's really cool seeing that but and I like the I guess the the factory nature of what they've got going the their operation it's it's fun the extreme extreme it's like they're terrorists but and they're making soap and just and they're spreading their idea theology it's F you know it's spreading faster than you know the main character can even keep up with because you know we find out that he's going days in day out as Tyler right yeah which I don't know maybe it would have been a little funner if Tyler kind of displaced the main character and we were just like what happened to him and then you can you can kind of it Le it's left up for interpretation that the main character was or should say that the narrator was a figment of Tyler's imagination or that he Tyler kills him or something like it just kind of disappears at one point in in the movie M and then Tyler was just left that would I don't know how do I I don't know about that I think about that but kind of just replacing him towards the last 25 minutes I think I would have liked that better but I guess him finding because you know he finds out he's Tyler by trying to find Tyler so something would have had to be changed there but the reveal was kind of weird not very good because it was exactly he's trying to find Tyler and he finds he like in that process he comes to terms with that he is Tyler and it's just it's not very smooth yeah it's it's not slick or anything it's it's a little I don't know it's I don't not not completely sold on the execution of that yeah was I was confused really on how he found out just because some guy caught him Tyler accidentally or something yeah it wasn't it wasn't smooth but like I said earlier I did like how dirty this movie is I did like the bruises the blood all that um nasty stuff like the fat falling out of the bag when they ripped it that was pretty cool I enjoyed that yeah it yeah it definitely the violence and everything was it was very cool it very well done it was surprisingly well done actually I'm surprised this I'm surprised people don't look back at this movie as have being more influential than [ __ ] Matrix this movie is like as far as like action goes way cooler than the Matrix I don't know why Matrix is looked at as some kind of seminal piece at least I stayed awake kind of yeah Matrix St a chance nope no way Matrix is so bad and I did like some of the I know you talk I know you said briefly that it had a lot of you know of the 9s film making techniques here but I did like some of the uh kind of commercial looking shots especially the one in the trash can that was pretty cool I liked it the one in the trash can yeah they did one I think it I think it was the trash can or like the Starbucks cup or something they had several they did several throughout like the close-ups the extreme close-ups of the zoom in and like you would zoom in and kind of ride with the trash if I saw it I'd know it probably yeah if you saw it you'd know which one what I'm talking about but that was very I mean yeah it was very 90s but I liked it yeah the the close-ups on like little things like I remember I guess I the last one I remember in the final parts of the movie was when the narrator was trying to undo the bomb and it was like the camera was moving throughout the bomb and stuff I'm just like it was it was scene like that but with a trash can in the beginning okay okay okay okay yeah there were a few of those and those those are so stupid I know I like the trashing on I'm telling you those are so funny they feel like I don't know they feel like you're at an amusement park that's how I feel H like how a you know 3D ride would make you feel at Universal or or Disney like those uh I don't know what you call them motion rides where you just sit on a thing and there's a screen around you and it moves you well I guess the ride moves you but the screen moves you so you think you're in a ride yeah yeah yeah like that that's what it made me feel like the faux roller coasters yeah faux roller coaster yeah that was probably the funniest part of the movie when the sack of human fat got torn open and poured on one of the characters that was cool yeah I don't know about funny but it was definitely cool yeah I don't know if I have a favorite a favorite part a favorite scene yeah mine was definitely just the a meeting style things that the beginning part there was was fun and that was the best part yeah yeah other than that I'm just like ah I want to like it more but it's just it's just not going to happen not going to happen I'm just a little I guess I'm a little frustrated with why is this such a studied film over some others maybe it was just a time and place kind of thing 1999 maybe with Jen Z I mean with um with Gen X and the kind of come to Jesus moment of kind of post structuralism yeah like that little speech he gave in while they were under in their little fight club how he said that they they're men of I don't know what he called them men of something and you know they weren't part of a great big war and I'm butchering butchering it all up but you know what I'm talking about they didn't have a great War they didn't have a Great Depression yeah we're going through spiritual war and our lives are depressive depressing that one that speech the depression is our lives maybe we're all you used to the depression now there might there is absolutely something to be said about that for sure we're we're all friends with our anxiety or by we I mean us you know late Millennials younger than 50 well I I I was talking about late Millennials and maybe 30 or younger you're you're you're best friends with your uh depression and your anxiety but people before us older than us have a real hard time with with that whatever I'm trying to say it's a very David Foster wallow thing man I and he's the Kingpin in all this for sure yeah so maybe we need a Gen X I mean a 30 35 Plus year old person to write in and tell us tell us how they feel about this movie I don't know how old they would have been in 1999 yeah The Sweet Spot probably would have been the 20 year olds 20 plus year olds at the time so they' be about 40 or so all right 40y old plus tell us what you thought about this movie cuz we're confused sort of I'm confused he's not confused apparently now I'm just kidding but I'm confused explain it to me all right man do you have a budget guess I do and and this one was hard too they're all hard I feel like I say that about all of them and I was going to look up The Matrix budget but I didn't want to look up The Matrix budget in case we ever cover the Matrix so I didn't want to spoil it for myself so I didn't look it up and I went completely blind and I went 20 million counting for inflation inflation 20 million counting for inflation yeah okay that doesn't sound right I'll let you regas if you want no go ahead I have no idea what I would regu it says here that it was 65 oh 63 to 65 million so you're way off you're quite a bit off it went on at the box office it went on to make 101 million wow so after renting and everything yeah that movie's gone on to make quite a bit of money probably that's good cuz I wonder I guess I'm kind of curious in 1999 late 1999 when it came out was it a big hit or did it take some time 100 million that's I mean it see sounds like they you know that's a mild hit a good hit or a bad hit a mild hit I I Brad Pit is one of those really expensive guys 1999 though 1998 when they paid him I'm not I'm not sure because I could see him being like a $30 million billing that be that's half of their budget so that would end up you know they' have to make a lot of money to recoup that but I'm not yeah I'm not sure yeah cool I just want to ask why is this not on Disney plus you know what I'm saying why would this be on Disney plus the fox property Simpsons is on Disney plus where is Fight Club yeah they don't want to expose children to this violence and they put it under the ma uh you know rating and you know how children you have to make an account for mature content like that yeah I think yeah yeah you do so they can just do that right I don't know thought that was kind of funny yeah man thank you for watching this film and talking about it with me you I I don't really know if we straighten anything out for me it's I think it's just going to take some time with this and I it's just not it doesn't speak to me enough in the right ways for me to you know kind of place it on that in that top Echelon of movies that kind of live rent free in your mind you know it's not it's it's not there in a week this is probably going to be forgotten forever so yeah yeah it's already been forgotten for me but you're welcome thank you for uh trying to keep me cultured yeah yeah you know it's an important film no doubt to the landscape of you know film history I'm glad we finally got to this you know we we've had 23 years and we we're here we we did it we remember every Monday Wednesday and Friday you can catch new episodes of the film Steins go over to our patreon drop by give us a dollar write a comment just say something vulgar I don't even care you know anything at this point I care leave nice reviews on Google podcast and apple podcast and YouTube though so I'd appreciate that well maybe they can leave nice reviews for me and be vulgar towards you what if that was what if they said that's a nice [ __ ] podcast that's kind of vulgar and nice oh okay yeah yeah yeah all right all right I guess that could work but until next time take care bye-bye bye-bye and that's a wrap for today's episode of the filstein thanks for tuning in and joining us on our cinematic Journey we hope you enjoyed our discussion and gain some new insights and perspectives on the world of movies don't forget to subscribe to our podcast on your favorite platform especially patreon at patreon.com filstein and follow us on social media for More film related content we love hearing from our listeners so if you have any feedback suggestions movie recommendations or book recommendations please feel free to reach out to us until next time keep watching keep loving the magic of movies this is the filstein signing off don't drop the soap [Music]