we already had this conversation once in the cycle because we had actually the first presidential debate in June but how much might we expect these kinds of Affairs to shape the election well we've already had maybe the most consequential presidential debate in history probably I guess you'd have to say so right um so obviously it'd be pretty pretty silly to say that debates can't matter or don't matter um our colleague y Morris did crunch the numbers before that first debate found that generally speaking the polls move by an average of two points uh historically over or after the debate um so you know they're the kind of thing that can make a difference but on the margin which is kind of the same old song right um but yeah I think kind of to the point of what we were talking about earlier like this is KLA Harris's first debate again Donald Trump has done lots of these he did them in 2020 he did them in 2016 we saw him well she had a VP debate of course um oh that's a good point that's fair um yes that that is I think well that is a good point but also people will be viewing her with different eyes in this debate um the pressure will be on it is the kind of thing that could change perceptions of her at this kind of malleable time for her um and I think expectations will also be higher for her than they were for Biden um which doesn't help her so yes that is it is basically it is exactly the kind of thing that could kind of quote unquote stop stop her momentum gilen uh but uh but it's also the kind of thing that she could use as a springboard or could not make a difference because sometimes that happens too scan this QR code to go to the apple and Spotify podcast apps to download the full 538 politics podcast